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Conversation: 887-026

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Start Date: 22-Mar-1973 4:05 PM

End Date: 22-Mar-1973 5:00 PM

Participants:

Nixon, Richard M. (President)Shultz, George P.Ehrlichman, John D.[Unknown person(s)]Bull, Stephen B.

Recording Device: Oval Office

887-026.mp3

NARA Description:

On March 22, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon, George P. Shultz, John D. Ehrlichman, unknown person(s), and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 4:05 pm and 5:00 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 887-026 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid:

Conversation No. 887-26

Date: March 22, 1973
Time: Unknown between 4:05 pm and 5:00 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with George P. Shultz and John D. Ehrlichman.
                                           -35-

                 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                   Tape Subject Log
                                    (rev. July-2010)
                                                              Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)



      US-Canada relations
          -Shultz’s contact with John H. Turner


****************************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1
[National security]
[Duration: 5s]

      CANADA

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1
****************************************************************************


           -Trade
                 -Wilbur D. Mills speech
                 -Peter M. Flanigan
                       -Committee on International Economic Policy [CIEP]
                              -Annual report
           -Shultz’s call to Turner
                 -Canada’s cabinet meeting


****************************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2
[National security]
[Duration: 28s]

      CANADA

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2
****************************************************************************


           -Turner’s attendance at Canada’s cabinet meeting

      Economy
                                               -36-

                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                        (rev. July-2010)
                                                              Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)


             -Shultz’s trip to Union of Soviet Socialist Republics [USSR]
                   -Shultz’s impressions on USSR’s leadership
                   -Leonid I. Brezhnev
                          -Manner, personality

An unknown man entered at an unknown time after 4:05 pm.

       Refreshment

The unknown man left and Steven B. Bull entered at an unknown time before 5:00 pm.

       Arthur F. Burns

       President's schedule
             -Flight to Florida
                    -Delay

Bull left at an unknown time before 5:00 pm.

       Wage and price controls
           -Inflation problems
           -Meeting of economic advisors
                  -Reports
                         -Herbert Stein, Burns
                         -John T. Dunlop
                         -Roy L. Ash
           -Administrations plans
                  -Formulation
                  -Implementation
                         -Public concern
                               -Food prices
                  -Dunlop
                  -Stein
                         -Support for current policies
                  -Ezra Solomon
                         -Support for price freeze
                  -William E. Simon
                         -Contracts with business
                         -Phase III
                                  -37-

      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                          Tape Subject Log
                           (rev. July-2010)
                                                    Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)


-Current problems
      -Phase III compared with Phase II
            -Food prices
                   -International scope
                          -Travel
                               -Perspective
      -Shultz's opposition to controls
            -Discussion at Camp David
            -Problem of ending controls
-Meetings with President
      -Economic advisors
            -Scheduling
                   -California
-Current problems
      -Solutions
            -Partial freeze
      -Controls
            -Opposition
                   -Raw agricultural products
      -Prices
            -International scope
      -Burns
            -Support for Phase III
            -Interest rates
            -Work on budget
            -Proposals
                   -Pre-notification of price increases
      -90-day price freeze
            -Return to Phase I
      -August 1971 comparison
            -Economic state
                   -Excess capacity
            -Political advantages
      -Price freeze
            -Long-range problems
                   -Consumer demand
                   -Inflation
                   -Belief in markets
            -Political impact
                                      -38-

           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                Tape Subject Log
                                 (rev. July-2010)
                                                     Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)


          -Food prices
               -Significance
                     -Business community
                     -Raw agricultural products
     -Labor-Management Advisory Committee
          -Meeting
               -President's presence
          -Proposals
          -Labor
               -Opposition to Phase I
                     -Wage controls
               -George Meany
               -Attitude toward inflation
               -President's meeting with labor leaders
                     -Timing
               -Reaction to recent price rises
                     -Miami, Florida
                     -Wholesale price index
     -Labor
          -Meeting with President
               -Scheduling
               -Location
     -Labor-Management Advisory Committee
          -Commission on Industrial Peace [?]
               -Dunlop
               -Frank E. Fitzsimmons
                     -Transportation
               -James D. Hodgson
               -Shultz's attendance
               -President’s role
               -Charles W. Colson's attendance
                     -Problem
               -Purpose
          -Colson
               -Work with labor leaders
               -Conflict with Meany
               -Closeness to administration

Pennsylvania Central Railroad
                                     -39-

           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                              Tape Subject Log
                               (rev. July-2010)
                                                     Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)


     -Congressional act
          -Strike limitations
     -Administration proposals on bankruptcy
          -Study group
                -Claude S. Brinegar, Simon, Kenneth W. Dam
                -Proposals
     -Federal government’s role
          -Private solution
     -Administration proposal
          -Retention of efficient lines
                -Identification and separation as new corporation
                       -Profitable operation
          -Old claims
                -Labor
                       -Source of cash
                             -Selling stock
          -Report for President
     -Federal government operation
          -Study group
                -Expertise
                       -Simon
          -Uneconomical portions
                -Sale
                -Judge's decision on assets
                       -Responsibility
          -Recommendations to Congress
                -Big business
                       -Economic support

Congressional relations
           -Shultz’s meeting with Mills
                 -Future cooperation
                 -Meet the Press appearance
                        -Transcript
                             -Tax reform
                             -Trade
                 -International monetary system
                 -Shultz’s call
                 -Mills’s unpredictability
                                      -40-

            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                               Tape Subject Log
                                (rev. July-2010)
                                                       Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)



Economy
     -Meany
           -Shultz's call
                 -Fitzsimmons [?]
                 -President's opposition to wage controls
                        -Farmers
     -Farm subsidies
           -Administrative proposals
                 -Farmers’ Congress members
                        -Problems
                        -Budget vetoes
                        -Votes
     -Trade
           -Shultz's testimony on taxes and trade
                 -Briefing of Congress
           -Work with Mills
     -International monetary reform
           -Shultz’s meeting with Anthony Barker
           -Trade
           -Energy
           -Foreign leaders
                 -Valery Giscard d'Estaing
                 -Helmut H. W. Schmidt, Barber
                 -Political influence
           -Meetings
                 -Location
                        -Treasury Department
                        -White House
                        -Camp David
                 -Timing
                 -Location
                        -White House
                 -Anatoliy F. Dobrynin
                 -Arrangements
                        -Lunch
                        -Entry to White House
                              -Privacy
                        -President's presence
                                      -41-

           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                               Tape Subject Log
                                (rev. July-2010)
                                                         Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)


                        -Location
     -Tax credits for private education
           -Refundability
                  -Shultz's support
                  -Ways and Means bill
                        -Opposition
                              -Constitutional question
                                    -Tax deduction
           -Political dimensions
                  -Burden on Congress
                  -Reaction of Catholics
                        -Equity issues

Eleanor Roosevelt
     -Elliott Roosevelt
     -Franklin D. Roosevelt
     -Lucy Mercer, Missy Lee Hand
     -Number of children
     -Birth control

Economic issues
     -Tax credits for private education
           -Burden on Congress
                 -Political consideration
           -Burden on Supreme Court
     -Simon
     -Shultz
           -Areas of responsibility
                 -Taxes
                 -Wage and price controls
                        -Phase III
                 -Trade
                 -Labor Department
     -Welfare
           -Family Assistance Plan
           -Negative income tax
           -Herman Kahn
           -Great Britain’s reforms
           -Solutions
                                 -42-

      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                          Tape Subject Log
                           (rev. July-2010)
                                                  Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)


      -Great Britain’s reforms
-Pennsylvania Central Railroad
-Shultz
      -Areas of responsibility
            -Priorities
            -Amount of work
            -Taxes trade
            -Phase III
                   -Commerce Department
                         -Frederick B. Dent
                               -Capabilities
      -Golf
      -Meeting with Meany
      -Meeting with Fitzsimmons
      -Assignments
            -Shultz's administrative role
                   -Helmut (“Hal”) Sonnenfeldt
                   -Henry A. Kissinger's office
                         -Knowledge of Europe trade
                               -International monetary situation
                               -Knowledge of languages
                                     -Russian
                                     -German
                                     -French
      -Sonnenfeldt
            -Work with Shultz
            -Personality
            -Conflicts with Kissinger
            -Intelligence
-Natural gas deal with USSR
      -Sonnenfeldt
            -Kissinger
            -Competence
                   -USSR summit
            -Work with Kissinger
            -Work with Shultz
                   -Simon
            -Intelligence
                                      -43-

            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                               Tape Subject Log
                                (rev. July-2010)
                                                      Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)


Personnel appointments
     -Treasury Department
           -General Counsel
           -Edward C. Schmults
                 -Intelligence
           -George D. Webster
                 -Possible appointment
                 -Shultz’s reaction
                 -Record with labor
                        -Internal Revenue Service [IRS]
                        -Meany
                 -Labor opposition
                 -H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman

Henry Kearns
     -Resignation from Export - Import Bank
     -Replacement
            -Kearn's recommendation
     -[First name unknown] Larsen
            -Background
                  -San Francisco law firm
                  -Ivy League
            -Kearns's opinion
     Pierre-Paul Schweitzer
            -Reappointment to International Monetary Fund [IMF]
                  -Other candidates
                  -Shultz's recommendation
                        -Appointment length
                        -Other candidates
                               -Europeans
            -Post
                  -Importance
                  -Relationship with president
                  -Kissinger

President's trip to Florida
      -Return
      -Demonstration
             -Jewish Defense League
                                     -44-

           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                              Tape Subject Log
                               (rev. July-2010)
                                                     Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)


                 -Miami

Economic policy
     -Phase III
           -Problems
           -Shultz’s meetings with Stein, Dunlop and Burns
           -Labor-Management Advisory Committee
           -Proposals
                 -President's judgment
                        -Criteria
                              -Political implications
                              -Labor
                              -Congressional relations
                              -Stock market
                              -Editorials
                              -Finance and business people
           -Public relations problems
           -Shultz as spokesman
           -Statements and controls
           -Repetition on Phase II
           -Lack of confidence in program
     -Europe
           -Great Britain
                 -Labor relations
                        -Strikes
                        -Spirit of confrontation
                 -Inflation
           -Comparison with US
                 -Economy
                 -Avoidance of class warfare
                 -Political costs
                 -Labor settlements
     -Food prices
           -Complaints
     -Problems
           -Need for action
                 -Public relations considerations
           -Food price freeze
                 -Next month's figures
                                              -45-

                     NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                        Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. July-2010)
                                                             Conversation No. 887-26 (cont’d)


                                -Firing of economists
             -Food prices
                  -Kansas City
                  -Increases in basic commodities
                  -Earl L. Butz
                        -Report to President

       Shultz's trip
             -Press briefing
                     -Call to Turner
                     -Talk with Mills
                            -Dollar

Shultz and Ehrlichman left at an unknown time before 5:00 pm.