Conversation No. 50-9

Date: March 23, 1971
Time: 8:03 am - 9:55 am
Location: Cabinet Room

The President met with Vice President Spiro T. Agnew, John A. Volpe, John B. Connally, Hugh
Scott, Robert P. Griffin, Margaret Chase Smith, Norris Cotton, Gordon L. Allott, Peter H.
Dominick, Gerald R. Ford, Leslie C. Arends, John B. Anderson, Robert T. Stafford, Richard H.
Poff, John J. Rhodes, Barber B. Conable, Jr., Robert C. (“Bob”) Wilson, H. Allen Smith, Robert
J. Dole, George P. Shultz, Arnold R. Weber, John D. Ehrlichman, Clark MacGregor, William E.
Timmons, Kenneth E. BeLieu, Herbert G. Klein, Patrick J. Buchanan, Harry S. Dent, Ronald L.
Ziegler, Andy Rouse, and Bryce N. Harlow
[Recording begins while the conversation is in progress]

     Supersonic Transport [SST]
          -Need for support for President’s transportation programs
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-Environmental concerns
      -Sonic boom
      -Flight patterns
      -Engine noise
            -A film from Illinois
            -Reduction
                  -Compared with sub-sonic planes
            -Leo L. Beranek [?] committee
                  -National Aeronautics and Space Administration [NASA]
      -Climate and health hazards
            -Volpe’s previous conversation with freshman Congressmen
            -William M. Magruder’s appearance on “Dick Cavett Show”
            -Soviet Union
            -Research program
            -NASA, National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration [NOAA],
                  National Science Foundation
            -Possible cancers
                  -President’s and Volpe’s concerns
-Federal Aviation Administration
      -Certification
-US technology
-Funding
-Comments by head of El Air Airlines
      -French Concorde
      -SST
-International considerations
      -British and French
-Testing
-Funding
      -British, French, Soviets
-Landing rights
-Possible delay
      -Soviet SSTs at upcoming Paris Air Show
            -Advertisement
      -Effects
-Possible cancellation
      -Effects
            -Termination costs
-Costs
-Need
-Employment potential
-Possible cancellation
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      -Effects
            -Unemployment
                  -Costs
            -Confidence
                  -Effects on President’s reelection
-Volpe’s efforts
-French and British competition
-Technology
      -DC-3
      -Emissions
-Need for support
-Decibel levels
-Priority
      -Compared with urban mass transit
-Need for support
      -Senate
            -Scott
      -House
            -Republicans
-Environmental concerns
      -Senator James L. Buckley
      -Industrial technology
      -Skin cancers
-Economic considerations
      -DC-3s, DC-6s, jets
      -Foreign competition
            -British, French, German, Russian
      -Council of Economic Advisors’ report
      -Science Advisory Committee Report
-Priorities
      -Welfare, hunger, mass transit, urban problems
            -Food stamps
                  -President’s record
                                              17

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           Burma

[To listen to the segment (54s) declassified on 02/28/2002, please refer to RC# E-511.]

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     SST
           -Priorities
                 -Cost considerations
                       -Sources of revenue
                       -Defense budget
                       -Need for industrial progress
                       -Effect on tax revenues
                             -Use
           -Environmental considerations
           -Economic considerations
                 -Priorities
                       -Poverty
           -Upcoming Senate and House votes
                 -Public opinion
                       -Wright Brothers, jets, DC-3
           -Foreign competition
                 -Japanese electronics
           -Technological spin-offs
                 -Computers
                       -Space program
           -Domestic priorities
                 -Compared with space program
                 -Historical precedents
           -Need for support
                 -US leadership
                       -Compared with Christopher Columbus
                             -King Ferdinand V and Queen Isabella I
                       -Compared with early days of the automobile
                             -New York Times

     Government reorganization
         -Ash Council
              -Connally’s work
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     -Effect on Cabinet
-Connally’s presentation
     -Length
-Ash Council
     -History
     -Membership
          -Roy L. Ash, president of Litton Industries
          -Frederick R. Kappel, American Telephone and Telegraph [AT&T]
          -Dr. George P. Baker
                -Dean of Harvard Business School
          -Richard M. Paget
                -McCormick, Richardson, and Paget
          -Walter N. Thayer
                -Lawyer, publisher of New York Herald-Tribune
          -Connally
     -Purpose
     -Operation
     -Study of other reorganization reports
          -Herbert C. Hoover
          -Price
          -Highlands
          -Rockefeller
          -Comparison
     -Proposals
          -Office of the President
                -Relations with Congress
                -Office of Management and Budget [OMB]
                -Domestic Council
     -Assumptions
          -Cost of government
                -President’s television appearance with Howard K. Smith
          -Effectiveness of government
          -Popular opinion of government
                -Smith
          -Need for reorganization
                -Period of change
                -Popular opinion
          -Purpose
          -Overlapping jurisdictions
                -Mayors, governors
                -Regional headquarters
     -Proposals
                                  19

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            -Functional divisions
            -Presentation to President
            -Presentation to Congress
      -Congressional concerns
            -Committees
            -Extension Service
      -Purpose
-Compared with SST issue, economic issues
-Need
      -Public opinion
      -Lines of responsibility
-Office of the President
      -Needs
            -Benjamin Disraeli
            -Delegation of authority
      -Effectiveness
            -Congressional policies
-Importance
      -Revenue sharing
-Connally’s position
-President’s position
-OMB
      -Purpose
-Departmental reorganization
      -Human resources
      -Community development
      -Economic affairs
      -Natural resources
      -State, Treasury, Defense, and Justice Departments
      -Core departments
            -Natural resources
                  -Interior, Agriculture Departments, Atomic Energy Commission
                        [AEC]
            -Human resources
                  -Department of Health, Education, and Welfare [HEW]
                  -Labor Department functions
                  -Agriculture Department functions
            -Community development
                  -Department of Housing and Urban Development [HUD]
                  -Office of Economic Opportunity [OEO], Agriculture Department,
                        Community Action Agencies
            -Economic affairs
                              20

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           -Compared with Gulf and Western
           -Commerce Department
           -NOAA
           -Labor Department
           -Agriculture Department
-OEO
-Budgets
      -Natural resources
      -Economic affairs
      -Community development
      -Human resources
            -Social Security
-Staffs
      -Natural resources
      -Economic affairs
            -Coast Guard
            -Transportation units
      -Community development
      -Human resources
-Human resources
      -Secretaries of Agriculture and HEW
      -Division of labor
-Community development
      -Urban and rural
      -Transportation
      -Housing
            -HUD
      -Federal insurance
      -Highway program
            -Kansas City, Los Angeles, I-66
      -Staff support
-Natural resources
      -Staff support
      -Land and recreation
      -Water
      -Minerals
      -AEC
            -Glenn T. Seaborg
      -Oceanic, atmospheric and earth services
            -NOAA
            -Bureau of Indian Affairs
                 -Consultation
                                               21

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                 -Economic affairs
                      -Commerce, Agriculture, and Labor Departments
                      -Small Business Administration [SBA]
                      -Economic Development Administration [EDA]
                      -Agriculture Department programs
                      -Department of Labor programs
                      -Transportation
                      -International economic developments
                      -Food programs
                            -Division
                 -Human resources
                 -Economic affairs

[A transcript of the following portion of the conversation was prepared under court order for
Special Access [SA] 65, Pauline W. Kitts, et al. v. General Motors Corporation, Civil Action
No. 85-967 JC. The National Archives and Records Administration produced this transcript.
The National Archives does not guarantee its accuracy.]

[End of transcript]

                      -US farmers
                           -Business Council meeting
                           -Productivity
                           -President’s trip to Des Moines
                           -Productivity
                           -”Salute to Agriculture” day
                           -Effect of departmental reorganization
                           -Effect of current programs
                           -Special briefing for Congress
                           -Peter G. Peterson, Allott, Ford
                           -Productivity
                           -Des Moines, Chicago appearances of the President
                           -President’s upcoming meeting with leaders of the dairy industry
                           -German, British, and French productivity
                           -Relation to other domestic problems
                           -Requirements

     Arends’ anniversary as congressman

     Government reorganization
         -Departmental reorganization
              -Human resources
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                -Health, human development, and income security
                -Comments of reporters
                -Program coordination
                      -Social Services, Manpower, Work Incentive programs
                      -New York City Whip Inflation Now [WIN] program
                      -Martin’s Ferry, Ohio
                -Elliot L. Richardson
                      -Proposed field officials
     -Management system
          -Appointments
          -Budgets
          -Delegation of authority
     -A news briefing
          -Weber and Donald H. Rumsfeld
          -Effect on news bureaus
     -Charts
     -Publicity

Ranches in California, Texas

Government reorganization
    -Charts
    -Department of Interior
    -Departmental structure and titles
         -Ash
         -Level III
         -Administrator
         -Undersecretary
         -Assistant Secretary
               -Level IV or III
               -NASA
         -Administrator
    -Army Corps of Engineers
         -Natural resources
               -Other water and soil projects
    -Volunteer agencies
         -President’s speech at the University of Nebraska
         -Peace Corps, OEO
         -Departmental name
         -Volunteers in Service to America [VISTA], Foster Grandparents, Retired
               Seniors Volunteer Program, student volunteer program, retired executives,
               SBA executives
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                 -Peace Corps
                       -Secretary of State
                 -Teacher Corps
                 -Purpose
                 -Budget
                 -Emphasis
                 -Effect on management
                 -Local initiative
                 -Peace Corps
                 -Business programs
                 -Status
                 -Edwin D. Etherington
                 -Purpose
           -Announcement
                 -Legislation
                 -Reports
           -Congressional study
                 -Committees
                 -Timmons, MacGregor
                 -Government Operations Committee
                 -Compared with revenue sharing
           -OMB work
           -President’s position
                 -Governmental growth
                       -Des Moines
                       -Need
                       -Ash Council, OMB

     [General conversation/Unintelligible]

The President, et al. left at 9:55 am