Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 17 › Conversation 017-160

Nixon phone call with Rogers on Dan Rather and Public Relations

Sunday, January 2, 1972 · 11:30 PM–11:35 PM ET · White House Telephone · 5 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); Rogers, William P.Conversation017-160 on Tape 17 (tape position 06:11:24–06:16:06)StartSunday, January 2, 1972 at 11:30 PMEndSunday, January 2, 1972 at 11:35 PMRecording deviceWhite House TelephoneSourceNixon Library record for 017-160 ↗ · National Archives Catalog, NAID 417192079 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and Secretary of State William P. Rogers discuss the positive reception and impact of the President's recent televised interview with Dan Rather. Rogers praises Nixon’s composed handling of Rather's antagonistic questioning, particularly regarding sensitive domestic and racial topics. The conversation concludes with administrative planning for upcoming meetings involving Gerard C. Smith regarding the Strategic Arms Limitation Treaty and trade discussions with Peter G. Peterson.

Audio

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NARA Description

On January 2, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and William P. Rogers talked on the telephone from 11:30 pm to 11:35 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 017-160 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 17-160

Date: January 2, 1972
Time: 11:30 pm - 11:35 pm
Location: White House Telephone

The President talked with William P. Rogers.

     President's interview with Dan Rather, January 2nd
           -Rogers's views
                 -Praise for the President
                 -Rather
                 -Rogers's phone conversation with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman
                 -Rather's questions
                 -President's answers
                 -Overall impact of show
                       -Public reaction
                 -Adele (Langston) Rogers
                 -Rather's question

                     -Foreign affairs
                     -Differences between blacks and whites
                           -President's answer
               -President ‘s style and ability
               -Rather
                     -On television
                     -At a press conference
                           -Type of questions
          -Value of interview

     Rogers's and President's schedule
         -Trip tomorrow to San Clemente
         -Howard K. Smith
         -West Coast
         -Meeting with Gerard C. Smith
                -Timing
                -Discussion of Strategic Arms Limitation Treaty [SALT]
         -Meeting with Peter G. Peterson
                -President requesting Rogers’ attendance at meetings
                -Trade meeting

Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript is incomplete. The transcription skipped stretches of speech — roughly 1 minute of this recording (about 12% of it) is represented by only a few words. Listen to the audio rather than relying on the text below; a corrected transcript is queued.

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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Well, hi, Mr. President.
Bill, how are you?
Fine, thank you.
I thought you were great.
He was a little rough.
Oh, he's a nasty guy.
But I thought you handled him well.
It didn't look completely composed and relaxed.
I thought that was a great asset.
Even the nastiest question, you didn't rise to the bait at all.
So it came over very well.
And I was just talking to Bob Holliman about it.
He said he'd ask me to call.
Oh, yes, yes.
I would think that on an overall basis, it was a flood.
Must have been a little obsessive.
Oh, well.
Dirty day, of course.
I expect it to be dirty, but he really had it on the page.
He had little cards in his pocket he kept getting out.
Yeah, yeah.
No, I thought your answers were fine, and I would think that it was also tough to judge, you know, when you're supposed to be a designer, but I would think that the average person would have thought you did a good job.
Adele and I both, you know, got through it all.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, I thought certainly on the foreign affairs thing, it was fine.
On the domestic thing, she didn't really ask any intelligent questions.
or he didn't do anything, he really didn't get the heart of the problem.
You know that thing about, are Negro different from whites?
For Christ's sake, of course they're different.
Isn't that silly?
I thought you handled that very well.
Because that's the kind of question we can't possibly anticipate.
I can't imagine anybody's going to ask what's the difference between a white man and a black man.
But they aren't different.
Well, of course, and I thought the way you explained it is exactly right.
The whole upbringing is different, and naturally he feels differently about it.
The reason he feels differently about it is because society has felt different about him over the years.
And naturally he has all these problems that he's got.
society is treated for.
And that's exactly what you had in mind, and that's the answer you gave.
Well, I thought it was fine.
I thought, as I say, I don't know how you could have done any better.
I'm not sure that any president of the United States should ever have to go on to that kind of son of a bitch.
How can you choose?
Well, we've done it now.
I know.
And, of course, that's a good answer with the press.
We've taken the guy that was most antagonistic.
Yeah.
And let him answer it.
better ask anything he wanted.
We just took him along.
Well, he wouldn't go out to those courses that are tough courses.
Oh, no, no.
He'd be constrained by those things.
But it was good that we let him do it, yeah.
How was he afterwards?
Oh, I think he was a little nonplussed.
Yeah.
He didn't really make any points at all.
I mean, you discussed him on the answers, and you gave very good key answers.
So I don't think he made any points, but it's tough for the president to have to face with a question like that.
It's good they've done it, though, then we don't have to do it again.
That's right.
That's right.
Okay, well, see you tomorrow at 5.30.
Oh, wait, well, you're coming to the... Yeah, I didn't want to go to the West Coast.
I had to do this, so I thought I'd rather... You're coming to the...
Tomorrow, I was going to do the thing with Smith.
I think you ought to be there when we talk to, you know, Jerry Smith.
Oh, good.
Yeah, what time is that?
Well, I don't know, but...
I'll look it up.
We'll check it up at the I.C.
And then the...
The other thing is that there's a meeting with Peterson regarding what the tactics should be, and I want you to be there for that.
Are you going to be there, too?
Well, I'll be there, and we'll probably sit in on the whole thing.
The main thing on that bill is to be damn sure that we do not...
Get out, you know, leading the charge for all this other thing.
I mean, let's do it, but not to get caught in it.
Oh, yeah, we can't do that.
I agree completely.
Bye, Mr. Edmund.
Bye.
Thank you very much.
Bye.

Also recorded on January 2, 1972

  • 017-157 11:22 PM · 7 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at 11:22 pm.
  • 017-158 11:23 PM · 5 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Rose Mary Woods talked on the telephone from 11:23 pm to 11:28 pm.
  • 017-159 11:28 PM · 6 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 11:28 pm and 11:30 pm.
  • 017-161 11:35 PM · 9 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at 11:35 pm.
  • 017-162 11:36 PM · 6 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Charles W. Colson talked on the telephone from 11:36 pm to 11:42 pm.
  • 017-163 11:42 PM · 2 sec — unknown person(s) and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 11:42 pm and 11:44 pm.
  • 017-164 11:42 PM · 5 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 11:42 pm and 11:44 pm.
  • 017-165 11:44 PM · 24 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Rose Mary Woods talked on the telephone from 11:44 pm to 11:45 pm.

All 60 conversations from January 2, 1972 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 017-160, January 2, 1972. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives (NAID 417192079). Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/017-160 (accessed November 2, 2026).