Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 011-047
Date: Monday, October 11, 1971 at 9:26 PM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); Kissinger, Henry A.
Recording device: White House Telephone
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/011-047
National Archives Catalog: https://catalog.archives.gov/id/417189991 (NAID 417189991)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[0:00] Yeah.
[0:01] Dr. Kissinger's there.
[0:03] Yeah.
[0:03] How'd you get along with Johnson?
[0:08] With Alex Johnson?
[0:08] Yeah.
[0:09] That went along very well.
[0:10] We're sending out the cables tomorrow morning.
[0:13] Fine.
[0:13] Okay.
[0:14] Now, the only problem is that our friends, the Russians, have, you know, they're such unbelievable treats.
[0:21] They've already notified the Japanese.
[0:25] So it's apt to leak out of there.
[0:29] Who told you?
[0:30] The Japanese told you or Johnson told you?
[0:31] No, the Japanese.
[0:32] Well, Johnson told me that the Japanese told him.
[0:37] Are you sure that's true?
[0:39] I think that's true.
[0:42] Ushiba called him this evening.
[0:46] It's one of these cheap shots of the Russians where they prove that they're more solicitous of the Japs than we are.
[0:54] It isn't on any wires yet.
[0:57] So in another couple of hours, it's going to be too late to make any morning newspapers.
[1:03] And I've called, we've instructed Ziegler to say no comment if anything comes up.
[1:11] Was you informed him about it then?
[1:14] Well, no, I have left standby instructions that as soon as it breaks, we will tell Ziegler to say no comment if it should break.
[1:23] And I'm told to bring them that that's what we were going to do and that I expect them to keep quiet.
[1:28] What did he say?
[1:29] He said, yes, I said, I'll tell you honestly, Anatole, you've made a nickel and lost $1,000 in goodwill.
[1:38] You told him that?
[1:39] Yeah.
[1:39] That's good.
[1:41] Just keep him hopping a little.
[1:43] I don't think they respect you unless you show that you're... Well, the Japanese may not like it.
[1:52] Well...
[1:53] You know, in another couple of hours, I think they will leak it, but if they leak it after midnight, it isn't going to make any newspapers.
[2:06] Well, yeah, yeah, but it'd make the... Yeah, that's all right.
[2:11] What the hell?
[2:13] Henry, if it makes it, it makes it.
[2:14] It's not all that bad.
[2:16] We've kept it pretty damn well.
[2:17] But they didn't leak it because their cables hadn't gone out yet.
[2:21] Right.
[2:22] I sat on their cables.
[2:24] Their cables were going to go out at 9 o'clock tomorrow.
[2:27] And no one was going to be notified until an hour before.
[2:36] Well, that's fine.
[2:39] We'll see.
[2:40] I'm not sure the Japanese are leaking.
[2:43] Well, I'm not sure either.
[2:45] Yeah.
[2:46] It was very nice of you to step in for him.
[2:50] Let me ask you something.
[2:53] I don't plan to get into this, but our position is that, what if they say to you, consider there's one or two Chinas?
[3:03] I would say both sides agree there's only one China.
[3:10] And we believe.
[3:11] Don't the Russians have three votes in the UN?
[3:14] That's right.
[3:15] It's not only a bill of Russia, but it's Ukraine, too, isn't it?
[3:18] I would say the number of votes to sign to a country has nothing to do with the nature of its sovereignty.
[3:28] Yeah, well, I'm going to stay out of it pretty well.
[3:30] I don't know if it'll get in.
[3:32] Fine.
[3:33] Let me ask you another thing.
[3:34] It's a long, it's a way out one, but they might have some, because of a New York turns of the trail, have some question about whether we're going to
[3:44] fighting conference to get the Byrd Amendment deleted.
[3:47] My view is to say no.
[3:49] What do you think?
[3:58] That's a tough one.
[4:00] Because Rogers is out on a limb on it, isn't he?
[4:03] Rogers is out on a limb on it.
[4:07] I don't know whether it can be fudged to say the Congress knows our views.
[4:12] Because then they'll ask you what the views are.
[4:15] Well, we'll see.
[4:20] Well, the Congress is never going to knock that amendment out.
[4:23] You can be sure of that.
[4:26] I'll just say the Secretary has stated our views.
[4:29] How's that?
[4:30] Yeah.
[4:33] Stated our views.
[4:34] But he, of course, said we would fight.
[4:37] Well, shouldn't I just leave it there?
[4:40] Well, I don't know.
[4:42] I'll try to dodge it somewhere.
[4:43] It's damned hard, though.
[4:45] I don't think they'll get it out to the third amendment.
[4:48] I doubt it, too.
[4:49] You won't have that much time, Mr. President.
[4:51] Yeah, I think they're not going to get... Because by the time... Yeah.
[4:54] They'll want to be out by 12.
[4:56] Oh, they'll want to be out there before 12, and I'm going to let them go as soon as they're ready.
[5:00] It'll take you about two minutes or so to read the statement and a minute or so to get settled.
[5:05] My view is, incidentally, I've thought the thing through.
[5:09] I think the best thing is to read the statement and not comment at all and just go to questions immediately.
[5:14] I feel that if I go to questions and go to comment and say what the significance of this is.
[5:19] I wouldn't do that.
[5:20] Just let them dig it out.
[5:23] I wouldn't do it.
[5:27] Yeah.
[5:29] Mm-hmm.
[5:30] Okay.
[5:31] Well, I don't know.
[5:32] I think the Japanese are going to hold it, strangely enough, for once.
[5:36] Well, your instinct on these things is pretty unfailing, and I must say they've held it.
[5:41] I mean, if Ushiba called Transnet 6, then they must have had it for two hours before then.
[5:50] I don't trust, well, P.E.
[5:52] Johnson couldn't tell him to hold it, of course, but that's that.
[5:56] No, Johnson.
[5:58] At least state is going to keep the damn mouth shut, Ray, even though you see the thing as far as we know, isn't it?
[6:05] Oh, I've thrown the fear of God into Johnson.
[6:07] Right.
[6:08] Good.
[6:10] It may hold.
[6:13] Well, holding this long, it didn't make the evening news.
[6:16] I just hate to see the goddamn thing get in the morning papers.
[6:19] That'd be a pity, but
[6:20] Oh, well, if it does, it's not that much of a pity.
[6:24] For the average person, until you've said it, you've experienced it before.
[6:29] You say it on television.
[6:30] That's right.
[6:31] On troop withdrawals, we used to say it's been blown, and it was blown a hundred times.
[6:37] I know.
[6:38] I know.
[6:38] That's right.
[6:39] Well, you're not going to worry about it.
[6:52] And we'll get this done tomorrow.
[6:58] And I'll have a book for you in the evening of substance and a book on the Texas side.
[7:06] We'll talk tomorrow, as I said.
[7:08] If you're feeling like it.
[7:08] If you're not, we'll have you send you to bed.
[7:10] But then if not, I'm saving Thursday rather than Wednesday.
[7:14] I think that's a better day.
[7:15] Excellent.
[7:16] And you can have Wednesday to rest up a little.
[7:18] Wednesday I'm going out of Chicago for that press briefing.
[7:22] Oh, yeah.
[7:23] and a brief daily also.
[7:25] I see, fine.
[7:26] Well, then Thursday will be fine, a good day to get together.
[7:29] Thursday I'll be, we'll be in great shape.
[7:31] Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[7:34] My feeling is, Henry, that our best bet here is to play it, play this just very briefly and read the damn thing deadpan and let them... That's what I would do, Mr. President.
[7:46] Don't volunteer a goddamn thing.
[7:48] Because any possible commentary is going to come out in the question period.
[7:51] That's right, that's right.
[7:53] That's right.
[7:54] And actually, the less we claim for it, I mean... You know, as a matter of fact, what do you think about this if they don't...
[8:04] If it does leak, we just may have Ziegler put it out.
[8:06] No, no, no, no.
[8:07] I think I should still do it.
[8:09] Well, what you might then do is just read it and not answer questions.
[8:13] Yeah, that might be too.
[8:15] I mean, we're not reading it to do them a favor.
[8:17] We're reading it to get you... Yeah.
[8:20] Just to have me say it.
[8:21] To have that said and to have the public identify it with you.
[8:25] We just may read it just before noon then that way.
[8:28] That's right.
[8:29] And I have this for announcement before noon.
[8:31] I might read it a little earlier, hold for release.
[8:35] Okay?
[8:36] Right.
[8:37] All right, Henry.
[8:38] Bye.
[8:38] Bye, Mr. President.