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Conversation: 644-014

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Start Date: 10-Jan-1972 12:35 PM

End Date: 10-Jan-1972 1:24 PM

Participants:

Nixon, Richard M. (President)Rush, [David] KennethKennedy, Richard T. (Col.)White House photographerWhite House operatorFlanigan, Peter M.

Recording Device: Oval Office

Full Tape Conversation Start Time: 02:17:24

Full Tape Conversation End Time: 03:05:34

644a.mp3

644b.mp3

NARA Description:

On January 10, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon, [David] Kenneth Rush, Col. Richard T. Kennedy, White House photographer, White House operator, and Peter M. Flanigan met in the Oval Office of the White House from 12:35 pm to 1:24 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 644-014 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid:

Conversation No. 644-14

Date: January 10, 1972
Time: 12:35 pm - 1:24 pm
                                            26

                         NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                    Tape Subject Log
                                      (rev. 10/06)
                                                                  Conv. No. 644-12 (cont.)


Location: Oval Office

The President met with [David] Kenneth Rush and Col. Richard T. Kennedy; the White House
photographer was present at the beginning of the meeting.

     Rush’s health

     Rush's living arrangements
          -Davenport
          -Piper Key
          -Beaches

     Key Biscayne
         -Compared to San Clemente
               -Weather
               -Views
               -Houses

     Rush's possible appointment as Deputy Secretary of Defense
          -John N. Mitchell
                -Discussion with Rush
          -Rush’s schedule
                -Return to Bonn
          -Forthcoming meeting with Melvin R. Laird
                -Recent telephone conversation in New York
                -Financial aspects of Rush's holdings
                -Job candidates
                      -Laird’s view
                           -Compared to the President’s
                -Rush's experience
                      -Mutual and Balanced Force Reductions [MBFR], Strategic Arms
                            Limitation Talks [SALT]
                      -Business
                -Lair’s schedule
                      -Vacation
                -West Germany

     Frank E. Cash, Jr.
          -Assistant to Rush
          -Present position
          -Russell Fessenden
                                         27

                     NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                 Tape Subject Log
                                   (rev. 10/06)
                                                                Conv. No. 644-14 (cont.)



Nominations for ambassador to replace Rush
    -Rush's recommendations
         -Meeting with Peter M. Flanigan
                -Recommendations
                     -Unknown Texan
    -West Germany
    -Ambassadorial candidates
         -Age
    -Gen. Lucius DuB. Clay, Jr., John J. McCloy
    -MBFR, European Security Conference

Free Democratic Party [FDP]
     -Walter Scheel
           -Poll results
           -Relationship with Rush
     -Size
           -Importance

Poll results
      -Scheel
             -Compared to Dr. Rainer Barzel

Barzel
     -Head of Christian Democratic Union [CDU] party in Bundestag

Forthcoming West German elections
     -September 1973
     -Moscow agreements
          -Ratification
                -CDU’s possible position
                      -Gerhard Schroeder, Franz Josef Strauss
                      -Bundestag
                            -FDP
                      -Willy Brandt
                -Effect of failure on foreign policy and relations
                      -Berlin agreement, European Security Conference, détente, Soviet-
                            West German relations
                -Brandt
                      -Possible election
                            -Economic situation
                                        28

                    NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                Tape Subject Log
                                  (rev. 10/06)
                                                             Conv. No. 644-14 (cont.)


                                -Timing
                -Timing

The President's meetings with Brandt in Key Biscayne, December 1971
     -The President’s impression

US-West German relations
    -Status
          -Rush’s view
    -Britain, France
    -West German security
          -Brandt
          -Troop levels
          -Socialists
    -Kissinger
    -Neutrality
    -MBFR
    -European security conference
          -Brandt’s talks with Leonid Brezhnev in 1971
          -Purpose

Brandt
     -Stance on detente
     -US initial attitude
     -Relations with the US vis-à-vis the Soviets
     -Attitudes toward détente
           -Soviet allies
           -Attitude toward East Germany, East Berlin
                 -Konrad Adenauer
                       -France
     -Motivations and goals
           -[Ostpolitik]
           -Michael J. Mansfield
           -Vietnam
                 -Impact on German attitudes

Barzel
     -Christian Social Union [CSU]
          -Strauss
          -Attitude toward Moscow Agreements Brandt’s Ostpolitik
          -Relationship with CDU
                                                29

                            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                        Tape Subject Log
                                          (rev. 10/06)
                                                                         Conv. No. 644-14 (cont.)


                         -Bavaria
             -Moderation on foreign policy
                   -Moscow agreements
                         -Ratification
                               -Party unity
                                     -Analogy to [James] Harold Wilson
                                          -Labor Party
                                               -Common Market
             -Economic and internal issues
                   -Possible effect on Brandt
             -Political position of CDU
                   -Western allies
                   -Anti-Soviet posture, economic
                         -Brandt
                   -Berlin Agreement, European Security Conference
             -Forthcoming trip to the US
             -Electoral prospects
                   -Compared to Edward R.G. Heath
             -West German economy

     Schedule

Kennedy left at 12:58 pm.

     Laird
             -Forthcoming talk with Rush
                  -Rush’s talk with the President
                       -Secretary of Defense and Deputy Secretary
                             -Teamwork
                       -Rush
                             -Experience
                                   -Government, MBFR, SALT
                                   -Business
                                         -Bureaucracy
                                   -Loyalty

     Rush
             -Possible future responsibilities as Deputy Secretary of Defense
                  -Examination of Defense Department’s operation and management
                        -David Packard
                        -Laird
                                         30

                      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                 Tape Subject Log
                                   (rev. 10/06)
                                                                Conv. No. 644-14 (cont.)


            -Washington Special Actions Group [WSAG]

WSAG
   -Henry A. Kissinger
   -Laird's attitude
   -Mission
        -Implementation of White House decisions
                -Bureaucracy
   -Members
        -Deputy, Undersecretary of State, Chairman of Joint Chiefs of Staff [JCS],
                Director of Central Intelligence Agency [CIA], Kissinger
   -Rush's role
        -Kissinger

Rush
       -Talk with John N. Mitchell
             -Role of Mitchell
                   -National Security Council [NSC] meetings
                         -Kissinger
       -Necessary relationship with Laird
       -Kissinger
       -Possible relationship with John B. Connally
             -Purchase of planes by Latin America countries, West Germany
                   -Northrup
             -State Department
             -Management problems
             -Treasury Department
                   -Financial problems
       -State Department
             -John N. Irwin, II, U. Alexis Johnson
       -Support from Laird
       -Management role
       -Independence
             -Charlie McCarthy
       -WSAG
             -Israel
                   -Kissinger
                   -Mitchell
                   -State Department
                         -Arabs
             -Mediator role
                                               31

                           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                         Tape Subject Log
                                           (rev. 10/06)
                                                                     Conv. No. 644-14 (cont.)


                -India-Pakistan crisis
          -Relationship with JCS
                -Support
          -Interest of job
                -Compared to Secretary of State, Defense, Attorney General, Secretary of
                      Treasury
                -Fund management

     Kissinger

     Talk with Mitchell
          -Advice
               -WSAG
               -Kissinger, Laird, Rogers

     Rush's schedule

[The President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 12:58 pm and
1:11 pm.]

[Conversation No. 644-14A]

[See Conversation No. 18-30]

[End of telephone conversation]

     Rush's schedule
          -Meeting with Flanigan

     Election year
           -Scrutiny of Administration

     Kissinger

Bull entered at an unknown time after 12:58 pm.

     The President's call to Flanigan

Bull left at an unknown time before 1:11 pm.

[The President talked with Flanigan between 1:11 pm and 1:12 pm.]
                                            32

                          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                    Tape Subject Log
                                      (rev. 10/06)
                                                                  Conv. No. 644-14 (cont.)



[Conversation No. 644-14B]

[See Conversation No. 18-31]

[End of telephone conversation]

     The President's image
          -Europe
          -Momentum
          -1972 election
          -Europe
          -In business community
          -Europe
          -Max Frankel's conversation with Rush
                -New York Times and Washington Post
                -The President compared with Franklin D. Roosevelt
                -American public
                      -World
                -Kissinger
          -Rush’s conversation with David Binder of the New York Times
                -Roosevelt and Nixon
                -The President’s foreign policy record

     Jack N. Anderson Papers
          -India-Pakistan War
                -Kissinger

     US policy on India-Pakistan relations
         -Public interest
         -US-India relations
               -West Pakistan
                     -Soviet Union
               -Middle East
               -Criticism
               -Mutuality
         -The People’s Republic of China [PRC]
         -Alternatives
               -Vietnam
               -The President’s forthcoming PRC trip
                     -Soviet Union
                                               33

                             NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. 10/06)
                                                                       Conv. No. 644-14 (cont.)


                  -Soviet Union
                        -Middle East
                              -Balance of power
                                    -Soviet pilots in United Arab Republic [UAR] planes
                                          -Possible effect on Israel
                              -US reactions
                                    -Sixth fleet
            -US efforts
                  -United Nations [UN] resolution
                  -Soviet Union
                  -Refugee aid
                  -Preservation of stability
            -Status of India
                  -West Bengel
                        -California
            -East Pakistan
                  -Sheikh Mujibur Rahman
                  -Communists in West Bengal

    India
            -Rush’s knowledge
                 -Union-Carbide


**************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5
[National Security]
[Duration: 35s ]


    INDIA


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5

**************************************************************************


            -War aims
                 -Pakistan
                                           34

                           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                    Tape Subject Log
                                      (rev. 10/06)
                                                                Conv. No. 644-14 (cont.)


                -PRC
                -Kashmir

     Vietnam War
          -North Vietnam
               -Laos, Cambodia, South Vietnam
          -1954 Geneva Accords

     US policy on India-Pakistan relations
         -The President’s position
               -Support for India
         -Newspapers
               -Stories
                     -Comment
                           -Presidential advisors
               -Sources
         -General public
               -Attitude towards India-Pakistan relations
                     -Comparison to Pentagon Papers, Vietnam
         -Opposition to the President's policy

     Rush's meeting with Mitchell
          -Laird’s talk with Mitchell
               -Laird’s recommendations
          -Work with Laird, State Department

Rush left at 1:24 pm.