Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 005-101
Date: Wednesday, June 16, 1971 at 8:22 PM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); Ehrlichman, John D.
Recording device: White House Telephone
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/005-101

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[0:01] Hello.
[0:01] Yes, sir.
[0:02] Mr. Ehrlichman.
[0:03] Yeah, John, I was just reading the memorandum with regard to the grand jury thing.
[0:07] Have you talked to Mitchell about it?
[0:09] No, I haven't.
[0:09] I thought I'd better clear with you first.
[0:11] Yeah.
[0:11] Because I didn't know what you might have been talking with him about.
[0:15] No, I haven't talked to him about it, no.
[0:17] I'll give him a call tonight.
[0:19] Fine.
[0:21] Well, what, how does, your thought is...
[0:27] I mean, it isn't a question, I mean, the delay is one thing.
[0:31] I think in terms of reconsidering whether we go ahead with it, of course, is something else.
[0:40] That's something that has profound implications.
[0:44] I understand.
[0:45] It just occurred to me today as I read the pleadings that there was a possibility that we could get the kind of an adverse finding on the merits in this case.
[0:55] hearing that we really ought to have a chance to take a look at.
[0:59] If we want to launch that grand jury and then get an adverse ruling from the court and stop it, then I think we've got a bad... Well, what does it really get down to?
[1:09] If you delay it, does that mean the times goes ahead and
[1:12] The temporary restraining order apparently applies for four days only, is that right?
[1:17] It expires by its terms Saturday at noon, or 1 o'clock.
[1:22] So they'd go ahead and print?
[1:23] They'd print the Sunday edition anyway, regardless of what the grand jury did.
[1:28] Yeah.
[1:30] I'm not too concerned about what they print now.
[1:35] The point is, you don't want to have an adverse...
[1:38] I don't want to appear to be calling off a grand jury in mid-flight.
[1:42] Right, right.
[1:44] That makes a lot of sense.
[1:47] Well, have you talked to Marty about it?
[1:48] No, I'll give John Mitchell a call.
[1:51] Whoever you think is really in charge, you know, you might call and chat a bit about it.
[1:55] All right.
[1:56] I agree with you.
[1:57] It's important not to have an adverse court ruling right in the face of all this.
[2:02] But we have to go, naturally, we have to go forward on the, one way or another, on the,
[2:10] Not only on the Times, but on the person who... Obviously, the FBI thing can go forward, I understand.
[2:16] Right.
[2:17] That is going forward, is it not?
[2:19] Right.
[2:19] That's very vigorously underway.
[2:20] Well, don't you have to... Now, on that, does that require a grand jury, or how does that...
[2:24] It would, you see, but there isn't any reason why they can't go ahead and finish their investigation and then convene the grand jury on Monday instead of on Thursday.
[2:34] And then you'll know what the court did on the TRO.
[2:36] In effect, but the Times...
[2:39] go ahead and print.
[2:40] Sure.
[2:42] If we get an adverse ruling.
[2:44] I think the chances are that the court will grant an injunction pending a trial on the merits.
[2:50] Yeah.
[2:51] Or he'll extend the TRO one or the other, but that's just a hunch because the issues are very complex.
[2:57] I'd be very surprised if he could dispose of them Friday or Saturday.
[3:01] Yeah, they are complex, I know.
[3:02] Yeah.
[3:04] All right.
[3:04] Well, you...
[3:05] I'll talk with him.
[3:06] You should have talked to John.
[3:07] Right.
[3:07] Kick it around.
[3:08] Okay.
[3:08] Fine.
[3:09] Thank you.