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Conversation: 478-002

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Start Date: 13-Apr-1971 9:30 AM

End Date: 13-Apr-1971 11:13 AM

Participants:

Nixon, Richard M. (President)Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob")White House operatorLincoln, George A. (Gen.)Kissinger, Henry A.Peterson, Peter G.Ziegler, Ronald L.Lodge, Emily (Sears)McCracken, Paul W.Bull, Stephen B.White House photographer

Recording Device: Oval Office

Full Tape Conversation Start Time: 00:06:03

Full Tape Conversation End Time: 01:47:41

478-002.mp3

NARA Description:

On April 13, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, White House operator, Gen. George A. Lincoln, Henry A. Kissinger, Peter G. Peterson, Ronald L. Ziegler, Emily (Sears) Lodge, Paul W. McCracken, Stephen B. Bull, and White House photographer met in the Oval Office of the White House from 9:30 am to 11:13 am. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 478-002 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid:

Conversation No. 478-2

Date: April 13, 1971
Time: 9:30 am - 11:13 am
Location: Oval Office

The President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman
                                          2

                     NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                 Tape Subject Log
                                    (rev. 9/08)



Cabinet
     -Structure of meetings
           -Structured and non-structured
                 -William P. Rogers
                 -Comparison
                 -Agenda
                       -Congress
           -Staff                                                  Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
           -John B. Connally
           -John A. Volpe
           -George W. Romney
           -Maurice H. Stans
           -Winton M. (“Red”) Blount
           -Rogers C. B. Morton
           -Subjects
           -Questions
           -Structured meeting
           -Subjects
           -Volpe
           -Cabinet officers
                 -Purpose
           -Stans
                 -Problems of business
     -Commerce Department
     -Transportation Department
     -Stans
           -Commerce Department
                 -Minority Enterprise office
                 -Business community
                 -Census Bureau
     -Agriculture Department
           -Programs

Media
    -Leonard Garment’s appearance on “Today Show”
         -News summary
              -President’s notation
         -Evaluation

Cabinet meeting [on civilian uses of nuclear energy], April 13, 1971
     -Participants
           -Howard H. Baker, Jr.
                                              3

                            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                      Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. 9/08)



                -Chet Holifield
                -John O. Pastore
                -John B. Anderson
                -Compared to Cabinet
                -National exposure
                -Need for assertiveness
                -Romney and Volpe
                                                                     Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
     Governors
         -Evaluation
         -Richard B. Ogilvie and Volpe
         -Ronald W. Reagan and Nelson A. Rockefeller

     News item
         -Vance Hartke
               -Contributions from business
                     -Trucking industry
               -Follow-up

     President’s schedule
          -James E. Bassett
                -Possible meeting with the President
                -Rose Mary Woods
                -Book
                -Previous meeting with the President

[The President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 9:30 am and
9:36 am]

[Conversation No. 478-2A]

[See Conversation No. 1-73]

[End of telephone conversation]

[The President talked with General George A. Lincoln between 9:36 am and 9:40 am]

[Conversation No. 478-2B]

[See Conversation No. 1-74]

[End of telephone conversation]
                                       4

                      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                               Tape Subject Log
                                  (rev. 9/08)




Texas disaster
     -Crop
     -Governor
     -Connally
     -John G. Tower

Economy                                                        Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
    -Stock market
          -Advance from November 5, 1968 to January 20, 1969
          -Shares traded since low
          -Trading, April 12, 1971
          -Financial writers
          -Arthur F. Burns
          -Confidence
          -Increase
          -Bull market
          -Need for publicity
                -Periscope
                -[Charles W. Colson’s efforts?]
          -Wall Street Journal
          -Advance
          -Bernard J. (“Bunny”) Lasker
          -Possible dinner for financial writers
    -President’s forthcoming Chamber of Commerce speech, April 26, 1971
          -William L. Safire
          -Anniversary of message about National Invest-in-America Week, April 27,
                1970
          -Length
          -Subjects
                -First quarter figures
                -Consumer confidence
                -Current state of economy
                      -Inflation and unemployment
                      -Caution
                            -Waste and responsibility
                -Body of speech
                      -Technology
                      -Productivity
                      -Paul W. McCracken
                            -Five-point program
                                  -Technology, unemployment
                                           5

                        NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                    Tape Subject Log
                                       (rev. 9/08)



                   -Peroration
                         -Businessmen
                         -Consumer
                         -President’s philosophy
                               -Location of power
                                    -Foreign policy
                                    -Economic policy
                                          -Revenue sharing        Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
             -Thrust
             -System
             -National Association of Manufacturers [NAM]
             -Theme
             -Length
             -System
             -President’s meeting with American Society of Newspaper Editors [ASNE],
                   April 16, 1971

Administration
    -Attitude
          -Negativism
    -Congress
          -Report by William E. Timmons and Clark MacGregor
               -91st Congress
          -Administration’s record
          -Circumstances
          -Possible story
          -Richard A. Moore
    -Safire

Press
        -Possible administration stories
              -Stock market
        -Thomas E. Dewey
        -J. Edgar Hoover

Staff
        -Need for confidence in economy
        -Stans
        -Connally
        -Compared to Congressmen and Senators
        -Volpe
        -Romney
                                          6

                      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                 Tape Subject Log
                                    (rev. 9/08)



        -Problem
        -Tenure
        -Timmons-MacGregor report
             -Need to publicize
        -Need for confidence

Press
        -Attitude                                                   Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
        -Problem
        -Cambodia
        -Vietnam
              -Laos
              -Casualties
        -Henry A. Kissinger
        -Vietnam casualties
        -[Forename unknown] Ellison
        -Publicity
        -Lois [sp?] [Surname unknown]
        -Networks
        -Attitudes

Visit of United States’ ping-pong team to People’s Republic of China [PRC]
      -Unknown man discussed
            -Views on Mao Tse-tung
            -Reaction
      -News stories
      -John A. Scali
      -Kissinger
      -Publicity
      -Newsworthiness
      -President’s image
            -Peace maker
      -Secretary of State
      -Kissinger’s possible conversation with Scali

President’s schedule
     -Scali
           -Possible meeting with President
     -John C. Stennis
           -Hearings on draft extension and military pay increase
           -Margaret Chase Smith
           -Senate action
                                            7

                          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                    Tape Subject Log
                                       (rev. 9/08)



                -Melvin R. Laird
          -Florida plans
                -Giuseppe Saragat’s visit
                -Key Biscayne
                -Timing
                -Agriculture day
                -Saragat visit
                -Kissinger                                     Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
                -Saragat visit
                      -Length
                      -Meeting
                      -Lunch
                      -Conversation
                      -Honorary degree
                           -[Forename unknown] Colbert [sp?]
                                 -Wife
          -First Marine Division
                -Kissinger
                -Return to Camp Pendleton
                -Timing
                -Demonstration
                -King [Moulay] Hassan II dinner
                -Camp David
                -Possible California trip
                -Parade
                -Presentation of unit citation by President
                -New General
                -Ceremonies

Kissinger entered at 9:59 am

                -Symbolism
                -Timing
                -Demonstrations
                -King Hassan II dinner
                -Chamber of Commerce speech
          -Florida plans
          -Marine division
                -Timing of ceremony
                -Possible California trip
                -Ceremony
                                          8

                     NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                 Tape Subject Log
                                    (rev. 9/08)



Demonstrations
     -Kissinger’s meeting with Frank F. Mankiewicz
     -Crowd estimates
     -Veterans parade
     -Crowd estimates
Vietnam
     -Kissinger’s conversation with McGeorge Bundy
     -President’s conversation with Kissinger at dinner, April 12, 1971
                                                                    Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
           -[Thomas] Woodrow Wilson
           -Dwight D. Eisenhower
           -Franklin D. Roosevelt
           -Abraham Lincoln
                -Mary Todd Lincoln
                      -Loss of brothers in Civil War
                -Cabinet
                      -Disloyalty
                      -Edwin Stanton
                      -Draft riots
                           -New York City
                      -Press

Media
    -Supportive press
         -Richmond Times Dispatch
         -New York Daily News
         -Chicago Tribune
    -Television coverage
         -Vietnam casualties
         -News item

Vietnam
     -Kissinger’s conversation with Bundy
     -Unknown Union of Soviet Socialist Republics [USSR] United Nations [UN] official
     -Ping-pong team
     -Leonid I. Brezhnev
           -Speech
     -David Rockefeller
     -Negotiations
     -President’s position
     -Deadline
     -Prisoners of War [POWs]
     -Bombing of civilians
                                            9

                        NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                     Tape Subject Log
                                        (rev. 9/08)



             -Laos
        -Bundy

Staff
        -Scali
              -Role defined
                   -Press briefing
        -John N. Mitchell                                        Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
        -Scali

Media
    -Kissinger’s appearances on television
    -Time and Newsweek
    -Television commentators
          -John W. Chancellor
          -David Brinkley
    -White House staff
    -Time and Newsweek stories
          -Interest
    -Chart
    -US News and World Report
          -Chart
    -Columbia Broadcasting System [CBS]
    -William H. Carruthers
          -Chart
          -President’s speech on Southeast Asia, April 7, 1971
    -Scali

India-Pakistan conflict
      -Agha Muhommad Yahya Khan
           -USSR
                 -Aleksei N. Kosygin
           -US policy
           -State Department
           -West Pakistan
           -Scali

Peter G. Peterson
      -Talking points for meeting with Time/Life editors
      -President’s schedule

PRC
                                          10

                      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                  Tape Subject Log
                                     (rev. 9/08)



      -Scali’s views regarding visits of ping-pong team
      -President’s image
            -Peace maker
      -President’s initiatives
      -Scali
      -Credit to Administration

Economy                                                             Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
    -Stock market
         -Rise
         -President’s meeting with financial analysts
         -News story in Periscope and Wall Street Journal

Peterson’s meeting with Time/Life editors
     -Vietnam
           -Troop withdrawals
     -International situation
     -PRC
           -President’s initiatives
           -Haldeman
           -Foreign Service
                 -Kremlinologists
                 -USSR
           -Relations with USSR
           -US position
           -Relaxation of trade restrictions
     -Trade relations with USSR
           -Linkage
           -Timing

PRC
      -Chou En-lai
          -Meeting with US ping-pong team
      -Announcement regarding relaxation of US trade restrictions
          -Walter L. Cronkite, Jr.
          -News summary
          -News leaks
          -Publicity
                -Dangers
                -USSR

USSR
                                               11

                            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                      Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. 9/08)



           -Summit meeting

     PRC
           -Scali
           -President’s initiatives
           -Points for Peterson’s meeting with Time/Life editors
           -Isolation
           -President’s initiatives                                  Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
           -Timing

[The President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 9:59 am and
10:16 am]

[Conversation No. 478-2C]

[See Conversation No. 1-75]

[End of telephone conversation]

     PRC
           -Trade restrictions

     President’s schedule
          -Henry Cabot Lodge
                -Possible trip to Vietnam

[The President talked with Peterson between 10:16 am and 10:21 am]

[Conversation No. 478-2D]

[See Conversation No. 1-76]

[End of telephone conversation]

     PRC
           -Peterson’s briefing with Time/Life editors
                 -Possible exploitation by Administration
           -State Department
                 -Marshall Green
                        -Possible press story
                 -Initiative
           -Scali’s role
                                              12

                            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                      Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. 9/08)



                -Instructions to Kissinger
           -Publicity

     President’s schedule
          -Possible interview with John McRoberts
                -Timing

     PRC                                                              Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
           -State Department
                 -Green
                 -Credit for initiative
           -Stewart J. O. Alsop
           -Richard (“Dick”) Wilson
           -William S. White
           -Instructions to Kissinger
           -Announcement regarding relaxation of trade restrictions

     Taiwan
         -Robert D. Murphy

Haldeman left at 10:25 am

           -Green


******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 7
[National Security]
[Duration: 39s ]


     TAIWAN


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 7

******************************************************************************
                                           13

                       NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                   Tape Subject Log
                                      (rev. 9/08)



PRC
        -Ping-pong team
        -UN representation

Taiwan
    -UN representation
    -State Department
    -Murphy                                                       Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
    -Chiang Kai-shek
    -President’s possible speech
    -State Department
    -George H. W. Bush
    -William P. Rogers
    -Murphy

Vietnam
     -Media coverage
         -Binh Dinh province
         -American Broadcasting Company [ABC]

Kissinger’s meeting with Mankiewicz
     -Liberals
     -Demonstrators
           -Crowd estimates
     -Mankiewicz’s reaction
           -President’s speech on Southeast Asia, April 7, 1971
           -Lieutenant William L. Calley, Jr.

Press
        -Peterson’s meeting with Time/Life editors
        -Time
        -Newsweek
        -White

Vietnam
     -Bryce N. Harlow’s view
           -Democrats
           -Withdrawal issue
           -Congress
     -President’s position
           -Cambodia
           -Indonesia
                                               14

                           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                        Tape Subject Log
                                           (rev. 9/08)



               -Economic assistance
               -Military assistance
           -Negotiations
               -Chou En-lai
                      -Visit to Hanoi
               -North Vietnamese attitude
               -PRC
                                                                Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
     PRC
           -Unknown ping-pong player
               -Mao Tse-tung
               -Benefits of exchange

Ronald L. Ziegler entered at 10:32 am

     Preparation for Ziegler’s press briefing
          -PRC
                -Athletic teams exchange
                -Relaxation of trade and travel restrictions
                -Possible questions
                -President’s position
                -Forthcoming announcement
                      -Timing
                -Impact
          -Federal Communications Commission [FCC]
                -ABC
                -New York Times
                -Democratic Party
                -Partisanship
                -President’s position
                      -Republican Party
                      -Fairness
          -PRC
                -April 14, 1971 story

     Ziegler’s schedule
          -Tricia Nixon

Ziegler left at 10:37 am
                                                15

                             NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                          (rev. 9/08)



     President’s schedule
          -Meeting with Lodge
                -Vietnam
                      -Police forces

     Vietnam
          -Sir Robert Thompson
          -Report on police forces                                        Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
          -Peace initiatives

     PRC
            -Forthcoming announcement of relaxation of trade and travel restrictions, April 14,
                 1971
                 -Possible press reaction
                      -Ziegler
                 -Department of State
                      -Possible leak to press
                            -Marvin L. Kalb
                            -Cronkite
                      -Rogers

Lodge and an unknown man entered at 10:38 am; the White House photographer and members
of the press were present

     Greetings

Kissinger left at 10:39 am

     Photograph

     Ping-pong

     Golf

The unknown man left at an unknown time before 10:42 am

     Statue

     PRC
            -Visit of ping-pong team
            -Significance
            -Newsmen
                                          16

                          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                   Tape Subject Log
                                      (rev. 9/08)




******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 10
[National Security]
[Duration: 16m 2s ]
                                                               Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)

     THE VATICAN

Kissinger entered at 10:42 am


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 10

******************************************************************************


     Vietnam
          -Possible trip by Lodge
                -Timing
          -Thompson
                -Report on police
          -David M. Kennedy
                -Trip
          -Military activity
          -Cambodia
          -Central Highlands
          -Binh Dinh province
          -Casualties
          -Ellsworth F. Bunker
          -General Nguyen Van Thieu
          -Lieutenant General Duong Van (“Big Minh”) Minh
          -Lodge’s possible trip
          -Thieu
                -Election
                -US position
          -Withdrawal
          -Reception for Minh
          -Bunker
          -Thieu
                                    17

               NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                          Tape Subject Log
                             (rev. 9/08)



     -Importance
     -1963 Coup
     -General Nguyen Khanh
     -Compared with Nguyen Cao Ky
-Ky
-Thieu
-Ky
      -President’s position                         Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
      -US economic assistance
      -Anti-American sentiment
      -President’s esteem for
      -Candidate
      -Economic assistance
-Philippines
      -Elections
-Withdrawal
-Ky
      -Lodge’s role
      -Age
      -Need for unity
-Casualties
-Withdrawal
-Bombing
-Cambodia
-Political Upheaval
      -Ky
      -Prospects
-Bunker
-Candidates
-Thieu
-Ky
-Minh
-Tran Van Dong
-Lai Van Tim [sp?]
-Ngo Dinh Diem
-Minh
-Thieu
-US announcement
-Bunker
-General Creighton W. Abrams, Jr.
-General Frederick C. Weyand
-Troop withdrawals
                                               18

                            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                          (rev. 9/08)



                -Levels

     Lodge’s schedule

******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 11
[Personal Returnable]                                               Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
[Duration: 25s ]


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 11

******************************************************************************


     President’s greetings to Emily (Sears) Lodge

Kissinger and Lodge left at 11:07 am

McCracken entered at 11:08 am; the White House photographer and members of the press were
present

     [General conversation]

     Council of Economic Advisors [CEA]

     Photograph

     Economy
         -Stock market

Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 11:08 am

     President’s schedule

Bull left at an unknown time before 11:13 am

     Stock market
          -Dow-Jones average
          -Rise
          -Bull market
                                              19

                          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                        Tape Subject Log
                                           (rev. 9/08)



           -Volume
           -Brokerage firms
                -Profits
                -Merrill Lynch & Company

     Consumer Price Index [CPI]
         -Prospects
         -Rise                                                 Conv. No. 478-2 (cont.)
         -1970 figures
         -Predictions for 1971
         -Confidence

McCracken left at 11:13 am