Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 14 › Conversation 014-017

Nixon phone call with Goldwater on National Defense and Amchitka test

Wednesday, November 10, 1971 · 2:51 PM–2:54 PM ET · White House Telephone · 2 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); White House operator; Goldwater, Barry M.Conversation014-017 on Tape 14 (tape position 00:19:55–00:22:56)StartWednesday, November 10, 1971 at 2:51 PMEndWednesday, November 10, 1971 at 2:54 PMRecording deviceWhite House TelephoneSourceNixon Library record for 014-017 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and Senator Barry Goldwater discussed Nixon's recent speeches in New York and Chicago, with a primary focus on the administration's stance on national defense and the necessity of the Amchitka nuclear test. Goldwater praised Nixon's firm position against disarmament, while the President emphasized the dangers posed by Soviet military growth and the failures of the McNamara era. They agreed on the need for the administration to provide Republican lawmakers with informational fact sheets to better defend these policies against environmentalist and congressional criticism.

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Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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You made a hell of a good speech last night.
I saw it down there.
Well, I had to, of course, speak before one of those New York audiences, and I hate them, although we had our friends there.
But, you know, they're so unspontaneous, you know.
Well, I thought they gave you a good response.
Yeah, from New York.
And I think what you said...
particularly needed at this time.
I'm stressing those points every time.
Right.
I, incidentally, I hit the, I thought you'd be interested, no, the defense thing very hard.
I know you did.
In Chicago.
I thought you'd be interested.
I said, now look here, there are those that say we should lay down this burden of defense.
I said, if we lay it down, no other free nation's going to pick it up and we can't leave this vacuum.
And then I went on to say that, I said, now, I had to make a very difficult decision on this just over the last weekend.
I said I had to make a test, this decision on Amchitka.
I mean, testing a defensive weapon, which the Soviet Union has already, of course, tested.
And, of course, I had laid it all out by saying if we get arms control, we should do this and that and the other thing.
But then I went on to say, I said, now, many people objected to that very strenuously because they were concerned about risk to the environment.
I said, I'm concerned about the environment.
And I think we have some very good programs and very good initiative in the environment.
I said, if we don't defend this country, we aren't going to have any environment to protect.
That's sure right.
And I think we ought to hit that point, Barry.
Well, you should.
Some of these people are nuts on that subject.
Well, they're nuts on any subject.
But I asked Mel Laird at lunch the other day to prepare some fact sheets so that Republicans who are not aware of the defense expenditures and defense problems can answer.
And he said he's going to do it.
Good.
Let me say one other thing on the ANCHIPCA thing.
you know going forward and that was essential because if we hadn't our abm and everything was down the tube you know for a year i know it so we did it and it didn't it didn't blow up the arctic and the seals are still swimming you told me last august you were going to go through with that and i yeah damn proud of you i wish you'd tell some of our good
Because you have a stroke with them, you know, conservative friends like Buckley and others.
And I'm no disarmer, you know.
I'm fighting.
Because, you know, it's the Congress that's trying to disarm, Barry.
I'm not.
But what you inherited, 10 years of no development.
Well, 10 years of McNamara, for Christ's sakes.
The Russians have caught us now.
Now we're just... And listen, if we don't get arms control, I guess you just walked in, let me tell you, we're going to turn, we're going to start going.
I can prove you.
I can tell you that.
We're going to have to.
Right.
Well, thank you, Mr. President.

NARA Description

On November 10, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and Barry M. Goldwater talked on the telephone from 2:51 pm to 2:54 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 014-017 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 14-17

Date: November 10, 1971
Time: 2:51 pm - 2:54 pm
Location: White House Telephone

The President talked with the White House operator.

     Barry M. Goldwater

[See Conversation No. 299-14]

The President talked with Goldwater.

     The President's previous meeting with Pat Boone and family

          -Goldwater's speech in Atlanta

     The President's speeches in New York and Chicago, November 9
          -Response
          -National defense
               -Amchitka test
                      -Soviet tests
                      -Environment risks

     National defense
          -Goldwater's conversation with Melvin R. Laird
                -Fact sheets for Republicans
          -Amchitka test
                -Anti-ballistic missile [ABM]
                -Environmental impact
          -The President's efforts
                -Goldwater's possible conversation with James L. Buckley
                -Congress
                -Robert S. McNamara's legacy
          -Soviets
          -Arms Control
                -Henry A. Kissinger

Also recorded on November 10, 1971

  • 014-015 2:45 PM · 7 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 2:45 pm and 2:50 pm.
  • 299-010 2:45 PM · 35 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at an unknown time between 2:45 pm and 2:50 pm.
  • 299-011 2:45 PM · 19 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at an unknown time between 2:45 pm and 2:50 pm.
  • 014-016 2:50 PM · 8 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at 2:50 pm.
  • 299-013 2:50 PM · 17 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at 2:50 pm.
  • 299-014 2:51 PM · 3 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Barry M. Goldwater met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building from 2:51 pm to 2:54 pm.
  • 299-015 2:51 PM · 18 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Henry A. Kissinger, White House operator, and Richard J. Daley met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at an unknown time between 2:51 pm and 3:16 pm.
  • 014-018 2:54 PM · 24 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 2:54 pm and 3:09 pm.

All 47 conversations from November 10, 1971 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 014-017, November 10, 1971. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/014-017 (accessed October 12, 2026).