{"conversationCode":"012-019","tapeNumber":12,"conversationNumber":19,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-012-019","startDateTime":"1971-10-20T22:05:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1971-10-20T22:07:00.000Z","startDate":"20-Oct-1971","startTime":"6:05 PM","endDate":"20-Oct-1971","endTime":"6:07 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Moore, Richard A.;","description":"On October 20, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and Richard A. Moore talked on the telephone from 6:05 pm to 6:07 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 012-019 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"WHT","recordingDevice":"White House Telephone","latitudeEstimated":38.89767,"longitudeEstimated":-77.03655,"chronCode":2,"chronRelease":"Second Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"26-Oct-2000","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 012-019\n\nDate: October 20, 1971\nTime: 6:05 pm- 6:07 pm\nLocation: White House Telephone\n\nThe President talked with Richard A. Moore.\n\n[See Conversation No. 282-35]\n\n       Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542\n\n     Supreme Court appointments\n          -American Bar Association [ABA] Committee\n                -Mildred L. Lillie\n                      -Vote\n                      -Compared with other women\n                      -John N. Mitchell\n          -William H. Rehnquist\n                -Howard H. Baker, Jr.\n                -John D. Ehrlichman’s view\n                -ABA involvement\n          -William French Smith\n                -Harvard Law Review\n                -University of Southern California","filename":["012-019.mp3"],"tapeStart":"00:36:36","tapeEnd":"00:38:33","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Moore, Richard A."],"prevCode":"012-018","nextCode":"012-020","transcript":[{"start":1.5,"end":1.94,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":2.1,"end":3.52,"text":"Richard Moore, Mr. President."},{"start":3.54,"end":3.7,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":4.14,"end":5.02,"text":"Yes, Mr. President."},{"start":5.64,"end":12.89,"text":"Dick, we still don't know what's going to happen on the bars."},{"start":13.03,"end":15.02,"text":"Incidentally, that's all worked out."},{"start":15.04,"end":16.24,"text":"That played right into our hands."},{"start":16.3,"end":17.38,"text":"Oh, good."},{"start":18.44,"end":19.72,"text":"You know, it's an interesting thing."},{"start":21.3,"end":24.77,"text":"For your very private information, we're going to get this leaked."},{"start":24.83,"end":26.39,"text":"They voted against her 11 to 1."},{"start":27.27,"end":27.61,"text":"Uh-huh."},{"start":27.63,"end":29.21,"text":"But..."},{"start":30.1,"end":37.9,"text":"But they said that of all the women in the country, she was probably the best qualified that they could think of, but she was not qualified to be in the court."},{"start":38.7,"end":40.34,"text":"How do you like that?"},{"start":40.66,"end":43.91,"text":"That is, of course, what could be more important or better than that?"},{"start":44.05,"end":53.33,"text":"Mitchell has got to, of course, you've got that information now, and that's, you can, but that he says, I says, for Christ's sakes, let's get it out, so that'll."},{"start":54.34,"end":56.5,"text":"We're going to really, really ream them on that."},{"start":56.64,"end":58.16,"text":"Oh, that's superb."},{"start":58.64,"end":68.55,"text":"Now, incidentally, the one thing I want to know, because we're going to have to move fast and I can't consult anybody on it, is on the Rehnquist one, in case I don't get the Baker."},{"start":68.58,"end":72.27,"text":"Baker is the first choice, and we'll know on him within an hour or two."},{"start":73.09,"end":74.64,"text":"But in case we don't get that."},{"start":75.12,"end":79.35,"text":"On Rehnquist, you checked as far as Ehrlichman now."},{"start":79.37,"end":81.87,"text":"Did you say he is for it or not?"},{"start":82.03,"end":84.07,"text":"Very enthusiastic before it, I think I could say."},{"start":84.33,"end":88.74,"text":"He says he'd just throw him right up there and understand we're not going to clear these with the bars."},{"start":88.82,"end":89.34,"text":"I understand."},{"start":89.36,"end":93.8,"text":"It was my impression, Mr. President, that it was Ehrlichman's number one recommendation."},{"start":94.16,"end":94.84,"text":"Okay, good."},{"start":95,"end":95.77,"text":"Well, that's good."},{"start":95.79,"end":97.65,"text":"Between you and him, that's and don't go any further."},{"start":98.41,"end":102.21,"text":"Because it's going to be damn hard for those people to turn him down."},{"start":102.78,"end":110.22,"text":"I checked Bill Smith, who was not on the Harvard Law Review, but he was summa cum laude in Phi Beta Kappa at USC."},{"start":110.52,"end":111.29,"text":"I see."},{"start":111.31,"end":113.07,"text":"So he might have been just below it."},{"start":113.41,"end":114.01,"text":"All right, fine."},{"start":114.15,"end":114.55,"text":"All right, sir."},{"start":114.78,"end":115.58,"text":"Right."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and Richard A. Moore discuss the political fallout from the American Bar Association (ABA) rating Mildred L. Lillie as unqualified for the Supreme Court, with plans to leak the ABA's contradictory acknowledgment that she was nonetheless the best-qualified woman available. The President also seeks confirmation of John Ehrlichman’s support for William H. Rehnquist as a potential fallback candidate should Howard H. Baker, Jr. decline the nomination. Nixon expresses a clear intention to bypass the ABA's approval process for the Rehnquist appointment.","topics":["Supreme Court","American Bar Association","Mildred L. Lillie","William H. Rehnquist","John N. Mitchell","John D. Ehrlichman","Judicial appointments"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-05T23:32:02.513Z"},"topicSlugs":["supreme-court","american-bar-association","mildred-l-lillie","william-h-rehnquist","john-n-mitchell","john-d-ehrlichman","judicial-appointments"],"audioDurationSec":117,"audioFiles":[{"file":"012-019.mp3","bytes":2818088,"durationSec":117.36,"bitrate":192092,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:22.041Z","findingAidSource":"nixonlibrary.gov subject log (2024-05), reslice-v2","findingAidUpdatedAt":"2026-09-18T08:42:36.043Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/012-019.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/012-019","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/12/conversation-012-019","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}