Conversation No. 472-13

Date: March 23, 1971
Time: 1:10 pm - 2:12 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman

     President’s schedule
          -Meeting with Haldeman and Henry A. Kissinger
                -John A. Scali
          -Meeting with editors
          -James L. Buckley

     Supersonic Transport (SST)
          -Upcoming vote
               -William E. Timmons
                     -Tally
               -President’s previous meeting with Republican leaders
               -Margaret Chase Smith
               -President’s arguments

Kissinger entered at an unknown time after 1:10 pm

                  -House and Senate members
                       -Concerns about re-election
                  -Winston L. (“Win”) Prouty
                       -White House support
                             -President’s role
                       -Position

     Howard K. Smith
         -Comment
         -President’s interview

     Scali
             -Possible appointment
             -Kissinger’s previous meeting with Scali
             -Possible meeting with the President
             -A check
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     -Areas of responsibility
          -Domestic, foreign issues, and television
                -Scope
                -Government reorganization
                -Revenue sharing
                -Blacks
                -Riots in city
                -Agriculture                                  Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)
                -Economy
                     -Role
     -Previous conversation with Kissinger
     -Knowledge of State and Defense Departments
          -Leaks

President’s schedule
     -Possible meeting in California
           -Ellsworth F. Bunker
           -Foreign policy
     -Press
     -A poll
           -Delay
                 -Reasoning

President’s interview with H. K. Smith
     -Telephone poll by White House
     -New York overnight ratings
           -Competition
                 -National Broadcasting Company [NBC] movie
                 -Doris Day
                 -Carol Burnett
           -Possible national audience
     -West Coast showing
           -Timing
     -Telephone poll by White House
           -Rating compared with share
           -Haldeman’s view
     -Advertisements, March 22, 1971
     -Benefits for American Broadcasting Company [ABC]
     -Ratings
           -John F. Kennedy interview
           -Meaning
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-Telephone poll by White House
     -Approval ratings
     -Questions and answers
     -Age distribution
     -Political affiliation
     -Further calls
     -Questions
     -Importance                                          Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)
-Congressional response
     -Mark O. Hatfield
           -President’s credibility
           -College students
     -Robert A. Taft, Jr.
           -Length
     -William E. Brock, III
           -Length
           -President’s demeanor
           -Southeast Asia
-Blacks’ response
     -Robert J. Brown’s poll
     -National Insurance Association head
           -Comments on housing
     -National Bar Association head
           -Vietnam
           -Cities
     -Maurice Dawkins of Opportunities Centers
           -Integration
                 -Housing
     -National Business League president
           -Housing
           -President’s appearance
     -Robert Walker [?], head of National Medical Association
           -Domestic policy
           -Revenue sharing
           -Open housing
                 -Integration
     -A judge [[Forename unknown] Newman?]
           -Equal opportunity
           -Higher education
           -Housing
           -Peace
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     -Judge William B. Thompson of Washington, DC Superior Court
            -Housing
            -President’s handling of questions
     -Importance
     -Bob Flanigan’s [?] response
            -Vietnam
-Vic Morris’s [?] response
-George’s [Surname unintelligible] response              Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)
     -President’s demeanor
     -President’s credibility
     -Senate Foreign Relations Committee
            -J. William Fulbright
-John B. Anderson’s [?] response
-George Will’s response
     -President’s credibility
-Richard A. Moore’s response
     -Laos
     -Format
            -Compared with “fireside chats”
     -President’s interaction with H. K. Smith
     -Questioning
     -President’s personality
     -Jane G. (Swift) Moore’s response
            -Vice-Presidential question
     -Camera angle
            -William H. Carruthers
            -ABC
-Carruthers
     -Preparation for interview
     -Head of Paramount Television’s conversation with Kissinger
     -Response
            -Camera angles
            -Work with ABC crew
            -President’s appearance
-Mark I. Goode’s response
     -Camera angles
     -Lighting
-Future interviews
-R. A. Moore’s response
     -President’s credibility
-Future interviews
     -Possible interviewer
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      -Educational television
            -Audience size
      -Metromedia
            -Audience size
-Congressional response
      -Hatfield
      -Brock
      -Hugh Scott and Robert P. Griffin               Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)
      -Hatfield
            -Position on Vietnam
      -Brock
-President’s demeanor
-Kissinger’s response
-Format
      -Telephone poll
-Viewers
      -Ages
            -Approval ratings
-Clifford M. Hardin’s response
      -Format, issues covered
-James D. Hodgson’s response
      -Length
      -People’s demeanor
      -Issues covered
            -Hardin
            -Cabinet officers’ responsibilities
-John A. Volpe’s response
      -President’s schedule
      -President’s answers to questions
-Congressional response
      -Hatfield
      -Taft
      -Brock
      -Taft
      -Republicans
-Donald H. Rumsfeld’s response
      -Questions
            -President’s performance
      -Pace
            -H. K. Smith
            -President’s performance
-John D. Ehrlichman’s response
                                         34

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Congress
    -Support for Administration
          -President’s view
          -Haldeman’s view
    -Attitudes of members toward President
    -Southern Democrats
          -John C. Stennis
    -Republicans                                            Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)
          -Role

President’s interview with H. K. Smith
     -Future interviews with other networks
           -Audience
           -ABC’s audience
     -Competition
           -Movies
     -Public opinion
           -News coverage
           -Laos
     -Future interviews
           -Use of networks
           -Audience
     -Forthcoming statement on troop withdrawals
           -Reiteration of President’s comments
           -Rowland Evans
                 -Previous breakfast with Kissinger
                 -Articles on Laos

President’s schedule
     -Possible March 24, 1971 breakfast with George Meany
           -Charles W. Colson, George P. Shultz
           -Publicity
           -Laos
           -Asia
           -Middle East
           -North Atlantic Treaty Organization [NATO]
           -Economy
           -Kissinger, Shultz
           -Colson
           -Timing
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          -Possible meeting with executive council [of American Federation of Labor-Congress
               of Industrial Organizations [AFL-CIO]?]
               -President’s view

     Meany
         -Support for SST
              -Possible call from Hodgson
              -Possible breakfast with President                    Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)

     President’s schedule
          -Breakfast with Meany
                -Shultz, Kissinger, and Hodgson’s attendance
                -Publicity
                -Hodgson
                -Shultz
                -Topic

     H. K. Smith interview
          -Position of H. K. Smith
                -Selection for interview with President
          -ABC advertisements
          -Ratings
                -Effect
                -ABC
          -Format
          -Length
                -Haldeman’s view
          -Congressional response

     Congress
         -Support for the President’s policies
              -President’s view
              -Revenue sharing
              -Laos
              -President’s television appearances
         -Republicans

     President’s schedule
          -Quadriad meeting in California
          -Another meeting in California

An unknown person entered at an unknown time after 1:10 pm
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     Federal Communication Commission [FCC]
          -Letter from Leslie C. Arends

     The President’s schedule

     FCC
           -Letter from Arends
                 -Peter M. Flanigan                                Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)

The unknown person left at an unknown time before 2:12 pm

     Kissinger’s briefing
          -Gerald R. Ford, Arends and Anderson

     Melvin R. Laird’s schedule
         -A 3:00 meeting
               -Democrats and Republicans

     Kissinger’s briefing
          -Time

     Vietnam
          -A possible meeting in California with General Nguyen Van Thieu
               -Kissinger’s view
                     -Rationale
               -Implications
                     -President’s view

     President’s interview with H. K. Smith
          -President’s comments on Laotian operation (Lam Son)
          -Coverage
                -John W. Chancellor
                -Columbia Broadcasting System [CBS] radio
                -News lead
          -President’s statement on troop levels
                -Call to Kissinger by Laird
          -President’s visibility

     President’s schedule
          -California trip
                -Presentation of Medal of Freedom to Samuel Goldwyn
                      -Goldwyn’s health
                                        37

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                -Effect on movie community
                -Goldwyn
                     -Career with Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer

Vietnam
     -Laos operation (Lam Son)
          -Morning report
          -Forthcoming Washington Special Action Group [WSAG]   Conv.
                                                                   meeting
                                                                      No. 472-13 (cont.)
          -Military situation
                -Army of the Republic of Vietnam [ARVN] withdrawal
                      -Press coverage
          -Casualties
                -President’s statement in H. K. Smith interview
                      -Commentators’ response
                      -Chancellor
          -Military situation
                -Kissinger’s view
                -US role
                -South Vietnamese performance
                -Bunker
                -General Creighton W. Abrams, Jr.
                -Kissinger’s role
                -General Alexander M. Haig, Jr.
                -Laird
                -Abrams
                      -Visits to family in Thailand
                -General William C. Westmoreland’s advice
                      -Military strategy
                -Tchepone
                -Abrams
                      -Role
                            -Kissinger’s view
                -South Vietnamese performance
                -A cable
                      -Strategy
                            -Problems
                            -Kissinger’s view
                -Tchepone
                -Admiral Thomas H. Moorer
     -US military command
          -Haig’s view
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     -Kissinger’s view
          -Replacements
     -Abrams
          -Performance
          -Role in air strikes
          -Information
          -Strategy
                -Political effects                       Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)
-Laos operation
     -Kissinger’s view
     -Effects on President
          -Kissinger, Bunker
     -Tchepone
     -South Vietnamese performance
          -Kissinger’s view
          -Withdrawal
          -Photographs
                -President’s comments
          -President’s interview with H. K. Smith
                -Coverage of US, North Vietnamese forces
                      -Distortion
          -Kissinger’s view
                -People’s Republic of China [PRC]
                -ARVN troops
                      -Fear of invasion
                -Casualties
                -Air strikes
     -Effect on North Vietnam
     -Abrams’s plans
     -US troop withdrawal
          -Thieu
          -Bunker
     -Us Air Force
     -North Vietnam’s situation
          -Possibility of an offensive
-US troop withdrawals
     -Level
          -Military
          -Thieu
          -President
     -Bunker, Thieu
          -Announcement
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          -Defense Department
          -William P. Rogers
          -Laird
                -Timing
                -Kissinger
          -Level
          -Timing
     -South Vietnam                                       Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)
          -Election
          -Nguyen Cao Ky
                -Bunker
                -Networks
          -Military equipment
                -Laird
          -Economic aid
     -US troop withdrawals
     -Negotiations
          -Bunker
          -North Vietnam
          -Timing
     -Laos operation (Lam Son)
          -Enemy casualties

Anatoliy F. Dobrynin
     -Politburo
           -Soviet policy on Vietnam
                -Domestic considerations
     -Strategic Arms Limitations Talks [SALT]
     -Vietnam negotiations [?]
           -Timing
                -Effect of Party Congress’ meeting

Vietnam
     -Enemy forces
          -Intelligence information
     -US command
          -Need for coordination
          -President’s view
     -Laos operation (Lam Son)
          -Enemy forces
          -After-action assessment
                -Strategy
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                -Effect
          -Possible time limit
                -President’s comments
                -Effect
                -Congress
          -Enemy forces
                -Intelligence information
          -President’s decision                            Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)
          -Strategy
                -Moorer
          -US forces
                -Role
          -Kissinger’s assessment
          -Polls
          -Justification for operation
                -US troops
                       -I Corps
                -Possible North Vietnamese Army invasion
                       -Tanks
                       -Material
                       -Hue
                       -Timing
                       -Enemy supplies
          -Bunker
     -South Vietnam
          -Political situation
     -Forthcoming call to Bunker
     -Laos operation
          -Effect
                -ARVN and South Vietnam
                -US newspapers and television
                -Junior officers

President’s interview with H. K. Smith
     -Evaluation
           -Brock, Hodgson, Hardin, Hatfield
                 -Length
                 -Content
                 -Differences of opinion
                 -Hatfield and George S. McGovern
                 -Taft
     -President’s demeanor
                                          41

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Liberals

1970 election
     -Economy
           -Stock market
                 -Effect
           -Burns and the money supply
           -Stock market                                  Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)
                 -Effect
           -Interest rates

Liberals
     -Kissinger’s efforts

President
     -Leadership
     -Joseph W. Alsop
          -Call to President, Kissinger
          -”The Establishment”
          -President’s policies
          -Column, March 22, 1971

President’s interview with H. K. Smith
     -Cambodia
           -PRC
           -New York Times
           -Hatfield
           -Taft

Vietnam
     -Laos operation
          -Effect compared with Cambodian operation
                -Enemy supplies
                -North Vietnamese forces
          -President’s credibility
          -President’s critics
          -Compared with Cambodian operation
                -Public opinion
                     -Effect
          -Hue, Da Nang
          -Thieu
                                              42

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                -Possible effect on peace negotiations
                     -North Vietnamese

     Martha (Beall) Mitchell
          -Previous call to Kissinger

Haldeman and Kissinger left at 2:12 pm
                                                                 Conv. No. 472-13 (cont.)