{"conversationCode":"039-005","tapeNumber":39,"conversationNumber":5,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-039-005","startDateTime":"1973-05-24T17:39:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1973-05-24T17:40:00.000Z","startDate":"24-May-1973","startTime":"1:39 PM","endDate":"24-May-1973","endTime":"1:40 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"White House operator; Nixon, Richard M. (President); Arends, Leslie C.;","description":"On May 24, 1973, White House operator, President Richard M. Nixon, and Leslie C. Arends talked on the telephone from 1:39 pm to 1:40 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 039-005 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"WHT","recordingDevice":"White House Telephone","latitudeEstimated":38.89767,"longitudeEstimated":-77.03655,"chronCode":"5.5","chronRelease":"Fifth Chronological Release: Part V","chronReleaseDate":"21-Aug-2013","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 39-5\n\nDate: May 24, 1973\nTime: 1:39 pm - 1:40 pm\nLocation: White House Telephone\n\nThe White House operator talked with the President.\n\n       Incoming telephone call\n\nThe President talked with Leslie C. Arends.\n\n[See also Conversation No. 440-39]\n\n       Republican Party leadership meeting, May 23\n             -Reaction\n             -Frequency\n\n       Watergate\n             -Republican Congressmen’s morale\n             -White House response\n                    -White Paper [Statements about Watergate, May 22, 1973]\n                           -National security\n                                  -Effect on United States foreign policy\n                                          -Reception for former prisoners of war [POWs]\n                                          -Leakers\n                                                 -Celebration\n                                                 -Negative effects\n                                          -Importance of secrecy\n                                                 -People’s Republic of China [PRC]\n                                                 -Union of Soviet Socialist Republics\n                                                  [USSR]\n                                                 -Vietnam\n                                                         -POWs\n\n       Arends’ possible speeches\n\n       President’s previous comments\n\f                                             -5-\n\n                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                              Conversation No. 39-5 (cont’d)\n\n              -National defense\n                     -Appeal","filename":["039-005.mp3"],"tapeStart":"","tapeEnd":"","participantsList":["White House operator","Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Arends, Leslie C."],"prevCode":"039-004","nextCode":"039-006","transcript":[{"start":1.21,"end":2.45,"text":"Congressman Aaron, sir."},{"start":2.47,"end":2.59,"text":"Hello."},{"start":3.5,"end":3.8,"text":"You are."},{"start":4.34,"end":5.66,"text":"How did your boys like the meeting?"},{"start":5.88,"end":6.72,"text":"Oh, they loved it."},{"start":7.62,"end":8.3,"text":"They loved it."},{"start":8.32,"end":9.42,"text":"And really, it was perfect."},{"start":9.45,"end":13.49,"text":"I thought we ought to do it perhaps about every couple months, don't you think?"},{"start":13.51,"end":13.61,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":13.63,"end":15.93,"text":"Not too often, you know, it doesn't mean much to them."},{"start":15.95,"end":19.66,"text":"And, you know, about whenever you think they need a little..."},{"start":19.82,"end":21.21,"text":"of our morale today."},{"start":21.23,"end":21.85,"text":"It's all great."},{"start":21.87,"end":22.21,"text":"It's better."},{"start":22.29,"end":22.97,"text":"It's so much better."},{"start":23.09,"end":24.13,"text":"Is it beginning to pick up?"},{"start":24.15,"end":27.28,"text":"It's beginning to pick up, and I think you can just sense the change coming on."},{"start":27.3,"end":29,"text":"That statement is getting around."},{"start":29.06,"end":30.42,"text":"Everybody reading it, I hope they are."},{"start":30.44,"end":30.95,"text":"We did."},{"start":31.07,"end":32.07,"text":"We saw to it they got it."},{"start":32.81,"end":33.15,"text":"Right."},{"start":33.17,"end":39.42,"text":"One point that ought to be made very strongly is this, that truly the tragedy is, I'm going to say to the POWs in a few minutes, that"},{"start":39.96,"end":46.09,"text":"you have a situation where they make national heroes out of those that steal secrets and then condemn those and try to protect the national security."},{"start":46.11,"end":54.86,"text":"Because I said without secret diplomacy, there would have been no China initiative, no Soviet initiative, and these guys would still be in that damn big pen in Hanoi."},{"start":55.18,"end":55.88,"text":"Terrific point."},{"start":55.96,"end":57.02,"text":"If that's hard, will you?"},{"start":57.04,"end":57.36,"text":"I will."},{"start":57.52,"end":60.43,"text":"And I'm going back out home this week and make some speeches."},{"start":60.79,"end":62.11,"text":"Very well, boy."},{"start":62.19,"end":62.55,"text":"Thank you."},{"start":62.69,"end":67.72,"text":"Well, Mr. President, I think what you said about national defense last night was terrific those last few minutes."},{"start":67.7,"end":75.95,"text":"Now, some way we ought to get our boys in the aggregate, maybe, or somehow, so they understand it just the way you said it last night."},{"start":75.97,"end":78.77,"text":"I can say it to somebody else, but... One day."},{"start":79.49,"end":79.87,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":79.95,"end":83.59,"text":"When you really come to a bunch of old IMA, come down and talk to them yourself."},{"start":83.89,"end":84.96,"text":"Oh, I think that would be terrific."},{"start":85,"end":85.94,"text":"That would be absolutely terrific."},{"start":86.94,"end":88.54,"text":"It would be a change of pace, and that would be good."},{"start":88.78,"end":89,"text":"Right."},{"start":89.18,"end":89.66,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":89.68,"end":90.04,"text":"Okay, good."},{"start":90.06,"end":91.1,"text":"We'll see you tonight."},{"start":91.12,"end":91.28,"text":"Right."},{"start":91.4,"end":94.36,"text":"Okay."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and Representative Leslie C. Arends discuss the positive reception and improved morale among Republican Congressmen following a recent leadership meeting. Nixon emphasizes the necessity of maintaining national security and secret diplomacy, arguing that leakers threaten initiatives with China, the USSR, and the release of POWs. Arends commits to echoing these themes in upcoming speeches and encourages Nixon to address Republican members directly to further bolster support.","topics":["Watergate","Congressional relations","National security","Secret diplomacy","Public relations","POWs"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T05:42:51.541Z"},"topicSlugs":["watergate","congressional-relations","national-security","secret-diplomacy","public-relations","prisoners-of-war"],"audioDurationSec":99,"audioFiles":[{"file":"039-005.mp3","bytes":3176448,"durationSec":99.17,"bitrate":256234,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:20:02.070Z","findingAidSource":"nixonlibrary.gov subject log (2024-05), reslice-v2","findingAidUpdatedAt":"2026-09-18T08:42:42.798Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/039-005.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/039-005","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/039/conversation-039-005","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}