Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 15 › Conversation 015-040
Nixon phone call with Connally on AFL-CIO and Economic policy
Thursday, November 18, 1971 · 4:17 PM–4:24 PM ET · White House Telephone · 7 min
AI Summary
President Nixon and John B. Connally discussed the President's upcoming speech to the AFL-CIO in Florida and the importance of communicating his economic policy to a broader audience. Connally also confidentially reported hearing that lawyers from Nixon's former New York law firm were in Texas investigating his background in connection to a legal dispute involving the Moody Foundation. Nixon expressed disbelief that his former firm would be involved in such activities and promised to look into the matter through John Mitchell to resolve the situation.
- AFL-CIO
- Economic policy
- John B. Connally
- John N. Mitchell
- Mudge Rose law firm
- Moody Foundation
- Political investigation
Audio
Transcript (AI-generated)
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hello yes sir hi john how are you mr president say i wanted you to know that uh that uh that i would be uh i i think i think it would be great if you could do a conference on monday yes sir since i will do i'm going to do one the following tuesday which i think is about the right
See, I did one last week, and I don't want to do one this week.
All right, sir.
But does it sound all right to you?
Yes, sir.
And then we'll have our international meeting on Tuesday, if that's all right with you.
Yes, sir.
All right?
Yes, sir.
Because what I was thinking, what brought this to mind, I think Colson may have told you, but what brought this to mind is, and I read your speech up there, and
you know what I mean, up at the Economic Club, and all the positive points you made, I just want you to see, I want you to make that before a bigger audience.
You see?
Yes, sir.
Now, who knows what they'll cover, but it'll get a bigger play, and it's worth, all of them are worth seeing, and those third quarter figures need to be bragged about a little.
The success of the freeze, George Meany, for example, today said the freeze was unsuccessful.
He's just wrong, right?
Yes, sir.
So it's all right with you.
I think it's fine.
Oh, that's fine with me, yes, sir.
I told Chuck I just don't want to beat a good horse to death.
No, no, no.
I told him that I wasn't prepared, but I damn sure would try to get prepared before Monday.
Well, we'll get the briefing books and everything.
Oh, yeah.
All right, fine.
When are you going to have to leave?
Well, I'm going to leave tonight about 7 o'clock to go down to Florida, and then I speak there at 10.30 tomorrow.
go into the lion's den.
I think your advice is right.
I'm just doing it.
I mean, it isn't going to do any good, but I'm not going to be afraid to talk to a bunch of union guys.
So I was going to lay it right out there.
Don't you agree?
I sure do.
And I think it's absolutely essential because in the
I don't think it's justified, but we're getting the impression all over the country that we're being soft and we're capitulating to labor, and it's not good.
And so I think it's all the more important that you go down there and say the same thing to them you'd say to the NAN or anybody else.
That's right.
So what I'm going to do, what I am going to do, I'm going to give them credit where credit is due for supporting us on foreign policy.
I'm going to give them their high marks because they have been good on foreign policy.
And then I'm going to say, no, we need your support on domestic policy and ask for their support.
Excuse me, go ahead.
Well, I just have a personal matter that I want to mention to you if I might ask you not to mention it to anybody else.
Sure.
to John, and I don't have the whole story yet, and I just want to tell you just because I don't know what it means, and I'm going to mention it to John.
I'm going to have lunch with him on Monday.
There's a lawyer named Mahon who was out of your old law firm and his old law firm in New York.
And there was another lawyer out of that firm.
There were two lawyers out of your old firm who were in Houston recently within the last 10 days.
They were at a party, at a cocktail party, and they're representing Sharon Moody.
And this is a long fight, which I won't go into down there.
It involves the old American National Insurance Company and the Moody Foundation.
I see.
But they're representing Sharon Moody as is Roy Cohen.
But they were down there, and my name came up in their presence, and Sharon Moody made some derogatory remark.
And Mahon said, he said, well, he said, don't worry about him.
He said he's going to get his.
He said, the Attorney General is going to see that.
And he said, as a matter of fact, he's got me down here investigating him.
And he said, we're going to San Antonio to talk.
We're going to run down this fellow Peace and see.
He said, I understand he's an old friend of his.
He said, I understand Connolly's got some
land deals with the Rogers out in Las Vegas.
What is the name again?
A fellow named Mahon.
Never heard of him.
Absolutely never heard of him.
And there's a second name.
They're partners in the old Nixon Budge firm.
I'm going to have lunch with John on Monday.
Let me say, they were never when I was there.
Now, it may be that they're young fellows that were taken in later.
That's possible.
And I bet you that John doesn't even know them.
I never heard of the fellow.
And Mahon.
Mahon.
But they're not still in the firm?
Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah.
They're down there as members of the firm.
Oh.
They're down there.
Well, we'll stop that.
No, no.
No, no.
I don't know that you need to.
I don't know.
I just... Who is Sharon Moody?
Sharon Moody is a...
Is he a Texan?
Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah.
His grandfather was old man W.L.
Moody, who amassed that $400 million and founded the Moody Foundation.
Oh.
And an enormous fight between the trustees.
It's a long, bitter brawl.
It's involved the Texas legislature in charges of bribery and corruption.
It's been going on for a year and a half.
And my old firm, Vincent Elkins, wound up representing four members of the seven on the board of trustees of the foundation.
So now you find this firm and on the other side of it.
I got it.
And Roy Cohen wound up representing Sharon Moody.
And then your old firm wound up on Sharon Moody's side, and they were down apparently talking about tactics or whatever.
I can't believe that our firm would be involved with Roy Cohn in something.
And anyway, this conversation took place, and I thought it was passing strange, and I didn't know what was behind it, and I just wanted to mention it.
Now, don't you mention it to John, though.
I will, because I don't want to make an issue out of it.
Oh, well, I do.
But you bring it up, because I've never heard of the fellow.
And I just don't...
He must...
In other words, well, I know who...
He was not there when I was there, not there when I was there at all.
But I don't know his first name, but I'll know tomorrow.
Right.
And I don't know the name of the second man, but I'll know it tomorrow.
Good, good.
And I want to ask you, John, that's entirely possible.
See, it occurred to me that John might be just asking some of his former associates to see if he can possibly find anything that, in my background, would be detrimental.
And I wouldn't blame him a damn bit.
No, no, never, never.
He would never, never use the law firm.
Never.
Well, I wouldn't think so, but... Never, never.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
I know him.
But this fellow, now this is not... Because you see, he's completely separate from it, too.
He would never do that.
Well, I know that, but the... No, but I mean, he wouldn't trust him either.
Yeah.
You know.
The...
But the fellow who told me heard it, so it's not something he just dreamed up.
Well, we'll get after John Alexander.
I was just curious about what... Well, I am, too.
And frankly, I want you to know it.
Oh, absolutely.
Because there are several people that now know it down there, and I don't know when the hell it's going to wind up.
I just want you to know.
Good.
And I'm going to have lunch with John.
Monday?
Monday, yes.
Well, have it after.
Good.
Well, listen, don't worry.
You'll find out.
All right.
I imagine they're pulling somebody's leg, but we're going to stop it right away.
That's a big firm, you know.
Oh, I know it is.
They can't engage in that kind of crap.
Well, all right.
Don't worry about it.
I'm not, frankly.
All right.
All right, bye.
NARA Description
On November 18, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and John B. Connally talked on the telephone from 4:17 pm to 4:24 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 015-040 of the White House Tapes.
Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 15-40
Date: November 18, 1971
Time: 4:17 pm - 4:24 pm
Location: White House Telephone
The President talked with the White House operator.
John B. Connally
The President talked with Connally.
[See also Conversation No. 294-22I]
Press conference
Schedule
-International meeting
Speech at Economic Club
-Charles W. Colson
Economic statistics
-George Meany
-Briefing book
The President's schedule
-Trip to Florida
-The President's speech to American Federation of Labor-Congress of Industrial
Organizations [AFL-CIO] convention
-Labor support
Investigation
-John N. Mitchell
-Arthur J. Mahon and unnamed lawyer
-Law firm of Mudge, Rose, Guthrie and Alexander
-Shearn Moody, Jr.
-Legal case
-Roy M. Cohn
-Connally
-Mitchell
-Pease [sp?] [Forename unknown]
-Land deal
-Rogers [Forename unknown]
-Mitchell
-Meeting with Connally
-Law firm
-Moody
-Moody Foundation
-William L. Moody, Jr.
-Legal case
-Texas legislature
-Law firm, Vinson, Elkins, Searles and Connally
-Cohn
-Mudge, Rose, Guthrie and Alexander
-Mitchell
-Conversation with Connally
-Mahon
-Nixon, Mudge, Rose, Guthrie and Alexander
-Mitchell
-Connally
-Mudge, Rose, Guthrie and Alexander
-John H. Alexander
-Connally's meeting with Mitchell
-Mudge, Rose, Guthrie and AlexanderAlso recorded on November 18, 1971
- 015-036 3:36 PM · 6 min — President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and Peter M. Flanigan talked on the telephone from 3:36 pm to 3:42 pm.
- 015-037 3:42 PM · 7 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 3:42 pm and 3:47 pm.
- 015-038 3:47 PM · 4 min — President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and Charles W. Colson talked on the telephone from 3:47 pm to 3:51 pm.
- 015-039 3:51 PM · 6 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 3:51 pm and 4:17 pm.
- 294-023 4:50 PM · 4 min — President Richard M. Nixon, John N. Mitchell, and Donald H. Rumsfeld met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at an unknown time between 4:50 pm and 4:54 pm.
- 294-024 4:50 PM · 29 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and unknown person(s) met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at an unknown time between 4:50 pm and 4:54 pm.
- 294-025 4:54 PM · 52 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Joel T. Broyhill, William E. Timmons, Egil ("Bud") Krogh, Jr., and Oliver F. ("Ollie") Atkins met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at an unknown time between 4:54 pm and 5:50 pm.
- 015-041 5:09 PM · 2 min — Donald H. Rumsfeld, White House operator, and unknown person(s) talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 5:09 pm and 5:16 pm.
Cite this conversation
Conversation 015-040, November 18, 1971. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/015-040 (accessed October 1, 2026).