Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 3 › Conversation 003-071

Nixon phone call with Kissinger on Mathias Resolution and John Sherman Cooper

Wednesday, May 19, 1971 · 7:44 PM ET · White House Telephone · 4 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); White House operator; Kissinger, Henry A.Conversation003-071 on Tape 3 (tape position 01:31:07–01:34:53)StartWednesday, May 19, 1971 at 7:44 PMEndWednesday, May 19, 1971 at 7:44 PMRecording deviceWhite House TelephoneSourceNixon Library record for 003-071 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and Henry Kissinger discuss the successful defeat of the Mathias resolution, which failed by a vote of 73 to 24. They attribute the legislative victory to the administration's firm stance and strategic coordination with Congressional leaders, noting that the vote of Senator John Sherman Cooper was pivotal in securing the outcome. Additionally, they discuss maintaining morale within the State Department and reaffirm the value of William P. Rogers' continued tenure as Secretary of State amid the administration's recent foreign policy successes.

Audio

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Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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· Click a timestamp to play from that point; the page address then links to that moment (e.g. #t=125).
Hello?
Yes?
Hello, did you call?
Um, Dr. Kissinger asked for you.
All right, fine.
Do you want to talk with him?
Yeah.
All right.
There you go.
Mr. President?
Yeah?
Uh, you know about the Messiah's post?
No.
73 to 24 in our favor.
My God.
Cooper's with, and that's, they all went with him.
So that phone call did pay off.
Right.
I think I should call him.
That would be nice.
23 to 24.
Well, good God.
23 to 24.
Now that finishes it, doesn't it?
Oh, yeah.
Dominic withdrew his amendment.
Yeah.
And now they only got crackless.
You know, 20,000 people who say let's withdraw 20,000, but we can handle that easily.
Right.
That's great news.
Great news.
Yeah.
I've also talked to Rogers, and I think that's all fine now.
You do, huh?
Did you tell him that we went, we're going with him, and tell us that?
Well, that's what I made the excuse for calling him.
Yeah.
And I said, I just want you to know, Bill, this is something that wasn't common effort, and there won't be a word in which anyone except the president will get personal credit.
And why doesn't Alex come to the big briefing as well?
Right, right.
The whole presidency.
Right.
Good.
And he's delighted.
Good, good.
And I think we've come out of this.
Elliot Richardson called again and he said, I just hope you know that this is tremendous.
I talked to Clark McGregor and he...
He's now beginning to realize what it is.
This is tremendous.
And I think...
It has turned into a good week.
Bill seemed to be in a relatively good mood, huh?
Oh, yeah.
Well, he's got to relax.
What the hell?
He's now at a time, Henry, when we're going to be winning a few.
He ought to stick around.
It's going to be the administration.
Who the hell wants to be Secretary of State in a losing administration?
That's right.
And who's going to say, well, because I wasn't consulted, I'm going to get out?
The only time you get out when you're not consulted is when you lose.
Five years from now, the only thing people will remember is that he was Secretary of State and what may have turned into one of the most successful foreign policy administrations.
Yeah, and we can handle that.
Yeah, right.
History books will remember who that was.
Right, right.
Yeah, we can put that also.
Oh, we will.
So good about Matthias.
The son of a bitch deserved it.
24.
You know, it's amazing to me that our votes are so big.
We're beating these guys four or five to one.
Well, yeah, legislative leaders meeting was a disaster.
I mean, I
You heard him whining and remember Griffin and all the rest saying, I'm sorry to tell you somebody's going to vote for something.
I said, nope, we ain't going to do it.
If you had shown any uncertainty, Mr. President, that's exactly what would have happened.
But because you didn't stand, what the hell were they going to do?
Go against three presidents?
Now, do you know that Cooper did vote for us?
Oh, yeah.
That's when they turned.
Good.
I'll call it.
Fine.
Good job.
Great.
Right.
Thank you.

NARA Description

On May 19, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and Henry A. Kissinger talked on the telephone at 7:44 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 003-071 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 003-071

Date: May 19, 1971
Time: 7:44 pm

       Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542

Location: White House Telephone

The White House operator talked with the President.

     Call from Henry A. Kissinger

The President talked with Kissinger between 7:44 pm and 7:47 pm.; background noise appears in
the original recording.

     Mathias resolution
         -Vote
                -John Sherman Cooper
                      -Phone call
                -Effect
                      -Peter H. Dominick's amendment
                      -Troop level

     William P. Rogers
          -Kissinger's call
                -U. Alexis Johnson
          -International Telecommunications Satellite Consortium [INTELSAT] ceremony

     Mathias resolution
         -Elliot L. Richardson's call to Kissinger
         -Clark MacGregor
         -Rogers’ response
         -Effect

     Rogers
         -Tenure in office
         -Perspective on Nixon administration foreign policy

     Mathias Resolution

       Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542

            -Vote
            -Mathias
                 -Talk with Kissinger
            -Vote
                 -Administration campaign
                      -President's meeting with Congressional leaders
                            -Robert P. Griffin
                      -Position of former Presidents
                 -Cooper
                      -Forthcoming call from President

Also recorded on May 19, 1971

  • 003-069 6:11 PM · 4 min — President Richard M. Nixon and William P. Rogers talked on the telephone from 6:11 pm to 6:15 pm.
  • 003-070 6:16 PM · 4 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 6:16 pm and 7:44 pm.
  • 003-072 7:47 PM · 5 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 7:47 pm and 7:48 pm.
  • 003-073 7:48 PM · 3 min — President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman talked on the telephone from 7:48 pm to 7:50 pm.
  • 003-074 7:50 PM · 3 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 7:50 pm and 7:55 pm.
  • 003-075 7:55 PM · 1 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Henry A. Kissinger talked on the telephone from 7:55 pm to 7:56 pm.
  • 003-076 7:56 PM · 4 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 7:56 pm and 7:58 pm.
  • 003-077 7:58 PM · 34 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Julie Nixon Eisenhower talked on the telephone from 7:58 pm to 7:59 pm.

All 48 conversations from May 19, 1971 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 003-071, May 19, 1971. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/003-071 (accessed October 9, 2026).