{"conversationCode":"024-125","tapeNumber":24,"conversationNumber":125,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-024-125","startDateTime":"1972-05-16T01:25:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1972-05-16T01:27:00.000Z","startDate":"15-May-1972","startTime":"9:25 PM","endDate":"15-May-1972","endTime":"9:27 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Ehrlichman, John D.;","description":"On May 15, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and John D. Ehrlichman talked on the telephone from 9:25 pm to 9:27 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 024-125 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"WHT","recordingDevice":"White House Telephone","latitudeEstimated":38.89767,"longitudeEstimated":-77.03655,"chronCode":3,"chronRelease":"Third Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"28-Feb-2002","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 24-125\n\nDate: May 15, 1972\nTime: 9:25 pm - 9:27 pm\nLocation: White House Telephone\n\nThe President talked with John D. Ehrlichman.\n\n[See also Conversation No. 339-14]\n\n     Attack on George C. Wallace\n          -Arthur H. Bremer\n               -W. Mark Felt's report\n                     -Federal Bureau of Investigation [FBI]\n               -Arraignment\n               -Custody\n               -Attorney\n                     -Appointment\n               -Age\n               -Mental state\n               -Writings in apartment\n                     -Secret Service\n               -Psychiatric exam\n                     -Report\n                     -Surveillance\n               -The President's concern\n                     -John F. Kennedy assassination investigation\n                           -Handling\n               -Investigation\n                     -Control\n                           -The President and Felt\n                           -Reports\n               -Attorney for Bremer\n                     -Felt's opinion\n                     -Interrogation\n                     -Appointment\n               -Arraignment\n               -Custody\n               -Attorney\n                     -Appointment","filename":["024-125.mp3"],"tapeStart":"02:28:30","tapeEnd":"02:30:46","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Ehrlichman, John D."],"prevCode":"024-124","nextCode":"024-126","aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and John Ehrlichman discussed the arraignment and custody of Arthur H. Bremer, the assailant of George C. Wallace, with Ehrlichman relaying FBI Director Felt's reports on Bremer's mental state, refusal to speak without an attorney, and the FBI's security measures. Nixon emphasized his desire for close control over the investigation, drawing a parallel to the \"badly handled\" John F. Kennedy assassination investigation, and instructed Ehrlichman to ensure the press is aware he is monitoring the situation, while also pushing for the swift appointment of an attorney for Bremer.","topics":["Arthur H. Bremer","George C. Wallace attack","FBI investigation","Presidential control","John F. Kennedy assassination investigation","Mental state","Legal representation","Arraignment"],"generatedAt":"2026-10-28T16:58:31.442Z"},"topicSlugs":["arthur-h-bremer","george-c-wallace-attack","fbi-investigation","presidential-control","john-f-kennedy-assassination-investigation","mental-state","legal-representation","arraignment"],"audioDurationSec":136,"audioFiles":[{"file":"024-125.mp3","bytes":5446840,"durationSec":136.07,"bitrate":320233,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-10-28T16:45:08.676Z","audioSource":"National Archives Catalog (open data, RN-WHT)","audioSourceUrls":["https://catalog.archives.gov/medialz/presidential-libraries/nixon/rn-wht/17412458/6852475/37-wht-conversation-024-125-pa.mp3"],"catalogNaId":646314566,"originalFilename":["024a.mp3","024c.mp3"],"transcript":[{"start":0,"end":3,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Yeah."},{"start":1,"end":3,"speaker":"Operator","text":"I have Mr. Ehrlichman now for for you. There you are, sir."},{"start":3,"end":4,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Thank you."},{"start":4,"end":5,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"What are your reports?"},{"start":5,"end":18,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Yes, sir. Felt tells me that they're going to arraign this fellow within about an hour before a United States magistrate. And then they're going to put him in the Baltimore County jail, which the FBI feels is the is the safest place to put him."},{"start":18,"end":18,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Right."},{"start":18,"end":23,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"He is refusing to talk to anybody until an attorney is appointed for him."},{"start":24,"end":25,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Who's he want?"},{"start":25,"end":30,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Well, he doesn't know anybody. And they see he's he's from Milwaukee."},{"start":30,"end":31,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"How old is he?"},{"start":31,"end":35,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"About in his 20s and I don't know the exact age that they got."},{"start":35,"end":37,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"So the 35 year old thing was incorrect."},{"start":37,"end":38,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Yes, sir."},{"start":38,"end":43,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"He's he's obviously weird. The Secret Service has been in his apartment up in Milwaukee."},{"start":43,"end":45,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"I know they found some stuff there."},{"start":45,"end":46,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Odd writings."},{"start":46,"end":47,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Yeah."},{"start":47,"end":64,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"And from the way they've had a psychiatrist look at him, and the psychiatrist reports that he's extremely disturbed, and is liable to do harm to himself. So, they have him under under Right. surveillance every minute. Good."},{"start":64,"end":65,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Good."},{"start":65,"end":76,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"The John, let me tell you my concern, Right. which I'm sure you're keenly aware of. The Kennedy thing was handled so badly."},{"start":76,"end":82,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Everybody was blamed for it. I don't want us into this. I want everybody to know, and you get this I'm on top of this thing every minute."},{"start":82,"end":87,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Well, I've passed that word in the strongest possible way to Felt."},{"start":87,"end":89,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Yeah, and pass it to the press."},{"start":89,"end":91,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"All right. All right, good."},{"start":91,"end":92,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Would you do that?"},{"start":92,"end":93,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Yes, sir."},{"start":93,"end":98,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Now, the only loose end in this is getting him an attorney."},{"start":98,"end":104,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Felt is of the opinion that once he has an attorney, he'll talk."},{"start":104,"end":106,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Well, let's get him one."},{"start":106,"end":111,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"And so we've got to get a federal judge, and get a judge to appoint an attorney for him, and we're we're Yeah. Get that attorney you can get."},{"start":110,"end":112,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"We're on that."},{"start":112,"end":114,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Get a good attorney, you know."},{"start":114,"end":114,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Right."},{"start":114,"end":115,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Who uh"},{"start":115,"end":124,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"First step is to get him arraigned. Second step is to move him quickly into this maximum security jail Right. Baltimore County jail. Right, good. And then to get a federal judge, and see if we can get an attorney appointed for him."},{"start":124,"end":127,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Can you work on the judge tonight?"},{"start":127,"end":131,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Well, I've I will work on it, and if at all possible, we'll get it done."},{"start":131,"end":132,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Good deal."},{"start":132,"end":132,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"All right, sir."},{"start":132,"end":133,"speaker":"Nixon","text":"Just be on top of it, John. Fine. Right."},{"start":133,"end":135,"speaker":"Ehrlichman","text":"Yes, sir. I sure will."}],"transcriptCreatedAt":"2026-10-28T12:50:32.987Z","transcriptModel":"google/gemini-3.8-flash","transcriptSource":"audio-llm","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/024-125.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/024-125","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/024/conversation-024-125","catalogUrl":"https://catalog.archives.gov/id/646314566","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}