Conversation No. 652-13

Date: January 20, 1972
Time: 4:52 pm - 5:59 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with Terence Cardinal Cooke, Theodore E. McCarrick, Peter M. Flanigan and
Alexander M. Haig, Jr.; Stephen B. Bull, the White House photographer, and members of the
press were present at the beginning of the meeting.

       Greetings

       The President’s schedule

       Cooke’s return from trip to Vietnam
            -Servicemen
                  -Haig’s question to Cooke
                         -Morale

An unknown person entered at an unknown time after 4:52 pm.

       Refreshment

The unknown person left at an unknown time before 5:22 pm.

       The President’s State of the Union Address
            -Cooke’s watching on television

       The President’s schedule
            -Cabinet meeting
                  -Cooke’s activity during meeting

       [General conversation]
                                             20

                          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                     Tape Subject Log
                                       (rev. 10/06)
                                                                      Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


       [Photograph session]

The White House photographer and the press left at an unknown time after 4:52 pm.

       Cooke’s trip to Vietnam
            -Unknown bishop
                   -Travel to Greenland, Iceland and Europe
            -US armed forces
                   -Drugs
                         -Situation
                               -Prevention, education, treatment
                               -Incoming troops
                               -Da Nang
                                     -Compared to other areas
                   -Morale
                         -Troop withdrawal
                         -Gen. Creighton W. Abrams, Jr.’s report to Cooke
                         -Commanders
                               -Concern
                         -General [Forename] McDonough [sp?]
                               -Da Nang
                               -Defensive action
                                     -Explanation to troops
                         -Compared to earlier tone
                   -Peace time forces
                         -Korea
                         -Japan
                         -Western Europe
                         -US bases
                         -Pride in duty
                               -Compared with rear area service in World War II
                                     -The President’s experience
                                           -Noumea
                                           -Guadalcanal
            -South Vietnamese
                   -Morale
                         -Farming, housing
                         -New schools, seminary buildings
                         -Da Nang
                               -Hospitals
                   -Pacification
                               21

            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                       Tape Subject Log
                         (rev. 10/06)
                                                       Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


            -Effects
                  -Publicity
                  -Military forces
                  -Harvest
                  -Land reform
                  -Building
                         -Schools, stores, roads
      -Vietnamization
            -Term
                  -Connotation
            -Military
                  -Troop withdrawal
                         -Melvin R. Laird
            -Public response
                  -Greek-Turkish aid program
                  -Marshall Plan
                  -Alliance for progress
                  -South and North Vietnamese development
            -Self-help
                  -“Partnership for development”
      -Rice surplus
            -South Vietnamese population
-Vietcong
-US, South Vietnamese casualties
      -Decline
-South Vietnamese army
      -Forthcoming offensive by North Vietnam
            -Handling
                  -Prospects
      -Nature of wars
            -Retreating
            -Battle at Tannenberg
                  -Book by Winston S. Churchill
                  -Russians
                         -L’vov
                  -German retreat
                                      22

                  NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                             Tape Subject Log
                               (rev. 10/06)
                                                          Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


                             -Effect on Russians
                                   -Prisoners
                -Battle of the Bulge
                      -Gen. George S. Patton, Jr.
                             -Pincher movement

Vietnam
     -Statement by Catholic Bishops
           -End of war
           -Justness of wars
           -Useful purpose of Vietnam war
           -Peace
           -Aid to South Vietnam
           -Number of North Vietnamese in Laos, Cambodia and
            South Vietnam
                 -1954 accords
                 -Self defense
     -Justness of wars
           -Self defense
     -South Vietnamese survival
           -US support
           -1954 events
                 -Bishop of Da Nang
                 -Civilian casualties
                       -Starvation
           -Possible casualties
           -US withdrawal
                 -Peace
                 -Avoiding South Vietnamese casualties
           -Catholics
     -Conduct of war
           -The President’s view
     -Statement by Catholic Bishops
           -Cooke’s position
           -Minority opinion
                 -US unilateral withdrawal
           -Cooke’s editing
           -Immorality of war
                 -Possible impact on US troops
           -Consistency with US policy
                 -Treatment by press
                                               23

                            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. 10/06)
                                                                        Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


                                 -Compared with actual statement
                                       -The President’s reading
                     -Francis Cardinal Spellman
                     -Minority opinion
                     -Press treatment
                     -Compared with Quakers’ response
                     -Support of the President’s policies
                     -Cooke’s conversation with unknown men

       Cooke’s speech
            -Rose Mary Woods’s assessment

       Richard E. Berlin
            -Health
                  -Roosevelt Hospital
            -Media report, January 19, 1972
            -Religion
            -Invitation to Readers’ Digest dinner, January 28, 1972
            -Location

[The President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 4:52 pm and
5:22 pm.]

[Conversation No. 652-13A]

[See Conversation No. 19-35]

The President conferred with Cooke during the telephone conversation.

       Berlin’s location

[End of conferral]

[End of telephone conversation]

       White House operator

       Berlin
             -Admiration for the President
             -Muriel (“Honey”) (Johnson) Berlin
                                               24

                           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. 10/06)
                                                                   Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


       Vietnam
            -Forthcoming developments
            -End of war in 1972
            -US involvement
                  -Prisoners of war [POWs]
                        -US withdrawals
                        -US aid to South Vietnam
            -Cooke’s trip
                  -Stop in Bethlehem
                        -“Generation of peace”
                        -Mass for peace
                        -Cooke’s previous visits
                        -The President’s travels
                        -Mass for peace
                              -“Shepherd’s Field”
                              -Remembrance of the President

       People’s Republic of China [PRC]
            -The President’s forthcoming trip
                  -Henry A. Kissinger’s briefing of Cooke
                        -Instructions to Haig
            -Population
            -Catholic missionaries
                  -Captivity
                        -Bishop James E. Walsh

       The President’s forthcoming trip to Soviet Union
            -Briefing of Cooke

       State of the Union Address
             -The President’s foreign trips and relations
                    -Differences
                    -Hopes for peace

       Cooke’s talk with Soviet Friends in New York
            -Communists
            -The President’s foreign trips

[The White House operator talked with the President at 5:22 pm.]

[Conversation No. 652-13B]
                                               25

                            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. 10/06)
                                                                     Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)



[See Conversation No. 19-36]

[End of telephone conversation]

       Berlin
             -Forthcoming conversation with Cooke
                   -The President’s attempted call

       India
               -Cooke’s visit to Calcutta
                     -Refugees
               -Relief work by voluntary agencies
               -US aid
                     -Humanitarian efforts
                     -United Nations [UN]
                     -Catholic efforts
                     -Pakistan

       Parochial schools
            -Rate of closings
            -Prospects
            -Government assistance
                   -Presidential commission [President’s Committee on School Finance]
                          -Forthcoming report
                   -Administration plan
                   -Tax credit
            -Supreme Court decision
                   -Child benefits
                   -Direct subsidy
            -Tax credit
                   -Benefit to public and parochial schools
                   -Legislation
                   -Flanigan’s possible conversation with John B. Connally
                   -Property tax substitute
                   -Justice Department view
                          -Bishops’ view
                          -Constitutionality
            -Government assistance
                   -Legislation
                   -Flanigan’s possible talks with Connally and John D. Ehrlichman
                               26

            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                       Tape Subject Log
                         (rev. 10/06)
                                                      Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


      -Congressional schedule
            -Tax Bill
            -Revenue sharing
            -Health program
            -Ways and Means Committee
      -Tax Bill
      -Neil H. McElroy Committee [President’s Committee on School Finance]
              report
      -Connally
            -Talk with Flanigan
            -Meeting with Cooke
            -Need for support
      -The President’s policy
      -Connally
            -Relation with Cooke
            -Schedule
                  -Meeting
                        -Publicity
                  -Speech in New York City to conference board
                  -Cooke’s home
-Need for public confidence
-Legislation
      -Prospects for educational pluralism
-Government assistance
      -Connally
            -Schedule
                  -Forthcoming Cabinet dinner
                        -Possible conversation with the President
                  -New York City
                        -Meeting with Cooke
                  -International monetary matters
            -Standing in Cabinet
            -School closing rate
            -Educational pluralism
-Public education
      -National Education Association [NEA]
-Values
-Schools in foreign countries
      -The President’s visits
            -PRC
            -Soviet Union
                                               27

                          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                      Tape Subject Log
                                        (rev. 10/06)
                                                               Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


                          -Romania
                          -Hungary
                          -Poland
                          -Czechoslovakia
             -Public education
                   -State control
             -Government assistance
                   -Inflation
                   -Character compared to intelligence
                          -Arrogance, pride
                   -Legislation
                          -Timing
                   -Flanigan’s comment
                   -Justice Department
                   -Supreme Court
                          -William H. Rehnquist
                          -Position

       The President’s schedule
            -Meeting with William C. Westmoreland

Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 5:22 pm.

                   -Request that Westmoreland join them
             -Kissinger’s schedule

Bull left at an unknown time before 5:38 pm.

       The President’s schedule

       State of the Union Address
             -Reaction

       The President’s health
            -Predecessors

William Westmoreland entered at 5:38 pm.

       Greetings

       Introduction
                                              28

                          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                     Tape Subject Log
                                       (rev. 10/06)
                                                                     Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)



       Vietnam
            -Armed forces
                 -Morale
                 -Cooke’s talks with troops
                 -Families at home
                 -Societal problems
                 -Education by military

       Westmoreland
           -Forthcoming trip to Indonesia

       Cooke’s forthcoming meeting with Connally

       [General conversation]

       The President’s schedule
            -Trip to PRC
                  -Future meeting with Cooke

Cooke, McCarrick and Flanigan left and Melvin R. Laird entered at 5:40 pm.

       Harold O. Lovre
            -Funeral
            -Chowder and Marching Club
            -Formerly Representative from South Dakota
            -Home
            -Funeral
                  -Cabinet meeting
                  -Laird
                  -Rogers C. B. Morton
                  -The President’s wreath
            -Recent health
                  -Laird’s recent meeting
                  -Cancer
                  -Recent party

       Indonesia
            -Westmoreland’s talk with Haig
            -The President’s letter
            -Lt. Gen. TNJ Suharto
                               29

            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                       Tape Subject Log
                         (rev. 10/06)
                                                    Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


      -Forthcoming conversation with Westmoreland
-Francis J. Galbraith
-Economic assistance
      -State department policy
             -Marshall Green
             -Former ambassadors
-Military security program
      -Suharto
             -US support
      -Geography
      -Population
      -Agriculture
             -Rice
      -Nixon Doctrine
-Aid program
      -Size
      -Congress
-Westmoreland trip
-US policy in Southeast Asia
      -Vietnam
      -US interest and presence
-The President’s trip to PRC
-US policy
-Population and resources
      -Compared with Southeast Asia, Thailand
      -Vietnam
      -Soviets
-US aid
      -Congress
             -Aid to other nations
                    -Cambodia
      -Consortium
-Connally’s previous trip
      -US aid
             -India
-Military aid
      -Military
             -Communism
             -Training
      -Importance
                                       30

                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                               Tape Subject Log
                                 (rev. 10/06)
                                                                Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


US military influence
    -International sales
           -Laird’s possible conversation with Joint Chiefs of Staff [JCS]
           -Latin America
                  -French sales
                  -Training
                  -Peru
                  -Chile
                        -Salvador Allende Gossens
                              -US policy
           -JCS
           -J. William Fulbright
           -Michael J. Mansfield
           -Frank F. Church
           -Arms
    -Civilian compared to military regimes
    -Yugoslavia
           -Reorganization of Communist Party
                  -Latin America
    -Military attaches
           -Function
           -Lt. Gen. Vernon A. Walters
                  -Brazil
                  -Relationship with the President
    -Venezuela
           -Commander of army
                  -Visit with Westmoreland
           -Latin America
           -Trade
                  -France
                  -Oil
                        -US purchases
                  -France
    -Bolivia
           -President [Hugo Banzer-Suarez]
                  -Relations with Westmoreland
                  -Military assistance
                        -Rate of delivery
                  -Relations with US
    -Latin American aid
           -Limitations
                                        31

                     NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                Tape Subject Log
                                  (rev. 10/06)
                                                                   Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


                    -Fulbright and Church
              -Non-military uses
                    -Education
              -Soviet Union
                    -MIGs
     -India
            -Economic compared to military
            -Soviet Union
                   -Military aid
     -Political problems
     -Military regimes
            -Congress
                   -Unknown person
     -Military sales
            -India
                   -US compared to Soviet equipment
            -Congressional limitations
                   -Effect on Nixon Doctrine
                   -Paper from Laird
                         -Delivery to the President through Haig
                         -National Security Council [NSC]
                         -State Department
                         -William P. Rogers
                         -Senate Foreign Relations Committee

Forthcoming Cabinet dinner
      -Laird’s presence

State of the Union Address
      -Westmoreland’s presence

Indonesia
     -Westmoreland’s trip
     -The President’s view
     -Population
          -Wealth
     -Westmoreland’s trip
          -Suharto
          -[Unintelligible name]
          -Vietnam
          -Cambodia
                                                32

                                NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                         Tape Subject Log
                                           (rev. 10/06)
                                                                     Conv. No. 652-13 (cont.)


                          -Phnom Penh
                    -Vietnam
                          -Military prospects
                          -Nguyen Van Thieu
                    -Cambodia
                          -Gen. Lon Nol
                          -Udorn
                                -C. McMurtrie Godley
                          -The President’s trip to PRC

Haig, et al. left at 5:59 pm.