{"conversationCode":"026-003","tapeNumber":26,"conversationNumber":3,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-026-003","startDateTime":"1972-06-23T20:07:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1972-06-23T20:13:00.000Z","startDate":"23-Jun-1972","startTime":"4:07 PM","endDate":"23-Jun-1972","endTime":"4:13 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Shultz, George P.;","description":"On June 23, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and George P. Shultz talked on the telephone from 4:07 pm to 4:13 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 026-003 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"WHT","recordingDevice":"White House Telephone","latitudeEstimated":38.89767,"longitudeEstimated":-77.03655,"chronCode":3,"chronRelease":"Third Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"28-Feb-2002","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 26-3\n\nDate: June 23, 1972\nTime: 4:07 and 4:13 pm\nLocation: White House Telephone\n\nThe President talked with George P. Shultz.\n\n[See Conversation No. 741-14C]\n\n     Instructions for Shultz\n\n     Shultz's telephone conversation with John B. Connally\n          -Food, cattle\n          -International monetary situation\n          -Britain's action concerning the pound\n          -Europeans\n          -US position on covertibility\n                 -Connally’s view\n          -US role in world\n          -Shultz's possible trip to Europe\n                 -Anthony Perrinet Lysberg [Rt. Hon. Lord Barber], Edward R.G. Heath\n                 -Georges J.R. Pompidou, Valery Giscard D'estaing\n                 -Germany, Italy\n                 -Paul A. Volcker\n                       -Jack F. Bennett\n          -Instructions for Shultz\n                 -British Ambassador [George R.S. Baring [Earl of Cromer]]\n\n     Arthur F. Burns's forthcoming trip\n          -Latin America\n                -Possible trip cancellation\n                     -The President’s view","filename":["026-003-splice.mp3"],"tapeStart":"00:02:41","tapeEnd":"00:08:11","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Shultz, George P."],"prevCode":"026-002","nextCode":"026-004","tapeTranscriptFile":"026a.mp3,026b.mp3","transcript":[{"start":174.32,"end":174.66,"text":"Hello."},{"start":174.76,"end":175.2,"text":"Yes, sir."},{"start":175.56,"end":185.11,"text":"George, on that thing we were discussing this morning, I wanted to be sure that you got off a telephone call, preferably a message, if necessary, to Connolly."},{"start":185.47,"end":187.74,"text":"I just hung up the phone with him, Mr. President."},{"start":187.92,"end":188.2,"text":"Oh, good."},{"start":188.22,"end":190.18,"text":"I had about a ten-minute conversation with him."},{"start":190.2,"end":190.36,"text":"Good."},{"start":190.38,"end":192.2,"text":"Did he see the point in everything?"},{"start":192.22,"end":193.04,"text":"He's fully..."},{"start":193.62,"end":196.22,"text":"both on the food business and the cattle."},{"start":196.58,"end":197.66,"text":"Well, you covered that, too."},{"start":197.84,"end":199.99,"text":"And also on the international."},{"start":200.01,"end":204.17,"text":"And he's fully in accord with what we're doing in both places."},{"start":204.45,"end":205.39,"text":"Right."},{"start":205.43,"end":208.63,"text":"What did he think about the British action and so forth?"},{"start":208.67,"end":211.23,"text":"And what did he think about the possibility of the European bloc?"},{"start":211.29,"end":213.47,"text":"I suppose he went up the wall?"},{"start":213.77,"end":214.01,"text":"No."},{"start":214.37,"end":219.93,"text":"Well, he said that he had been expecting that the British would get in some kind of trouble."},{"start":219.97,"end":220.55,"text":"Yeah, yeah."},{"start":220.67,"end":222.78,"text":"And he's chortling a little bit on that."},{"start":222.79,"end":222.96,"text":"Good."},{"start":223.38,"end":226.7,"text":"He thinks that we're playing it just right."},{"start":226.72,"end":232,"text":"But he feels that this is certainly a justification for our opposing convertibility."},{"start":232.56,"end":232.98,"text":"Oh, yeah."},{"start":233.3,"end":233.66,"text":"Oh, yeah."},{"start":234.18,"end":235.16,"text":"He thinks that we should"},{"start":236.28,"end":237.6,"text":"We should show motion."},{"start":237.7,"end":242.7,"text":"He thinks that we should be cooperative."},{"start":242.74,"end":244.78,"text":"We should have some sense of motion."},{"start":244.84,"end":247.02,"text":"He liked the statement that we put out."},{"start":247.06,"end":249.52,"text":"He thinks that I have a..."},{"start":249.78,"end":255.78,"text":"He doesn't feel that your statement went too far towards convertibility and that sort of thing."},{"start":255.82,"end":261.86,"text":"I just don't think we should take the responsibility for maintaining these structures all over the world."},{"start":262.26,"end":263.69,"text":"Oh, no, no, not at all."},{"start":264.12,"end":282.34,"text":"On the other hand, he feels that we should be a forthcoming group, ready to sit down, wanting to talk to people, wanting to keep things going, and that I personally, since people know that my personal disposition is toward fluid rates, that I ought to get around and see people."},{"start":282.44,"end":284.2,"text":"Well, let me suggest this."},{"start":285.46,"end":289.7,"text":"Is it time yet for you to take a trip to Europe and talk to some of these fellows?"},{"start":290.6,"end":315.33,"text":"uh not like you take take tony barber you know in britain he's a really a great guy and uh also uh uh he's he's been uh certainly very uh friendly on these things and they're going through a tough proposition right and uh i think that if you can work it out you ought to you ought to get over and see him if you do him of course you would have to what you'd have to do you'd have to do him"},{"start":316.37,"end":319.41,"text":"you'd have to get down to see the franchise."},{"start":319.43,"end":330.72,"text":"If you're in Britain, you should see Barber and Heath, and then you ought to go down to France and see Pompidou and Gaston this time."},{"start":331.28,"end":333.16,"text":"And then, of course, the Germans and the Italians."},{"start":333.84,"end":337.78,"text":"Now, at some point, because of this, you probably ought to do it."},{"start":338.18,"end":340.26,"text":"Or on the other hand, I suppose Volcker does it."},{"start":340.46,"end":342.72,"text":"Or what do you have in mind?"},{"start":343.18,"end":346.37,"text":"I think that probably I ought to do something like that to meet these people."},{"start":346.38,"end":348.08,"text":"See, they've got to know you."},{"start":348.12,"end":354.35,"text":"Because that would send out a signal that we think there's a big crisis and we've got to get over there."},{"start":354.41,"end":357.11,"text":"Our feeling was, and John concurred in this, that"},{"start":358.05,"end":365.89,"text":"that the most we might do is send a fellow named Jack Bennett, who you probably don't know, a deputy to Volcker, a very good man."},{"start":365.93,"end":367.17,"text":"Good, that's fine."},{"start":367.21,"end":367.93,"text":"At a lower level."},{"start":367.95,"end":369.43,"text":"At a lower level, but it isn't a..."},{"start":369.49,"end":372.35,"text":"Otherwise, otherwise, it'll look like a crisis atmosphere."},{"start":372.69,"end":375.21,"text":"One thing I would like you to do, though, get in the British ambassador."},{"start":376.13,"end":378.68,"text":"You know, he's a banker."},{"start":378.7,"end":383.76,"text":"And tell him that I have expressed concern, that we want to be as helpful as we can."},{"start":383.78,"end":391.06,"text":"He's very discreet and will appreciate the fact that I have noted the problem and for him to extend my best to Heath."},{"start":391.43,"end":392.46,"text":"and Barber and all that group."},{"start":392.49,"end":393.05,"text":"Would you do that?"},{"start":393.61,"end":404.77,"text":"I think if you would do that, just to show an interest in the thing so that they don't sit over there and just think that we're not concerned about the problem they have because we've been on the phone with them."},{"start":404.91,"end":405.83,"text":"Yeah, three people."},{"start":405.97,"end":407.89,"text":"But I think, do you know the British ambassador?"},{"start":407.95,"end":409.07,"text":"Oh, yeah, very well."},{"start":409.33,"end":413.47,"text":"Well, he's, you know, I just call him, I want him to know from me this has,"},{"start":414.23,"end":421.4,"text":"to do more than the international monetary thing that just shows that we care about what's happening to them, that I expressed concern and wanted you to talk directly with him about it."},{"start":422.04,"end":424.68,"text":"If you would do that, it would be a good thing to do."},{"start":424.7,"end":426.38,"text":"All right, sir."},{"start":426.4,"end":428.38,"text":"I just finished talking with..."},{"start":428.4,"end":429.04,"text":"I thought he left."},{"start":429.3,"end":430.54,"text":"No, he leaves tomorrow."},{"start":430.56,"end":433.02,"text":"Now, he is itching."},{"start":433.91,"end":438.06,"text":"to not go so that he can stay here."},{"start":438.12,"end":439.96,"text":"No, he must go."},{"start":440,"end":442.74,"text":"My opinion was that he ought to go."},{"start":442.82,"end":445.1,"text":"He said, well, do you think I ought to call the president?"},{"start":445.14,"end":447.64,"text":"I said, Arthur, I can tell you what the president would say."},{"start":447.7,"end":451.07,"text":"I know enough about the president's thinking to tell you he'd want you to go."},{"start":451.09,"end":451.65,"text":"That's right."},{"start":451.93,"end":452.61,"text":"Well, also..."},{"start":452.63,"end":458.51,"text":"I should call him and tell him that I... You tell me you could tell him... You could tell him you'd talk with me and say that..."},{"start":458.97,"end":465.19,"text":"that it's only a flight of, it's only a day to come back."},{"start":465.39,"end":465.99,"text":"He's got to go."},{"start":466.11,"end":469.21,"text":"But the other thing, too, is he's got to think of the Latin Americans."},{"start":469.63,"end":480.36,"text":"If he cancels his trip because of this little blip, it could be a fairly big one in the international monetary thing, it'll be again, well, here the Americans only care about Europe and don't care about us."},{"start":480.96,"end":485.06,"text":"Tell him it would be a very grave mistake for him to cancel his trip or to postpone it to this point."},{"start":485.08,"end":488.16,"text":"He ought to go down there, and then if something else develops, we'll bring him back."},{"start":489.38,"end":490.42,"text":"Okay, I'll tell him that."},{"start":490.44,"end":492.61,"text":"Yeah, there are other reasons, too."},{"start":493.59,"end":494.05,"text":"Okay."},{"start":494.19,"end":494.57,"text":"Right."},{"start":494.67,"end":495.25,"text":"All right."},{"start":495.61,"end":496.05,"text":"Fine."},{"start":496.27,"end":496.97,"text":"Fine."},{"start":497.07,"end":497.81,"text":"Okay, thanks."},{"start":497.98,"end":498.16,"text":"Yep."}],"transcriptBoundary":{"start":175,"end":498,"startMethod":"llm-alignment","endMethod":"llm-alignment"},"transcriptConfidence":"high","transcriptSource":"bigtape","aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and George P. Shultz discussed the necessity of managing international economic and monetary concerns, specifically following recent developments regarding the British pound. Nixon instructed Shultz to conduct a diplomatic tour of Europe to engage directly with key leaders, including Edward Heath and Georges Pompidou, to emphasize the importance of U.S. relations and current policy positions. Additionally, Nixon directed Shultz to coordinate with the British Ambassador to ensure that U.S. intentions were clearly communicated to the British government.","topics":["International Monetary Policy","U.S.-Europe Relations","George P. Shultz","British Pound","Diplomacy","Currency Convertibility"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T03:15:13.540Z"},"topicSlugs":["international-monetary-policy","u-s-europe-relations","george-p-shultz","british-pound","diplomacy","currency-convertibility"],"audioDurationSec":326,"audioFiles":[{"file":"026-003-splice.mp3","bytes":5204622,"durationSec":326.01,"bitrate":127717,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T14:10:14.321Z","originalFilename":["026a.mp3","026b.mp3"],"spliceSource":{"spliceType":"bigtape","sourceFiles":["026a.mp3"],"cutStart":173.5,"cutEnd":499.5,"adjustedStart":173.5,"adjustedEnd":499.5,"boundaryMethod":"llm-alignment","confidence":"high","splicedAt":"2026-09-18T14:10:14.321Z"},"transcriptPrev":{"segments":98,"replacedAt":"2026-09-18T08:14:00.337Z"},"findingAidSource":"nixonlibrary.gov subject log (2024-05), reslice-v2","findingAidUpdatedAt":"2026-09-18T08:42:39.087Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/026-003-splice.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/026-003","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/26/conversation-026-003","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). 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