On December 8, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and Charles W. Colson talked on the telephone from 5:08 pm to 5:14 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 016-060 of the White House Tapes.
Transcript (AI-Generated)This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.
Yeah.
Mr. Coulson, sir.
Yes, sir, Mr. President.
I think it's important in handling this thing now that you of course will know it's going to be handled.
Right.
But I would say nothing.
I've had a long talk with Mitchell.
It cannot be done through the parole board.
All right.
It has to be done through its commutation of sentence rather than pardon, which of course means he still
does not have his civil rights which is good uh Mitchell will handle it all himself he will uh I we they do have some other things uh on Hoffa he I told him to discuss the situation directly with Fitz good tell him what we had and that and that uh and I didn't let on that we'd had any other channels at all no no and also and he Mitchell will also uh do the little bit
Loeb has been in contact with him anyway.
He says it's terribly dangerous.
But Mitchell has his own ways.
He's pretty clever this way.
But we've decided to go on it, and that's that.
And I said, well, John, it's in your hands.
I don't want to hear anything more about it, and I'll just be surprised when it's on the list.
That's fine.
Now, Fitz was supposed to call me by the end of the day today.
You just tell him that you'll hear from him.
You just tell him the president...
You raised it with him.
The president has had a talk with Mitchell.
He'll hear directly from Mitchell.
And that Mitchell will work out whatever is satisfactory, but it has to be totally that
You know, he and Mitchell, he'll understand.
Oh, yeah.
All the messages have been conveyed, and Mitchell's completely on salvo.
Well, that's all I need to say, and I'll take care of it.
You just tell him that you're not there.
So Fitz will know you talked to me, I talked to Mitchell.
Right.
We're all agreed, but that Mitchell's got to handle it now, Fitz, and, gee, Fitz, will you?
Believe us, play our game now, boy.
Well, he... Tell him that the President's concern was to be sure that he wants this done and done the right way, and he talks to Mitchell without his...
He should not convey to Mitchell.
He's talked to you, of course.
No, no, he knows that.
But he's to say to him that...
But tell him to tell Mitchell everything he wants, and then Mitchell will do it.
How's that sound?
Oh, that's perfect.
I mean, that's all I need to do.
He just needs that signal and the power, right?
i think that'll that that'll pay enormous dividends well that's the way it goes we'll take a little heat but uh oh the hell with heat yeah it's not gonna eat a lot of other things too that's right and you're you're solid enough now to do it if you went in the position you're in i'd be very reluctant but okay i saw a love stone today and yeah he confirms me he is in tough shape he
First wouldn't admit it, and then he kind of came around to it.
Does he think he's going to get out, though?
No.
What he says, no, no.
Christ, he'll take him out feet first.
No, no, no, no, no.
But is he going to get out of the hospital?
Oh, yes, yes.
He'll be out of the hospital.
No, no, no.
I'm sorry.
Not that tough, I hope.
No.
He said no.
He said that he's planning to leave the hospital at the end of this week.
He has been ordered to take a month or six weeks off, which he will do.
lose 20 pounds, that it's an angina-type condition.
He let that kind of slip out.
He wanted to let me know.
Yeah, I know.
But he hoped he'd be back in swing by the February meetings, but he wasn't.
yeah and and you you let him know that i was personally very concerned about meanie's health and all i did and i and i and there's nobody bombing him or anything he's let me meanie could do himself a little good by not being quite so rough on us at the moment well he did this was love stone's whole point in coming to see me and i'm sure he was sent to me he doesn't ever come to me very rarely comes to me unless he's got a message his whole message to me was that meanie is sorry
lost his head.
It was a one-day thing.
And I hope you point out Lovestone.
I've never said a word about him.
I made that point very firmly.
I said, you know, I told Jay, I said, you know, sometime when you're talking to Meany, tell him that it's a fact that I've been in many meetings with the president when people have bad-mouthed Meany, and the president has always said, damn it, he is an American.
He stood with us when we needed it.
And I said, you know, it's just
It's tragic.
I said, I mean, he did himself in that day on television.
He said, of course he did.
He said, but the thing that gave him the heart attack was that he knew he'd done it.
And he said that bothered him more than anything else because he knew he'd done it to himself.
And it just really ate him apart.
All right.
I'll move on this, Mr. President.
I think that's great.
Fine.
Fine.
Fine.
It'll be that.
Okay.
Thank you, sir.
All right.
Thank you.