Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 43 › Conversation 043-062
Nixon phone call with Mulligan on Prisoners of War and Vietnam War
Tuesday, February 13, 1973 · 9:34 AM–9:41 AM ET · White House Telephone · 7 min
AI Summary
President Nixon called Mrs. James Mulligan to express his appreciation for her husband’s eloquent public statement following his recent release as a prisoner of war in North Vietnam. The two discussed the importance of the unwavering faith shown by POW families, the transition of veterans returning to civilian life, and the President's commitment to ensuring the ongoing release of remaining prisoners. Nixon also shared his vision for a post-war Southeast Asia, emphasizing his goal of securing peace without communism and acknowledging the role of his diplomatic policies, including the contributions of Henry Kissinger, in achieving these objectives.
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Transcript (AI-generated)
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Hello?
Mr. President, Mrs. James Mulligan.
Hello?
Ready.
Hello?
Hello, Mr. President.
How are you?
Mrs. Mulligan, I just thought you should know how proud we were of all of the men when they came up, but particularly of your husband when he made that very fine and eloquent statement.
Well, thank you.
Thank you.
We're very proud of him.
And we're so glad that he's back and that, as I told...
Some of the people here, I said, without the unwavering faith of their wives and their children and so forth, we could not have achieved what we have.
In other words, I know how much all of you have been through.
We're most grateful for what you've done for the country as well as for what they've done.
Well, thank you, Mr. President.
I just finished talking to him again.
Good, good.
And he sounds great, just fantastic.
Great, great.
And we're very proud.
Yeah, you're not worried about the long hair, are you?
Oh, Lord, yes.
It looks horrible.
Although, I don't know if you noticed, and you probably didn't, we would, but Jim had sideburns, and it was so noticeable because, you know, none of the other men did.
And he said, well, I got a haircut today, and I said, oh, you didn't.
He said, well, I really grew the sideburns because I figured, he said, I had to live with those kids.
Sure.
Well, you tell them that that's the way it is.
I mean, there are lots of families, and every kid has got to, you know, live his own life, and it's the way they are.
I remember President Eisenhower used to, before David married Julie, he used to, David used to wear, not as long as they do today, but this was for, I mean,
uh four years ago and he said uh he uh offered him 25 he'd get his haircut he wouldn't do it i know that's what tim said when he got home you know he was getting down for haircuts and i said well let's kind of go a little slow on that sure sure well that's great he's uh he's they're all great but i was impressed by him and and by captain denton and also their
The Colonel, they're really a great bunch of men.
Well, he mentioned you this morning.
He said that Colonel Reisner had called you.
Reisner, yes.
And he said that, he said, you know, he said, Mr. Nixon must be one of the finest men with a very strong moral character to have done what he did with the opposition that he had, because if it hadn't been for him, we would still be in Genoa.
Well, let me say this.
I can remember those years, I mean, going back to a little meeting in the library with some of the, you know, the POW wives and MIA wives.
Yes, I was there, Mr. President.
You were there in the first one, weren't you?
And then you know all the dinners after that.
The last one, I think, was at Statler.
But I always remembered I'd go there and I'd always say, well, don't lose faith.
And you never did.
And I kept, I didn't lose faith, but I just don't see how you stood it.
But believe me, the fact that you stood it, the fact we had your backing, really made the difference.
Well, you know, we question the times, Mr. President.
Question?
Everybody does.
My goodness.
But what I meant is you could have so easily joined, you know, just getting out and said, look, get them back.
We don't care what you do.
Of course, if we tried, we wouldn't have gotten them back.
You see, that's how these people are.
We had to do what we did in order to get them to be sensible.
Yes, well.
But thank God it's done, and we hope everybody else gets back before they change their minds.
Yes.
If they change their minds, we'll know what to do anyway.
Well, we've got to get them all back, Mr. President.
They're all coming.
They're all coming.
I've been in constant contact with Kissinger, and it's going to go forward on schedule.
You noticed the 27 came out after a little hassle out of South Vietnam yesterday.
Yeah.
And the others are on schedule, will be on schedule.
And, of course, the very fact that they are aware that we expect them to and we're going to hold them to it is going to make them do it because that's our clout, you see.
You don't want to use it.
Nobody likes to use strong means, but we found that's about the only thing that works with these people.
Yeah, well, it's unfortunate, but perhaps I hope your overall plan works because it would be tremendous to
Well, the main thing now is that, as I told Colonel Reisner, that these men, the men who died and the men who were POWs and all who served, not have done it in vain.
So that's why we just, and I think that we have a good chance that South Vietnam particularly and possibly Cambodian Laos will now be able to,
grow up in peace.
And even North Vietnam, we would prefer that what remains there of their people, they should live with their neighbors in peace.
If that happens, it's all worthwhile.
And if the South Vietnamese can have peace without communism, then it's really worthwhile because anybody who's been to a communist country, Peking, Moscow, you name it, I mean, you know, and any kind of a country with any degree of freedom knows what the difference is.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yes.
Well, anyway, I liked what he said about faith in God and faith in his country, and obviously I would add faith in his family.
We have great faith in him, and thank you so much for taking the time to come.
Well, I'm glad we're not going to have to have any more meetings.
Oh, so am I.
But we will expect, after everybody has rested and everything, why we want to get you and your husband down sometime along with some of the others, and just thank them personally.
Okay.
We hope to see you very soon.
No hurry, no hurry.
Thank you.
As a matter of fact, you brought one up on him.
You can tell him that you met me before he did.
Oh, yes.
And I talked about Dr. Kissinger.
You know, he said, do you know him?
And I said, honey, I know everybody.
That's right.
That's right.
You ought to point out that Kissinger's a very eligible bachelor, too.
Oh, he knows this already.
Yeah, yeah.
I had quite an experience with Dr. Kissinger in the White House that someday I will tell you about.
Right.
I promised him I wouldn't write any memoirs until he was long.
I'm gone.
You tell your husband that I warned you that Kissinger was not to be trusted with anybody now.
Not to be trusted with anybody except the North Vietnamese.
How's that?
I think I'd better tell him that until he gets home.
All right.
Oh, I'm in.
Okay.
Goodbye.
Bye-bye.
NARA Description
On February 13, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon and Mrs. James Mulligan talked on the telephone from 9:34 am to 9:41 am. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 043-062 of the White House Tapes.
Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 43-62
Date: February 13, 1973
Time: 9:34 am - 9:41 am
Location: White House Telephone
The President talked with Mrs. James Mulligan.
[See Conversation No. 854-14]
Prisoners of War [POWs]
-Return from captivity in North Vietnam
-James Mulligan’s statement
-The President’s appreciation
-Families
-The President’s appreciation
-Mulligan’s appearance
-[Dwight] David Eisenhower, II’s hair
-33-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Conversation No. 43-62 (cont’d)
Dwight D. Eisenhower
-Capt. Jeremiah A. Denton, Jr.
-Col. Robinson Risner
-Mrs. Mulligan’s conversation with her husband
-The President’s policies
-Risner’s statement
-POW release
-The President’s policies
-Henry A. Kissinger
-South Vietnam
-Strong means
-End of the Vietnam War
-Risner
-South Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, North Vietnam
-Peace without communism
-People’s Republic of China [PRC]
-Soviet Union
-James Mulligan’s statement
-Future visit of POWs to White House
-Kissinger
-North VietnamAlso recorded on February 13, 1973
- 854-009 9:15 AM · 13 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 9:15 am and 9:34 am.
- 854-010 9:15 AM · 26 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 9:15 am and 9:34 am.
- 854-011 9:15 AM · 41 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 9:15 am and 9:34 am.
- 854-014 9:34 AM · 7 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Mrs. James A. Mulligan, Jr. met in the Oval Office of the White House from 9:34 am to 9:41 am.
- 854-015 9:41 AM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 9:41 am and 9:48 am.
- 854-016 9:41 AM · 11 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 9:41 am and 9:48 am.
- 854-038 9:41 AM · 10 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 9:41 am and 9:48 am.
- 854-017 9:48 AM · 48 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Charles W. Colson, Manolo Sanchez, and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House from 9:48 am to 10:52 am.
Cite this conversation
Conversation 043-062, February 13, 1973. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/043-062 (accessed October 1, 2026).