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Conversation 002-086

TapeTape 2StartWednesday, May 5, 1971 at 10:27 AMEndWednesday, May 5, 1971 at 10:33 AMTape start time03:09:45Tape end time03:15:44ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President);  Laird, Melvin R.Recording deviceWhite House Telephone
AudioNARA Description

On May 5, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and Melvin R. Laird talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 10:27 am and 10:33 am. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 002-086 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 2-86

Date: May 5, 1971
Time: Unknown between 10:27 am and 10:33 am
Location: White House Telephone

The President talked with Melvin R. Laird.

[See Conversation No. 491-20]

     Laird's health

[A transcript of the following portion of this conversation was prepared under court order from
December 1978 through March 1979 for Special Access 8, Ronald V. Dellums, et al. v. James M.
Powell, et al., No. 71-2271. The National Archives and Records Administration produced this
transcript. The National Archives does not guarantee its accuracy.]

[End of transcript]

     Military Command in Panama-Com South
           -David Packard
           -Admiral Thomas H. Moorer
           -Henry A. Kissinger
           -Laird
           -Packard's recommendations
           -US-Latin American relations
           -Military assistance program
                 -Moorer's views
                 -Gen. William C. Westmoreland
                 -Staffing

     Military assistance command
           -Nixon Doctrine
           -Gen. [Forename unknown] Ignatius
                                               49

                          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                      Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. 9/08)




     Comsouth
         -Alexander M. Haig, Jr.
         -Kissinger
         -State Department
         -Moorer
         -Packard
         -Meeting of Defense leaders                           Conv. No. 2-85 (cont.)
         -Military assistance
         -Foreign policy implications
         -State Department
               -William P. Rogers
               -Charles A. Meyer
         -Forthcoming meeting
Transcript (AI-Generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

Yeah.
Well, I wanted to see how your repair job came.
Oh, it came in very good shape.
I've come along in great shape.
Fine.
Fine.
Are you home yet?
No, no.
They've got me here for a while.
They figured they'd keep me here for 10 days.
Right, right.
So I'll be out of here running things Monday, all right.
Are the nurses pretty?
They are.
They've got some good nurses.
That's the stuff.
I know, I know.
Well, as a matter of fact, as you noted, they've handled the demonstrators very well.
I'm awfully glad that, you know, we've got to give high marks to Mitchell.
And the chief of police, we just fell into a good one.
He has been excellent.
Yeah, he's been very good.
He's used the strength, but he's used it with very... And the military fellows have been just superb.
I think...
This is one time, you know, we... Ted Beal over there, the undersecretary of the Army, kept his cool and did a good job.
He was talking with...
He was the key man over there.
He was in charge, and he stayed right there down in that with him all the time, and he was good.
Yeah, well, we're going to see that all the people that participated get little notes so that they get some commendations at the proper time.
When it's over, they're going up to Congress today.
I hope they go into a few of our friends' offices that might stir them up.
I think it's put them on a hell of a spot.
You know, some of those guys are really moaning that they got out in front too early and endorsed the demonstration, don't you think?
Yeah, they got a little bit cropped on that, I think.
Muskie and Teddy and the rest, because these people don't...
They're backing away a little bit, don't you think, Mr. President?
Well, they have to back away, but you know, for the average person, Mel...
he doesn't separate the one it's just a demonstration you know the one really that the one really that that was effective as against us was the veterans run because of that since then this this group god what's a horrible looking bunch of people i on television they just look so bad that people are going to just throw up their hands well if the vet says things would have been separated by about three or four weeks from this operation it would have been a
been a little difficult to handle.
That's right.
That's right.
The fact that it's blurred now makes it look all part of the same.
Well, anyway, you take care of yourself, and you've got a pretty day.
I'm keeping up on everything.
I know you are.
I'm going to hold.
I had Dave Packard in yesterday with the chief, with Marr.
And that ComSouth thing, you know, is really, apparently, there's just a direct split on that between the chiefs and Dave.
And so I thought I'd wait until you got out, and maybe you and Dave and Henry and Maura and I better trash around a little bit more on it.
I tell you, the real problem I have with it at this time, I think today's recommendations, which I assume you support, his recommendation for getting rid of the command, is the right long-range thing.
The problem I have right now is that with the Latinos all worrying about whether we're paying attention to them, and also with the military being about their only...
Well, some of them aren't any good either, but there are some areas of strength.
It's a question as to whether our timing is exactly the right thing right now.
That's really what we want to think about.
What we want to do is upgrade the military assistance program in South America, though.
We have to do that.
The only real split, of course, there, as you know, Mr. President, is that the Army wants to maintain an additional four-star general, but Moore doesn't feel strongly about that.
Doesn't he?
But Westy feels that he can't afford to give up a four-star slot.
Is that what it is?
That's really what it's basically, and Westy takes a strong position that
on the four star spot.
If we gave a military assistance director four stars up here in the Pentagon, Westy would back away, but I can't guarantee that and we shouldn't guarantee that.
But that's really part of it.
And the Army has some problems.
Well, the Army needs, as a matter of fact, Mel, I wouldn't have any problem on that.
I think the military assistance guy should be a four-star man.
It's a hell of an important thing under the Nixon doctrine.
We cannot back away from this.
And frankly, if you want to move in that direction, I'll support it.
Well, I have this Ignatius coming over who's been the commander in Berlin, and he's a two-star, and we're making him three-star, and I just don't think he can move him that fast.
He's the best man for the job right now.
He's done an excellent job.
Well, now, I will hold.
I'm going to hold this ComSouth thing until you get back.
Is that all right?
You don't have to decide it this week, do we?
And you can tell both Delmore and... Did the presentation go all right?
Did they get along all right in presenting it to you?
Oh, yeah, it was fine.
They had it there, and...
They were just great, but they pointed out they just disagreed.
And so I sat there and thought about it and said, well, I'll wait.
Haig was here, of course, and listening.
Henry's in the West Coast.
But it seems to me that this is something that you, just a small group, you...
I don't think we ought to get straight in on it, basically.
I think it's just you, Henry, and maybe Moore and Packard and myself.
Don't you think so?
And then let's talk about what it really gets down to is that
is the foreign policy implication in Latin America at the present time.
And as far as state is concerned, the reason I'm not particularly interested in their coming is that they, Mel, don't really, I'm not speaking of Bill, but I'm referring to Meyer and his group, they aren't really for military assistance down there, you know.
No, and what they want is to cut back the military.
Well, that's the point.
You see, I am for it, and I don't want this to appear to be a cutback.
No, it can't be that.
To appear to be a cutback in the military attitude.
I just don't think that's the right way to sell this.
Okay?
I understand.
Well, we'll plan next week sometime, but in the meantime, you tell the other guys we're thinking about it, okay?
Fine.
Bye.
Bye.
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