{"conversationCode":"007-092","tapeNumber":7,"conversationNumber":92,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-007-092","startDateTime":"1971-08-11T23:58:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1971-08-12T00:04:00.000Z","startDate":"11-Aug-1971","startTime":"7:58 PM","endDate":"11-Aug-1971","endTime":"8:04 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Kissinger, Henry A.;","description":"On August 11, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and Henry A. Kissinger talked on the telephone from 7:58 pm to 8:04 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 007-092 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"WHT","recordingDevice":"White House Telephone","latitudeEstimated":38.89767,"longitudeEstimated":-77.03655,"chronCode":1,"chronRelease":"First Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"5-Oct-1999","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 7-92\n\nDate: August 11, 1971\nTime: 7:58 pm - 8:04 pm\nLocation: White House Telephone\n\nThe President talked with Henry A. Kissinger.\n\n     Kissinger's briefing\n          -College interns\n\n     Foreign relations\n          -Kissinger's message to Anatoliy F. Dobrynin\n                -Andrei A. Gromyko\n                -Gerard C. Smith\n                -William P. Rogers\n                      -Dobrynin and Gromyko\n                           -Signing ceremony\n\n**********************************************************************\n\n[Previous PRMPA Personal Returnable (G) withdrawal reviewed under deed of gift 08/09/2019.\nSegment cleared for release.]\n[Personal Returnable]\n[007-092-w002]\n[Duration: 1m 16s]\n\n      John V. Lindsay’s party affiliation\n             -Henry A. Kissinger’s opinion\n             -Liberals\n                     -Henry A. Kissinger's talk with Gardner Cowles\n                             -August 7, 1971\n                             -Mary Ann (Harrison) Lindsay\n                                      -Toughness\n             -Presidential candidacy, 1972 or 1976\n                     -Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy\n                     -Nelson A. Rockefeller\n\n**********************************************************************\n\n     Budget\n         -The President''s talk with George P. Shultz\n         -Administration policy\n              -Shultz\n              -David Packard\n              -Tax increase\n              -Forthcoming meeting\n                    -Joint Chiefs of Staff\n                    -Kissinger, Shultz and Packard\n                           -Melvin R. Laird\n                    -Kissinger's meeting with Shultz\n\n     The President's talk with Shultz\n          -National Security\n               -Defense\n                      -Berlin\n                      -Strategic Arms Limitation Talks [SALT]\n                      -The People's Republic of China [PRC]\n\n     Budget\n         -Defense","filename":["007-092.mp3"],"tapeStart":"03:15:27","tapeEnd":"03:20:50","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Kissinger, Henry A."],"prevCode":"007-091","nextCode":"007-093","transcript":[{"start":0.03,"end":2.07,"text":"Hello."},{"start":2.31,"end":2.77,"text":"Mr. President."},{"start":2.79,"end":3.29,"text":"Hi, Henry."},{"start":3.31,"end":5.66,"text":"How'd your briefing go?"},{"start":7.18,"end":9.9,"text":"Oh, uh, it's a completely different atmosphere now."},{"start":10,"end":10.56,"text":"Even with the interns?"},{"start":10.66,"end":10.84,"text":"Oh, yeah."},{"start":11.2,"end":13.95,"text":"These are college kids, of course."},{"start":13.97,"end":14.25,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":14.27,"end":16.23,"text":"You were good to do it."},{"start":16.25,"end":17.99,"text":"I didn't really ask for it."},{"start":18.01,"end":21.52,"text":"We picked these kids, and they're not the bastards."},{"start":21.54,"end":22.2,"text":"They're not the worst bastards."},{"start":22.36,"end":22.8,"text":"Well, I just..."},{"start":32.16,"end":47.51,"text":"I called back to Brennan and gave him the message."},{"start":47.52,"end":47.87,"text":"How'd he take it?"},{"start":47.88,"end":50.55,"text":"He said it for September 30th, Mr. President, because Gromyko has to go back to France for that state visit they're paying there."},{"start":50.57,"end":50.87,"text":"September 30th?"},{"start":50.89,"end":51.91,"text":"For the ceremony here."},{"start":51.93,"end":52.21,"text":"Right, good."},{"start":53.84,"end":59.99,"text":"And then that'll go through regular channels."},{"start":60.01,"end":72.71,"text":"Well, I told them that they should put it into Smith and I'll call Rogers tomorrow and tell him to work out the details with Sabrina."},{"start":72.73,"end":72.91,"text":"Will you?"},{"start":72.93,"end":75.8,"text":"I mean, we've got to get a room and so forth."},{"start":75.82,"end":77.34,"text":"Just let Rogers know that they came in here and I said, well, we..."},{"start":85.54,"end":97.4,"text":"consider going over there."},{"start":97.42,"end":98.52,"text":"You know, you've gone over the signing ceremony before."},{"start":98.54,"end":102.14,"text":"Yeah, and tell Bill that I want him to bring that for me to do it, but if he feels that I want to, once you say this, look, Bill, the President mentioned this, but if you feel that"},{"start":117.19,"end":117.77,"text":"Right."},{"start":117.78,"end":118.68,"text":"Make him feel better."},{"start":194.72,"end":201.05,"text":"Henry, on the budget, I talked to Schultz."},{"start":201.07,"end":207.95,"text":"Let me tell you the line I want you to take."},{"start":207.97,"end":209.99,"text":"We've got to take the line of the 79 being sort of a, you know, we can't go above that at this point."},{"start":210.01,"end":211.17,"text":"As Schultz says, look, we're doing all these other things."},{"start":228.77,"end":244.35,"text":"At an appropriate time, I will move first."},{"start":244.37,"end":247.82,"text":"But I think at the meeting Friday, let's be very, very... We don't have to just say that, well..."},{"start":247.84,"end":248.32,"text":"But you don't have to..."},{"start":248.34,"end":249.42,"text":"I wouldn't announce a figure at the meeting."},{"start":249.44,"end":250.4,"text":"No, but because the joint chiefs won't be there."},{"start":250.42,"end":252.32,"text":"We'll just go over the whole thing."},{"start":252.34,"end":254.21,"text":"But it seems to me that you and Schultz and Packard work at the hangout without layers."},{"start":259.3,"end":264.61,"text":"Well, fine."},{"start":264.63,"end":265.03,"text":"You get his feeling."},{"start":265.05,"end":269.49,"text":"And you tell him your truth."},{"start":269.5,"end":271.69,"text":"I told Schultz today that I said, look, the national security is going to require upping this defense budget."},{"start":271.71,"end":273.98,"text":"He said, well, how can you up the defense budget?"},{"start":274,"end":275.02,"text":"He said, I agree, but he said, because of the Navy."},{"start":275.04,"end":275.4,"text":"How can you do it?"},{"start":283.46,"end":302.48,"text":"I said, on the other hand, and Schultz says, the reason you're having success is because you're being strong."},{"start":302.5,"end":302.66,"text":"Exactly."},{"start":302.68,"end":305.78,"text":"And he said, on the other hand, right now, you can't appear that just as you're having success, you've got to increase the budget, increase taxes."},{"start":305.8,"end":306.06,"text":"See my point?"},{"start":306.08,"end":306.18,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":306.2,"end":306.88,"text":"And I think he's right about that."},{"start":306.9,"end":308.37,"text":"Right, except that what got us to this point was your strength last year."},{"start":308.39,"end":308.85,"text":"I know, I know, I know."},{"start":308.87,"end":311.11,"text":"But I mean, at this point, we get to this point, then to increase taxes, say we're going to have more than that."},{"start":311.88,"end":319.33,"text":"Now, let me work it out with Colt's week."},{"start":319.36,"end":321.67,"text":"We will come up with something that will not require an increase in taxes."},{"start":321.69,"end":322.09,"text":"Do the best you can."},{"start":322.11,"end":322.21,"text":"Okay."},{"start":322.23,"end":322.79,"text":"Right, right, Mr. President."},{"start":322.81,"end":322.97,"text":"Finally."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and Henry Kissinger discuss coordinating a diplomatic signing ceremony with Soviet Foreign Minister Andrei Gromyko, slated for September 30th, and the necessity of managing State Department involvement through William Rogers. The conversation also addresses the administration's fiscal strategy, specifically balancing the push for increased national security and defense spending against the political liability of raising taxes. Nixon directs Kissinger to coordinate with George Shultz and David Packard to develop a budget approach that maintains military strength without necessitating immediate tax hikes.","topics":["Foreign Policy","Soviet Union","Defense Budget","Fiscal Policy","Diplomatic Relations","George Shultz"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-05T22:32:18.484Z"},"topicSlugs":["foreign-policy","soviet-union","defense-budget","fiscal-policy","diplomatic-relations","george-shultz"],"audioDurationSec":323,"audioFiles":[{"file":"007-092.mp3","bytes":7752097,"durationSec":322.93,"bitrate":192041,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:21.471Z","findingAidSource":"nixonlibrary.gov subject log (2024-05), reslice-v2","findingAidUpdatedAt":"2026-09-18T08:42:34.864Z","transcriptGapSeconds":50,"transcriptGapShare":0.15,"transcriptQuality":"incomplete","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/007-092.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/007-092","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/7/conversation-007-092","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}