Conversation: 815-014
Prev:  815-013 Next: 815-015Start Date: 24-Nov-1972 10:43 AM
End Date: 24-Nov-1972 11:37 AM
Participants:
Nixon, Richard M. (President); Ehrlichman, John D.; Volpe, John A.; Recording Device: Oval Office
NARA Description:
On November 24, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon, John D. Ehrlichman, and John A. Volpe met in the Oval Office of the White House from 10:43 am to 11:37 am. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 815-014 of the White House Tapes.
Nixon Library Finding Aid:
Conversation No. 815-14 Date: November 24 1972 Time: 10:43 am - 11:37 am Location: Oval Office The President met with John D. Ehrlichman. Second term reorganization -John A Volpe’s recent meeting with Ehrlichman -Volpe’s retention -Duration -Volpe’s forthcoming meeting with the President -The President’s recent meeting with George W. Romney -Department or US future -Future meeting -Volpe’s activities -The President's forthcoming meeting with Volpe -Tone -First term cabinet The President left at an unknown time after 10:45 am. Volpe entered at 10:45 am. [General conversation] Volpe's schedule -Recent trip to Venezuela -Trans-Amazon -Villages The President entered at an unknown time after 10:45 am. Volpe’s weight Volpe’s schedule -34- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -International conference on Highway Transportation in developing countries, Merida, Mexico Volpe’s health -Back -Dr. W. Kenneth Riland -Nelson A. Rockefeller -The President -Sitting -Muscle spasms -Pain -Rockefeller -US Steel -Osteopathy -[Warren E. Burger] -John N. Mitchell -The President -Source -Nerve -Remedy -Riland -Possible appointment with Volpe -Timing -Volpe’s recent trip to Venezuela -Mexican doctors -Luis Echeverria Alvarez US-Mexico relations -Echeverria -Trip to US -Remarks -Personality -Volpe’s schedule -Virgin Islands -International Conference on Highway Transportation in Developing Countries Volpe’s health -Hospitals -35- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -Virgin Islands -Mexico -International Conference on Highway Transportation in Developing Countries -Venezuela US-Latin America relations -Volpe’s view -Volpe’s recent trip to Mexico -Possible report to the President -US aid -Brazil -International Conference on Highway Transportation in Developing Countries -Volpe’s meetings -[Echeverria] -Venezuela -Rafael Caldera -Brazil -Emilio Garrastazu Medici -Duration of meeting -Relationship with the President -Brazil -Importance -The President’s travels -Australia -Wealth -Volpe’s recent conversation with Ehrlichman -Volpe’s visit to Trans-Amazon -Volpe’s schedule -Trans-Amazon -Development -Roads -US aid -Military sales -Congress -US business -Lost opportunities -US aid -Military sales -36- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -Lost opportunities -France -Civilian Second term reorganization -Volpe -Performance at Department of Transportation -Successor -Domestic affairs -First term Cabinet -Moves to other positions -Romney -Departure -New approaches -Department of Transportation -Cabinet officers -Department of Housing and Urban Development [HUD] Secretary -New role -Peter G. Peterson -Performance at Commerce Department -International economics -Treasury Department -George P. Shultz -Commerce Department, Labor Department, State Department -International economics -Expertise -Shultz -New assignment -Peterson’s forthcoming meeting with the President -Timing ****************************************************************************** [Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift] -1972 election -Charles W. Colson -Ethnic vote -Southern vote -Labor vote -37- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -Shultz -Ethnic vote -Catholics -Italian-Americans -Breakthrough -Polish-Americans -Irish-Americans -Massachusetts -Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy -Italian-American vote -Volpe’s aid -The President’s future book -Knights of Columbus dinner -Maryland -[Unintelligible name] -Kennedy -Support for the President -“Folk hero” [End segment reviewed under deed of gift] ****************************************************************************** Volpe -Ambassadorship to Italy -Timing -Political situation in Italy -Crisis -Graham A. Martin -Performance as ambassador to Italy -Foreign service -Knowledge of Italy’s politics, heart -The President’s meetings with Italians -Compared to other European ambassadorships -US-Vatican City relations -[Pope Pual VI] Giovanni Battista Motini -Third secretary -Henry Cabot Lodge -Italian government -Special representative -38- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -Volpe’s relations with the Pope -Advantages -Check on left wing -Appeal to Italian-Americans -US-Vatican City relations -1972 election -Vatican City political orientation -Left wing -Roman Catholic Church in Latin America -The President’s interest -John Cardinal Krol -Terence Cardinal Cooke -Tenure -Second term reorganization -Recommendations -Report to Ehrlichman -Ambassadorships -Appointments -State Department -Bureaucracy -Great Britain -Walter H. Annenberg -France -West Germany -Japan -Back channel to White House -State Department -Bureaucracy -Job offer to Volpe -State Department -Bureaucracy -Volpe’s possible conversation with Clare Boothe Luce -Timing -Martin Department of Transportation -Volpe’s service in administration -Department age -Publicity -Airline strikes -39- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -Hijackings -The President’s forthcoming trip to New York -Challenges -Volpe’s recent conversation with Ehrlichman -Highway Trust Fund -Public transportation -Volpe’s successor -The President's directive to Ehrlichman -Congressional relations -Mass transit amendment defeat -Procedural vote -The President’s request for a report -House of Representatives parliamentarian’s [Lewis Deschler’s] conversation with Edward P. Boland -Boland’s relationship with Volpe -Reversal -Wilbur D Mills -Outcome -Thomas P. (“Tip”) O’Neill, Jr. -[Thomas] Hale Boggs -Future effort -Volpe's lobbying -American Public Works Association -Truckers -Oil companies -Adm.. Eugene Joseph Peltier -American Road and Transportation Builders Association [ARTBA] -Conversation with Volpe -Relationships with Volpe -Background -Navy -Bureau of Yards and Docks -Engineering consulting -St. Louis -Contracting -Bureau of Yards and Docks -Conversation with Volpe -Peltier’s conversation with executive vice president -40- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -Character -Background -American Society of Civil Engineers -ARTBA -Retirement -Bureau of Yards and Docks -Age -Relationship with Volpe -Scabees World War II -Scabees -Volpe’s experience -The President’ s experience -Food -Alleged thievery Volpe -Highway Trust Fund -Ambassadorship to Italy -The President’s previous conversation with Volpe -William P. Rogers **************************************************************************** BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5 [Privacy] [Duration: 1m 42s ] END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5 ****************************************************************************** ****************************************************************************** [Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift] ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 6 [Deed of gift-privacy]] [Duration: 1m 22s ] -41- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 6 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- [End of segment reviewed under deed of gift] ****************************************************************************** Volpe -Ambassadorship to Italy -Opportunities -US Vatican City relations -Personal contacts -Compared to formal diplomacy -Third secretary -Lodge -Volpe’s previous visit -Meeting with Pope VI, November 1969 -Vietnam War -The President’s policies -Support -US troop withdrawals -Consequence -Blood bath -Opposition -Roman Catholic clergy -Unknown person -Pope Paul VI’s support for the President -Consequences of North Vietnamese victory -Blood bath -Communist and North Vietnamese brutality -Qualifications for job -1971 meeting with Italian leaders -Mariano Rumor -Giulio Andreotti -Industrialists -Embassy -Communism -Christian Democrats -Martin -Martin -42- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -Relationship with the President -Thailand -Dwight D. Eisenhower -State Department -Symbolism of appointment -Volpe’s relationship with the President -Impact on Italians -Compared to Great Britain -[Annenberg] -Compared to France, West German -Volpe’s stature as Cabinet member **************************************************************************** [Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift Italian-American vote -Support for Republican Party -Consultation with Volpe -Speeches by Volpe -Democratic Party tactics -John A. Gronouski -Warsaw -Polish-American vote -Volpe -New Majority -Speeches [End segment reviewed under deed of gift] ****************************************************************************** Volpe -Ambassadorship to Italy -Cost of living -Comparison with Great Britain and France -Martin’s wealth -H. Gardner Ackley’s wealth -Ackley’s conversation with Ehrlichman -US Embassy -43- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -Residence -US embassy -The President’s 1947 trip -James C. Dunn -Alcide de Gasperi -Communism -Possible visit from Volpe to de Gasperi’s wife -Acceptance of offer -Possible delay -Volpe’s family -The President’s conversation with Ehrlichman -Martin -The President’s conversation with Maurice H. Stans -Timing -Martin -Volpe’s relationship with the President -Effect on Italian-Americans -Other possible positions in administration -Congressional relations -Clark MacGregor -Democratic Congress -Volpe as Congressional relations officer -Problem -Status -Downgrade -International commission -Agencies -Peter M. Flanigan -Cabinet to major embassy -Status -Cabinet to White House staff -Status -Downgrade -Cabinet to commission -Status -Downgrade -Ambassadorships -Volpe’s cabinet colleagues -Pattern -Ambassadorship to Italy -44- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) -Volpe’s relationship with the President -Volpe’s conversations with Italian friends -Robert H. Finch -Political aspirations -Relationship with the President ****************************************************************************** [Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift] Massachusetts -The President’s campaigning with Volpe -1962 election -Defeats -Republicans -John P. Roche Column -Reasons for defeats -Kennedy family -Students -Lack of Republican organizations -Compared to Connecticut, Rhode Island -Francis W. Sargent -1972 election -Edward W. Brooke -Volpe -Loyalty -Organization -Absence -Colson -Volpe’s service as governor -1972 election -State chairman -John N. Mitchell -Sargent The President’s trips -1952 convention -Worchester -Dinner -Bocchi -45- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) Volpe’s health -The President’s doctor -Virgin Islands [End segment reviewed under deed of gift] ****************************************************************************** Volpe -Ambassadorships to Italy -Acceptance -Timing -Announcement -Effect on Martin -Foreign policy assignment -Compared to John B. Connally -President’s Foreign Intelligence Advisory Board [PFIAB] -Connally -Brazilian Finance Minister’s view -Martin's performance -Schedule -Social life ****************************************************************************** [Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift] 1972 elections -Republican candidates -The President’s victory margin -House of Representatives -Quality -Age -Campaigning -Contact with voters -Spiro T. Agnew -Volpe -The President -46- NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM Tape Subject Log (rev. Jan.-08) Conversation No. 815-14 (cont’d) [End segment reviewed under deed of gift] ****************************************************************************** Volpe -Plans -Work with Ehrlichman -Department of Transportation -Second term reorganization -Volpe’s views -Volpe’s conversation with Ehrlichman -Timing -Successor -Candidates -Peltier -Age -Consulting engineer firm -Reputation -Name -French derivation -Possible Catholicism -Civil engineering Volpe and Ehrlichman left at 11:37 am.