{"conversationCode":"011-040","tapeNumber":11,"conversationNumber":40,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-011-040","startDateTime":"1971-10-11T18:47:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1971-10-11T18:49:00.000Z","startDate":"11-Oct-1971","startTime":"2:47 PM","endDate":"11-Oct-1971","endTime":"2:49 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Mitchell, John N.;","description":"On October 11, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and John N. Mitchell talked on the telephone from 2:47 pm to 2:49 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 011-040 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"WHT","recordingDevice":"White House Telephone","latitudeEstimated":38.89767,"longitudeEstimated":-77.03655,"chronCode":2,"chronRelease":"Second Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"26-Oct-2000","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 011-040\n\n Date: October 11, 1971\n Time: 2:47 pm - 2:49 pm\n Location: White House Telephone\n\n The President talked with John N. Mitchell.\n\n [See Conversation No. 287-15]\n\n        Supreme Court nomination\n             -Mildred L. Lillie\n                  -Catholic\n                  -Italian husband\n                         -John A. Volpe\n                  -Court record\n             -Department of Justice [DOJ] recommendations\n\nRichard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542","filename":["011-040.mp3"],"tapeStart":"01:00:03","tapeEnd":"01:02:26","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Mitchell, John N."],"prevCode":"011-039","nextCode":"011-041","transcript":[{"start":1.21,"end":2.17,"text":"Hello."},{"start":2.19,"end":5.6,"text":"Yeah, how are you getting along with the woman?"},{"start":5.64,"end":6.87,"text":"Oh, just going great."},{"start":7.53,"end":9.21,"text":"Did you find out, or do you know that she's Catholic?"},{"start":9.23,"end":9.87,"text":"She's Catholic."},{"start":10.39,"end":11.01,"text":"That's great."},{"start":11.36,"end":11.74,"text":"Yes, sir."},{"start":12.18,"end":12.92,"text":"That's great."},{"start":12.94,"end":14.78,"text":"And she got a little Italian blood?"},{"start":16.33,"end":19.18,"text":"Not according to the rhetoric, but it may be."},{"start":19.22,"end":22.56,"text":"She's sure got a distinguished-looking Italian husband, though."},{"start":22.98,"end":23.8,"text":"And he's a lawyer."},{"start":24.06,"end":24.3,"text":"Yes."},{"start":26.41,"end":28.69,"text":"You know, I'm not really being facetious."},{"start":28.71,"end":30.45,"text":"I really think this helps on the Volpe thing."},{"start":30.93,"end":31.43,"text":"What do you think?"},{"start":31.54,"end":32.22,"text":"I do indeed."},{"start":32.58,"end":35.2,"text":"I mean, after all, she's a Catholic married to an Italian."},{"start":35.3,"end":36.68,"text":"Yes, it's a fair shot."},{"start":37.48,"end":41.51,"text":"He is just what you would want a judge's wife to be."},{"start":41.53,"end":43.25,"text":"He's a plotting mediocrity."},{"start":44.73,"end":44.95,"text":"Ha, ha, ha."},{"start":45.91,"end":48.38,"text":"And rather distinguished looking, you know."},{"start":48.86,"end":49.34,"text":"Is he a lawyer?"},{"start":49.66,"end":54.3,"text":"Yes, a lawyer in practice for 35 years out there without great distinction."},{"start":54.88,"end":55.72,"text":"Right."},{"start":55.78,"end":59.69,"text":"So that nobody's going to accuse him of influencing the judge's decisions."},{"start":60.17,"end":60.49,"text":"Correct."},{"start":60.95,"end":61.45,"text":"Good."},{"start":61.47,"end":65.75,"text":"And so far as we can see, he checks out all right."},{"start":67.08,"end":73.96,"text":"He's been in debt a little bit with some notes at the bank, but he seems to have paid them off and have a reasonably good standing in the community."},{"start":74.5,"end":78.02,"text":"So far it just looks great."},{"start":78.08,"end":87.3,"text":"And she's been reversed enough by the Supreme Court in California in criminal cases to give her a good standing with the law and order people."},{"start":87.32,"end":89.32,"text":"Good, good, good."},{"start":89.36,"end":91.8,"text":"She's got a good personality, I think."},{"start":93.54,"end":97.37,"text":"People will see that she's not one of these frigid bitches, you know."},{"start":97.41,"end":99.11,"text":"That's right, I know, the terrible ones."},{"start":99.85,"end":101.77,"text":"Well, this business of the..."},{"start":102.28,"end":104.42,"text":"by the Catholic thing, and it's very good."},{"start":104.76,"end":105.62,"text":"Married to an Italian."},{"start":105.9,"end":106.26,"text":"Okay."},{"start":106.86,"end":114.51,"text":"So far so good, and hopefully we will have a package for you to approve to send to the bar here the next day or so."},{"start":114.53,"end":114.63,"text":"Good."},{"start":115.01,"end":115.51,"text":"Fine, John."},{"start":115.59,"end":117.61,"text":"So that we can keep on target next week."},{"start":117.83,"end":118.92,"text":"Great."},{"start":118.94,"end":119.06,"text":"Great."},{"start":119.08,"end":119.48,"text":"Good."},{"start":119.5,"end":121.38,"text":"I understand you're going to rock them again tomorrow."},{"start":121.8,"end":122.38,"text":"I may, yeah."},{"start":122.6,"end":126.93,"text":"I don't think they expect much."},{"start":129.41,"end":129.83,"text":"I wouldn't."},{"start":130.57,"end":130.63,"text":"No."},{"start":130.88,"end":131.78,"text":"Wouldn't believe so."},{"start":132.12,"end":132.55,"text":"Not much."},{"start":133.01,"end":133.61,"text":"Okay."},{"start":133.69,"end":135.42,"text":"That ought to tip them a little bit."},{"start":135.66,"end":135.9,"text":"Right."},{"start":136.74,"end":137.54,"text":"Very good, sir."},{"start":137.75,"end":137.89,"text":"Thanks."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and Attorney General John Mitchell discuss the vetting process for the potential Supreme Court nomination of Mildred L. Lillie. They evaluate the political advantages of her Catholic faith and her marriage to an Italian husband, while also reviewing her judicial record and her husband’s professional background. Mitchell confirms that a nomination package is being prepared for the President's final approval to ensure the appointment remains on schedule.","topics":["Supreme Court nomination","Mildred L. Lillie","John N. Mitchell","Judicial appointments","Department of Justice"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-05T23:18:55.552Z"},"topicSlugs":["supreme-court-nomination","mildred-l-lillie","john-n-mitchell","judicial-appointments","department-of-justice"],"audioDurationSec":140,"audioFiles":[{"file":"011-040.mp3","bytes":4481937,"durationSec":139.93,"bitrate":256239,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:22.040Z","findingAidSource":"nixonlibrary.gov subject log (2024-05), reslice-v2","findingAidUpdatedAt":"2026-09-18T08:42:35.685Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/011-040.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/011-040","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/11/conversation-011-040","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}