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Conversation 045-149

TapeTape 45StartWednesday, May 2, 1973 at 6:35 PMEndWednesday, May 2, 1973 at 7:55 PMParticipantsHaig, Alexander M., Jr.;  Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob")Recording deviceWhite House Telephone
AI Summary

In this discussion, President Nixon and H. R. Haldeman deliberate on the appointment of Alexander M. Haig, Jr. as an interim White House Chief of Staff to provide firm leadership amidst the unfolding Watergate crisis. The President stresses the need for a strong figure capable of controlling White House staff members like Leonard Garment and George Shultz, while also managing Henry Kissinger. They agree that Haig should be brought in immediately on a temporary basis to command operations, with the potential for a permanent arrangement to be decided later.

Alexander M. Haig, Jr.H. R. HaldemanWhite House Chief of StaffWatergate scandalPresidential management
AudioNARA Description

On May 2, 1973, Alexander M. Haig, Jr. and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 6:35 pm and 7:55 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 045-149 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 45-149

Date: May 2, 1973
Time: Unknown between 6:35 pm and 7:55 pm
Location: White House Telephone

Alexander M. Haig, Jr. talked with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman.
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             NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                (rev. October-2012)

                                                      Conversation No. 45-149 (cont’d)

White House staff
     -Haldeman’s conversation with Alexander M. Haig, Jr.
           -Appointment as Chief of Staff
                 -Military career
                 -Henry A. Kissinger’s reaction
     -Haig
           -Attributes
           -Leonard Garment
           -Proposed meeting with President
           -Assignment
                 -Terms
                 -Duration
           -Location
                 -Georgia

President’s schedule
      -David Packard
      -Haig

White House staff
     -Garment, George P. Shultz
           -Intentions
     -Haig
           -Relationship with Kissinger
           -Intelligence, experience

Watergate
     -Haldeman’s testimony
     -Gordon C. Strachan
           -Firing by James Keogh
           -Testimony
     -Egil (“Bud”) Krogh, Jr.
           -Activities characterized
           -Justice Department

President’s schedule
      -Haig
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                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                     (rev. October-2012)
Transcript (AI-Generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

You just want to be darn sure that you aren't going to get yourself in trouble by putting a military man in.
I don't agree with that.
I totally disagree with that, but what's the other part?
That one he felt was the big problem.
The secondary problem, he said, there would be a problem vis-a-vis Henry, who would not like the idea of the fact that Haig
has substantive views that are contrary to Henry.
No, but Henry has got this other shape up.
He's not acting very well.
I think that's right.
Plus, I think, and Al felt, too, that Henry would...
initially maybe have some concern about it, but would get over it pretty quickly.
He did not see that as a debilitating factor.
The military thing doesn't bother me a bit, Bob.
As far as Henry, that's an in-house thing that we can handle.
But Al's the only man for it.
I mean, I thought of everybody else as I was going out to Julie's and coming back tonight in good gut.
Al knows the whole thing.
He's loyal, tough, strong.
He can handle the likes of the, you know, the garments and the rest.
Well, that's the point.
Nobody's kind of
Nobody's going to give any bullshit on him.
Because he knows everything.
I think for the next few weeks at least, you've got to have somebody there who can't be Buffalo.
How would it be done?
You just point him as...
I don't know.
I'd talk to him.
I mean, you ought to talk to him.
I will tomorrow.
Tell him to work out the way to do it.
He'll know how to do it.
I would think...
I don't know.
You've got to decide what you want to do.
I would think that you would not do it as a permanent thing.
You would ask him... Oh, no, no, no.
It's a temporary additional duty.
He's taking additional leave to take on.
...from his active assignment and come over as White House Chief of Staff for the interim period here.
And then his assignment should be to review the holes and take immediate command.
Right.
Instant command.
and to get things moving right the way they should be now.
And make recommendations.
And then to either work himself into or out of a permanent job.
That's right.
Depending on what you and he feel is the best outcome.
You may both feel that he ought to stay there.
I wish he would, but I don't want to put that to him so hard right now.
I don't think he should.
I think it ought to be a temporary thing.
Right.
It ought to be determined after.
I think it should do that tomorrow, don't you think?
Yes, sir.
Okay, boy.
I do.
He's down in Georgia at some maneuvers or something.
And he's available by phone, and if he's ordered up, he can come up so I can get him back.
Tell him I want him to come up, and I'm going to be here over the weekend, okay?
Okay.
You want him to come see you in the morning, then?
Yeah, about 11 o'clock.
All right.
I'm going to see Packard at 9, you see, and I want Al to come in.
We're going to take over this goddamn place.
Otherwise, you're going to have the likes of
You know, Garment and Schultz and the rest.
They all mean well.
They mean well, but basically they're wonderful people, but they don't understand what the hell the game's about.
That's right.
That's right.
And they can be very useful if they're under the right kind of direction and all that.
And Al can do it.
And Al also can control Henry.
Right.
Otherwise, I'll be in every five minutes of Johnny.
The ideal thing about it is there's nobody there that can buffalo him.
He's smarter than any of them, and he knows the track better than any of them.
That's right.
And that's the overriding advantage.
That's right.
Right.
Good.
Okay.
Anything else to report?
No, sir.
Okay.
Well, good luck tomorrow, boy.
All right.
Just stand firm, tell the truth, and screw the bastards.
Right-o.
Because you're on the right side.
You know that, Bob.
I certainly do.
And what's up with John?
What has he said or done or anything?
Nothing.
He's in good shape.
He was fired a couple days ago.
So the poor guy's out of work.
That's fair enough.
That's all right.
He's hanging tight and he'll do fine.
Well, you tell the truth.
God damn it's right.
The truth is pretty good.
That's right.
Yeah.
This whole business about Crow really burns my ass because basically you were just doing the right thing, weren't we?
Absolutely.
And God, the Department of Justice knew the whole thing.
It wasn't a question of me keeping anything from them.
They knew it all.
That's right.
When they said to move, I moved.
Right.
Okay, bye.
Thank you.
I'll see you in the morning.
Bye.
11 o'clock.
Okay.
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