Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 33 › Conversation 033-109

Nixon phone call with Ziegler on White House Reorganization and Leaks

Sunday, November 19, 1972 · 10:49 AM–10:51 AM ET · White House Telephone · 2 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); Ziegler, Ronald L.Conversation033-109 on Tape 33StartSunday, November 19, 1972 at 10:49 AMEndSunday, November 19, 1972 at 10:51 AMRecording deviceWhite House TelephoneSourceNixon Library record for 033-109 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and Press Secretary Ronald Ziegler discussed a Washington Star report regarding the administration's second-term reorganization plans, which the President suspected was a compilation of previous legislative data rather than a deliberate leak. To mitigate further unauthorized disclosures, Nixon directed Ziegler to instruct John Ehrlichman and Caspar Weinberger to threaten the firing of any Office of Management and Budget (OMB) or Ehrlichman staff members responsible for future leaks. The President concluded by reinforcing a policy of strict silence, directing his subordinates to refrain from unauthorized commentary on administration planning.

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Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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Yeah.

Mr. Ziegler.

Yeah.

Hello.

Yes, sir.

Yeah.

I read that story.

Who's it from?

I don't—I'm sure it's from no one who knows.

I talked to Ehrlichman.

He said they have all the thinking and plans locked up at Camp David, never left there.

I think what Joy did was to take, you know, some

Leeds from the Horner interview, and then to pick up a quote, I don't know where from, perhaps over in the OMB or somewhere, about, you know, from somewhere.

I'll get a hold of Ehrlichman or just as soon as we finish and tell him that he's to issue an order to not Weinberger at all that they're

any more leaks out of that, everybody will be fired in the OMB.

All right, fine.

I'll do—I'll be firm, too, on them.

Yeah.

But I know we can't be firm afterwards.

They've got to be firm now.

Right.

You just raise hell over there, call Weinberger and tell him we understand.

Ehrlichman, too, because Ehrlichman's staff could have leaked it, see.

They aren't the most—they've leaked before.

Reading—I read it over twice.

I'm sure it's not based upon any background or based upon anything where—

where someone sat down and said, here's what we think it will be, or here's what it will be, in reading through what it is as a compilation of, you know, material from the previous, the last session's legislation on reorganization.

And, you know, sort of a

indication she had probably that it was going to be done without further legislation.

But in reading it over, I'm convinced it's not based on a backgrounder.

Okay, let's get the orders out.

Absolutely.

Mr. President, what is your thinking as of now as to how

you want to proceed on announcements and so forth.

But just tell everybody just not talk so much.

Is that enough?

Yes, sir.

Fine.

Okay.

Okay, fine.

NARA Description

On November 19, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and Ronald L. Ziegler talked on the telephone from 10:49 am to 10:51 am. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 033-109 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 33-109

Date: November 19, 1972
Time: 10:49 am – 10:51 am
Location: White House Telephone

The President talked with Ronald L. Ziegler.

       Second term reorganization
            -[Washington Star] story
                  -Source
                        -Ziegler’s recent conversation with John D. Ehrlichman
                              -Camp David
                        -Washington Star reporter
                              -Garnet D. (“Jack”) Horner interview
                        -Office of Management and Budget [OMB] leak
                        -Ehrlichman’s forthcoming order to Caspar W. (“Cap”) Weinberger
                              -Prevention of leaks
                                     -Possible firings
                        -Ehrlichman’s staff
                        -Administration’s plans
                              -Recent Congress’ legislation
                        -Backgrounder

       Announcements
           -President’s guidelines

Also recorded on November 19, 1972

033-110 10:51 AM · 7 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone from 10:51 am to 10:56 am.
033-111 10:56 AM · 10 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at 10:56 am.
033-112 10:56 AM · 10 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone from 10:56 am to 10:57 am.
033-113 10:57 AM · 11 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Julie Nixon Eisenhower talked on the telephone from 10:57 am to 10:58 am.
033-114 10:58 AM · 7 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at 10:58 am.
033-115 10:58 AM · 14 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Craig S. Campbell talked on the telephone from 10:58 am to 10:59 am.
034-001 10:59 AM · 13 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 10:59 am and 7:37 pm.
034-145 10:59 AM · 10 sec — President Richard M. Nixon talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 10:59 am and 7:37 pm.

All 45 conversations from November 19, 1972 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 033-109, November 19, 1972. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/033-109 (accessed October 12, 2026).