Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 42 › Conversation 042-097

Nixon phone call with Gullander on Welfare reform and Work requirements

Wednesday, May 5, 1971 · 1:16 PM–3:00 PM ET · White House Telephone · 1 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); Gullander, Werner P.Conversation042-097 on Tape 42 (tape position 02:27:44–02:29:03)StartWednesday, May 5, 1971 at 1:16 PMEndWednesday, May 5, 1971 at 3:00 PMRecording deviceWhite House TelephoneSourceNixon Library record for 042-097 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon spoke with National Association of Manufacturers President Werner P. Gullander to secure continued private sector support for his welfare reform agenda. The discussion focused on emphasizing the administration's strict work requirements, which mandate that able-bodied recipients accept any available employment, including menial labor. Gullander confirmed that business leaders were increasingly aligned with these policy goals, signaling a reduction in previous opposition to the President's initiatives.

Audio

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Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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Yeah.
I located Mr. Gulger in New York City, sir.
He's on the line.
Yeah.
Hello.
This is Cullinan, Mr. President.
Yes.
I just wanted to tell you that all of our boys here have been most grateful for your help on our welfare reform and some of our other initiatives.
And I know that it may cause you some problems with some of your members, but as you've noted, I've been hitting hard on the work requirements, which I think you should mention.
Yes, we have.
And because, after all, the purpose of our program is to get people off of welfare and not on.
And I think if they understand that, they'll get the message.
Mr. President, I'm happy to tell you that the flak I used to get, I no longer get.
Good, good.
I think we've done a good job of really making them understand why we're... Well, and as you know, we've strengthened it a great deal, the work requirement, because I just not... You probably know that when I spoke to the governors, I said that welfare workers, people on welfare would have to take any kind of work, including so-called menial work, and that, I think, gets home.
I mean, I believe that if a person is able to work, he ought to do anything to stay off of welfare.
Right.
Well, anyway, we appreciate it, and we hope that everything goes well.
We'll continue to support it.
I tell you, I drove past San Clemente last week a couple times.
Oh, did you?
I see your flag flying.
Yes, sir.
Okay.
Fine, fine, Gulley.
Bye.

NARA Description

On May 5, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and Werner P. Gullander talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 042-097 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 42-97

Date: May 5, 1971
Time: Unknown between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm
Location: White House Telephone

The President talked with Werner P. Gullander.

[See Conversation No. 252-41]

     Gullander's help on welfare reform
          -Work requirement
          -President's speech to governors

     Gullander's visit to California
          -San Clemente

Also recorded on May 5, 1971

  • 042-087 1:16 PM · 8 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm.
  • 042-088 1:16 PM · 55 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Peter M. Flanigan talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm.
  • 042-089 1:16 PM · 7 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm.
  • 042-090 1:16 PM · 50 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm.
  • 042-091 1:16 PM · 9 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm.
  • 042-092 1:16 PM · 42 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm.
  • 042-093 1:16 PM · 51 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Alvin Snyder talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm.
  • 042-094 1:16 PM · 21 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 1:16 pm and 3:00 pm.

All 77 conversations from May 5, 1971 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 042-097, May 5, 1971. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/042-097 (accessed October 3, 2026).