Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 45 › Conversation 045-203
Nixon phone call with Haig on Watergate and FBI Directorship
Thursday, May 10, 1973 · 4:54 PM–5:00 PM ET · White House Telephone · 6 min
AI Summary
President Nixon and Alexander Haig discuss the public relations fallout surrounding the indictments of John Mitchell and Maurice Stans, with Nixon expressing frustration over the underlying circumstances. The conversation shifts to scheduling meetings with Henry Kissinger and William Rogers to manage media coverage, as well as vetting William C. Sullivan for the FBI directorship based on strong recommendations from Senator Henry Jackson. Additionally, they review potential candidates for other high-level appointments, including James Schlesinger and replacements for the commission roles previously discussed with Earl Warren.
- Watergate
- FBI Directorship
- Personnel Appointments
- Henry Kissinger
- William C. Sullivan
- Public Relations
Audio
Transcript (AI-generated)
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Hello.
Yes, Mr. President.
Now, I thought with all the indictment of Mitchell and Stanton today that for me to talk to Henry tonight would be a real loser, you know.
Oh, I think so.
He doesn't expect— Well, apart from that, we want to do it for news purposes, and what I was thinking was that maybe that, if you would like, that—and tell me whether you think it's a good idea that he and Scowcroft and you and I might have
breakfast in the morning.
How does that sound to you?
Or should I just meet him at 9 o'clock?
Is that better?
I think 9 o'clock would be better.
He may be a little punch drunk.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
All right.
Maybe 10 then.
Give him time, yeah.
All right, sir.
But I do—you are going to have a—it should be covered.
Oh, God, yes, yes.
We're meeting with him now.
In any event, too, Rogers has got to be on that damn thing, too, you see.
See, Rogers is going off.
See, we're having a meeting with him at 11 to send him off.
So I don't think it should just be Henry and me.
It should be he and Rogers and I.
Don't you think so?
Yes, sir.
That would be excellent.
Right.
But Henry actually wants to see me alone.
Yeah, you ought to do that maybe with Scowcroft, if you want, or talk by yourself.
No, no, Henry, I want to do how he is.
He likes to talk alone.
That's better.
And why don't you suggest to him, or you or Scowcroft, suggest to him that
I'll see him at—that Rogers is coming at 11, that I'll see him at his convenience at 9.30, 10 o'clock or so forth.
That's good.
That's good.
Good.
And, you know, it's good to have this story coming, you know, with the— It's excellent.
You know, let me say, I just told—I hate to see—
Good guys like Stans and Mitchell undied it, but goddamn, they did dumb things, you know.
Good God, a lot of perjuring themselves about a goddamn campaign contribution.
That's right.
But I think that's just one of the little battle scars we take, right?
That's right, sir.
But you're getting very good play today on today's exercise.
You think so?
Oh, yeah.
It's coming.
This is the way we want to do it.
steady, solid.
Steady and not too damn spectacular.
No, not spectacular.
No, that's right.
But I tell you, I had called some scooch acts and he said, God damn it, he said, this is great.
He said, he's thinking about which one, both?
Both.
In fact, he said, he said, you better do the same and the FBI and the president will
Well, settled everything down.
Tell me, what the hell on your FBI guy?
Did you try to check on that 52-year-old guy?
Can you do it?
I did.
He's a good man.
He did trouble with—he worked with a campaign committee this summer.
And while he had no involvement with these other characters, he was there and it would be smelly.
That's right.
Now, Jackson pushed very hard on Sullivan.
He said he's just the best pro in the business.
Well, check him out.
No, I mean, the fact that Peterson and everybody else is against him may mean that he's the guy we want.
Well, that's right.
He just didn't get along with Hoover, and what's left over there is Hoover's entourage.
That's right.
And I'd just as soon take Sullivan in, and I'll tell you what you do.
You know him well?
Yes, sir.
Very well.
Get him in and have a cold, tricky talk and see if we appointed him, if he'd clean up the assholes and be our man.
Right.
Well, I know he'd be that.
Hell, he's the guy that did all that early work.
But on the other hand, will he be asked about the early work?
Well, that's all right.
He doesn't care.
That's clean.
That was all above board.
But I like Sullivan.
The Jackson's high on him, too.
Very high.
He said he's the best man he knows in the Bureau, and he'd clean it out and get the morale and the discipline back.
And see, the reason the other guys don't like Sullivan is that he was basically trying to get Cooper in the ass, Al.
Exactly right.
All right, I'll give that assignment to you.
You talk to Sullivan.
On a cold, jerky basis, say, what in the hell should we do with the FBI?
We can't put Byrne in the job.
He's made a fool of himself in that court case.
Oh, God, he couldn't do it.
No, I think getting a professional is—it's really got to heal the bipartisan.
They're really pleased.
Really?
Yes, because, you see, these guys have been here for years, and they've got these lines and friends.
Yeah, like Colby.
That's right.
Jackson was pleased with Colby.
Very pleased.
He said that's top-notch.
He was really pleased.
Schlesinger, of course, they all know is a pro, cold turkey pro.
Nobody dislikes Schlesinger.
They just think he's great.
Actually, he would be better than Richardson, you know, because basically he's more hard line, more cold, more tough.
That's right.
I mean, he'll cut the fat out, but he won't cut the muscle, and Richardson would cut the muscle.
That's exactly right.
Precisely right.
I'm more pleased with him than I ever would have been with Richardson.
Right, right, right.
We haven't heard anything from—I talked to Rogers, and he said he was trying to get Warren.
Yeah, he just called me this morning, and Warren said he just thought this was too political, but Bill thinks—and I told him to go back and check with the Chief Justice.
And to see whether I can put more pressure on Warren because he said Warren was sort of wishy-washy.
And he might be able to get him to do it if the Chief Justice thinks it's kosher.
I see.
But if not, Tom Clark.
Right.
And we'd have to tell Warren that we're going to go to Clark and that might be enough to tie him, you see.
Yeah, yeah.
Well, Bill, should I call Bill on this score or are you concerned?
If you— Yeah, all right, I will.
High five.
Fine.
Okay, bye.
NARA Description
On May 10, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon and Alexander M. Haig, Jr. talked on the telephone from 4:54 pm to 5:00 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 045-203 of the White House Tapes.
Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 45-203
Date: May 10, 1973
Time: 4:54 pm - 5:00 pm
Location: White House Telephone
The President talked with Alexander M. Haig, Jr.
Watergate
-Indictments of John N. Mitchell and Maurice H. Stans
President’s schedule
-Henry A. Kissinger
-Press coverage
-Meeting with Kissinger, Gen. Brent G. Scowcroft, and Haig
-Kissinger, William P. Rogers
-Rogers’s trip
Watergate
-Stans
-Mitchell
-Indictments
-Perjury
Press coverage of President
Henry M. (“Scoop”) Jackson’s telephone call to Haig
-William E. Colby appointment
-Federal Bureau of Investigation [FBI] directorship
-Unknown candidate
-Background
-William C. Sullivan
-Sullivan
-Qualifications
-Henry E. Petersen
-J. Edgar Hoover
-Possible meeting with Haig
-Loyalty
-Early work with White House
-130-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Conversation No. 45-203 (cont’d)
-Jackson’s view
-Opposition to Hoover
-Possible meeting with Haig
-Comparison with William M. Byrne
-Bipartisan support
-Colby
Dr. James R. Schlesinger
-Comparison with Elliot L. Richardson
-Toughness
Watergate
-Rogers’s call to Haig
-Earl Warren’s response
-Warren E. Burger
-Tom C. ClarkAlso recorded on May 10, 1973
- 045-200 4:49 PM · 11 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 4:49 pm and 4:51 pm.
- 045-201 4:51 PM · 1 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Rose Mary Woods talked on the telephone from 4:51 pm to 4:52 pm.
- 045-202 4:52 PM · 13 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 4:52 pm and 4:54 pm.
- 045-204 5:00 PM · 10 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 5:00 pm and 5:01 pm.
- 045-205 5:01 PM · 3 min — President Richard M. Nixon and William P. Rogers talked on the telephone from 5:01 pm to 5:04 pm.
- 045-206 5:04 PM · 18 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 5:04 pm and 5:17 pm.
- 045-207 5:04 PM · 13 sec — White House operator and President Richard M. Nixon talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 5:04 pm and 5:17 pm.
- 045-208 5:04 PM · 11 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 5:04 pm and 5:17 pm.
Cite this conversation
Conversation 045-203, May 10, 1973. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/045-203 (accessed October 12, 2026).