Nixon, Calhoon & Berger on Merchant Marine and Shipbuilding

Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

Download transcript (.txt) · JSON data

Click a timestamp to play from that point; the page address then links to that moment (e.g. #t=125).

United States having gotten out of the airbrake business by failing to build the SSG and other things that we're not going to get out of this and we just got to have a strong healthy merchant marine that's the way I feel about it I stated this when I was in San Diego

So what I'd like to do is to hear from you.

Those who, Pete, you want to be the moderator here, call anybody you like, any of you speak up, and tell me what I need to know about this brand of a

Mr. President, you know how concerned you are about productivity.

Let me just give you a couple of facts that I think will put you in harm's way.

And these gentlemen can tell you how they're doing it.

On the old so-called T2 tankers, I'm told that for 16,000 deadweight tanks, it used to take 45 men's crew.

This shift here, as you've just heard, is $265,000, and 26 men through nearly a 30-time improvement in output.

And that's one very important fact.

I think it might interest you, gentlemen, to tell you a little bit about it.

How does that come about?

How is that possible?

This is down to it with the cooperations.

probably one of the most dramatic changes i think in the way we're moving this country in the last 10 years this is another banner day that isn't getting much notice just because there are no strikes this is the second time this administration the contracts have been renewed in this industry with no work stoppage

You know, at that point, I guess we had a report yesterday from the Coastal Living Council to realize how cheap our job is.

The lowest this month, the strike level is not as good as the lowest in 50 years.

Where are you building?

Yeah.

The only thing that we're ashamed of is that our ship is only 225.

But an interest to you and to the country, I think, is the fact that we presently employ 2,000 people and we're building up to 5,000.

Of these 2,000 people, I venture to say that 75% would have been on welfare.

So the impact of that... Really?

Really.

You're going... We're employing minorities, about 85% of minorities.

Are they efficient?

Are they willing?

As the president, I think that they're efficient.

The presidential committee, which you appointed on shipyards, has visited our yard numerous occasions.

And I was pleasantly surprised to have read their report.

They said that they were...

Mr. President, on the job search, which I think is a great point in addition to productivity, I would estimate that these shifts, both at the yards and their suppliers,

will amount to about 36,000 jobs and an additional 800, I believe, on these ships themselves.

So this is a real job.

I'd like to have additional emphasis put on not just the boat, which is you build them and then of course you repair them and then

And that's that.

But on the continuing, that's the same.

So that's my statement.

I don't think you're correct.

I think there are about 800,000 ships themselves, which we would presume will continue.

Yeah, but if you get more... What I'm speaking of is not only this field...

Every area speaks up.

The more efficiency, the more jobs.

That's one of our goals.

We're trying to link this to the study.

We may have a few problems.

Well, no, we didn't have any problems with them, but we didn't... Well, of course, we got our contract within that, uh, guidelines.

But, uh...

Increased productivity of seamen on the ship ran about 3.5% per year between 1961 to 1965.

Since then, since 1971,

Productivity is up about 14% per year.

The airlines are always considered to top in increasing productivity.

In the years 1972, we surpassed the airlines

you may recall the president of the program he sat at the congress in 1969 and was entitled to one of the challenges he challenged this industry very hard I think this has come true in their wildest expectations I remember he was in San Diego

is uh and it's one of the very little credit it's it's an industry that has had more than waiting for it and so when as you saw what happens in the press it's a dramatic change around for improvement that's what i said and uh i think one significant thing about it this morning it certainly dramatizes the confidence and great deal the investment public has in this industry

president as a shipbuilder and i built it for maine yeah and my customers from san francisco his fleet in the pacific the merchant reenactment act of 1907 has given our industry the chance to live in our shipyard in maine the ship's built on our site for over 200 years and we were almost gone and this this program the opportunity to sit down with a customer

and negotiate a contract and negotiate a design which is very innovative and it's going to put a new classroom type of ship in the Pacific which hasn't been seen before.

It's just very innovative and safe.

You're not looking to the future because our cyber system runs on a kind of wiki.

We in California are always accused of having the Pacific first policy, because we can't hear any more about what goes on in the Pacific.

We can't see it in New York City, so we worry about Europe.

Well, I happen to be one of those.

It's not a half world, but a whole world.

I can't remember if that was both.

I mean, if you have a threat to the security of the United States in any part of the world, any part of the world,

As you let it go, it's like the leaf in the dike is making a difference.

It comes and again it's going to knock it down.

So thanks so much for that.

But looking at the Pacific and looking at the future, not five years from now, but 20 years from now, we have to realize that we all know what's happening in Japan in terms of trade with the United States.

And Japan will soon be the second.

the economy of the world.

It will be second only to the United States.

Well, it'll pass the silver check because of their enormous, enormous, I don't know what that means.

Debt.

Debt leading up to the moment is the mainland Chinese.

Looking on down the road into the Southeast Asia, everything from

to Taiwan, Asia, to the Southeast Asia, Thailand, Asia, to the Middle East.

it is inevitable that there's going to be more and so there's not there's something out

Because of the number of people that are there, because of the potential, it's starting to play an enormous role economically in the world.

We have to realize, too, that in terms of people forgetting systems, I mean, everybody here has certain ideas about the communist system as such.

Certain of these countries, if you come back, still, whatever false we have, what we prefer.

But nevertheless, if you look at the Chinese system,

people who have seen the Chinese in the world, you've seen them in Singapore, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Vietnam, let alone in San Francisco.

They're enormously capable people.

The Japanese play a great role.

What I'm suggesting here is that if you take a long view,

There's an enormous amount of great stuff in San Francisco, which is the gateway to the Orient.

I go back to Joe Moore and other old boys.

His dad, anyway.

So that is now looking the other side of the world.

I know this is a highly controversial issue.

because our systems change because our philosophies are not different because we don't recognize the problems that free society or

and we'll always have what they call a communist society.

But the countries in eastern Europe, Poland for example, Slovakia and so forth, there's going to be a lot more treatment.

And it is inevitable.

And Secretary Peterson, as you know, is going to go to Russia the latter part of July, sometime in July.

So there's not going to be any problems.

But also there will be some very, very great opportunities.

What I'm suggesting here is that, as I see it, this industry should be ready for it.

Ready for it.

Because we're talking about air freight and all the rest.

Sure, that's necessary for strong areas and a lot of other things.

But when you come down to it, as I understand it, I have San Diego.

This is still the cheapest and most efficient way to sit in it.

Correct.

Mr. President, you were speaking of the communist-law countries.

I'd like to say that the Merchant Marine plays a particularly important role in a number of viewpoints.

During our major foreign aid programs,

The Communist Menchies didn't advertise the fact that we were supplying them with wheat.

I can tell you that my company, at the time of Manhattan,

Delivered wheat to Poland and to the Soviet Union to Odessa.

Well, it's a hard thing to hide a ship like the Manhattan.

And when the old glory was waiting, and we would deliver the wheat, both the Soviet Union and the Polish citizens knew that the United States were trading and aiding these particular nations.

So aside from just the pure trade aspect...

Very true, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Well, this is something we know where there are problems involved, and they're very difficult ones, and I don't think we should get into today, but I want all of you to understand that my trips to Beijing and to Moscow have nothing to do with trying to modify our philosophy or work on it.

That is going to happen.

Not on our part, not in the near future, so maybe we talk about a century, maybe, I don't know.

But on the other hand, if you look at the world, you're going to find increasingly that the compacts, the trade area, and so forth, they're going to change.

It's inevitable.

It's inevitable because people, the enormous capability, are just going to find these.

And I don't want business to end with silver.

They're going to immediately have enormous opportunities to feed off that.

It's all right to pay $800 million to the Chinese.

It's not going to happen because they've got to sell something to us.

But things are going to happen.

It's going to happen.

The Soviets, you know, they're going to have things.

So do us.

There are problems of credit.

There are problems of American bonds.

There are problems, you know, a lot of things we know about.

But I think that all of you, sort of as we try to work in these things, I remember that we're all working towards it.

As the pie gets bigger, we're all going to get a little bit more of it.

That's really the philosophy, right, Pete?

Yes, sir.

Mr. President, aside from the immediate impact on jobs and consenting, you might be pleased to know this is the largest peacetime shipbuilding order in the history of the United States.

If I could just take a minute, I'd like to tell them... How large?

$660 million.

The largest in peacetime history.

I'd like to take a minute to tell them that you realize that the whole...

before the first atomic explosion.

I was reading this at the end of the day.

It doesn't count as a meeting with Potsdam at the first, and Stalin at the back of the explosion.

And Churchill said with great admiration that his contribution, this wasn't a party act, it was a question of dollars.

He said it was a better thing, you know, to throw it off like that.

uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh...

with our people to come up with recommendations first on research and development for what kinds of new propulsion systems, new kind of ships will be adequate for the future, and what role the government should play in that, and we're very busy working with that.

Second, Mr. President, you will remember our discussion about deep water docks and the problem we have in this country if we're going to be competitive so that all the jobs don't end up in Canada and the Bahamas and so forth.

What kind of a program we can put forward on that?

Because until we solve that problem, we really haven't solved the graduate problems.

And I think they would be just as nice.

For your instructions, we're very busy working on both those issues.

That is one thing that could keep this all in context.

You know, there's been a lot of almost euphoric attitude after these trips abroad as well.

We're going to get along and all this and that and the other thing.

And to a certain extent, it's going to be a safer world.

Not never totally safe.

Even friends fight and adversaries inevitably make.

The fight that I make is, however, it'll be safer, although maybe not because of the

the human philosophies, but only because pragmatic people get together and their interests require that they get along.

In other words, I said they should either live with their differences or die for their differences, and that's what the whole philosophy is about.

But as the world becomes somewhat safer, as communication between peoples and nations and different philosophies progresses, the world is going to become much more competitive.

That's the point.

Who would have ever thought that they'd have the World War II?

I was in Japan in 1963 right after the Vice President.

I saw that.

Who would have ever thought that Japan, after its almost total destruction, its virtually misdestructed, its completely misdestructed, our condition being it was really, apart from the atomic bombs, it had been really snagged.

Who would have thought it would be where it is today?

Anybody that stood as I did on it,

And there, what was the only thing left, the Great Corrupt Sea Orchard, I showed that in a tower in 1947, when I was there, and I looked across, that total destruction of what the bombers did, so that they are the most corrupting people in New York.

Who would have thought that could have happened?

Looking at the Soviet corruption, I mean, with that, in my view, terrible system, repressive system,

It does bring out the energy to people, but who would have thought the communist system would be liberal?

Were it not the Russian people who were strong, vigorous, comfortable, who would have thought that they could, at the present time, of all of the inefficiencies and the liabilities of their system, be second only to the United States, as they are in terms of production.

Now, they are, but that doesn't mean that they're in consumer goods.

They're anywhere in the air, so it doesn't mean that as far as life is concerned, it is

that it wasn't any of us, like I said.

And so, as I see the world, we're going to live in the time the United States is the case.

We need to react as we're working.

We could live.

We were in a race.

And there was just nobody in it with us.

Nobody.

We were so far ahead.

We produced half of the world's earth.

Now we're down to a third.

It's still pretty good.

Too many people have the same thing.

But you must remember that what has happened is the world begins to...

as the new Europe gets together you know all the potentials of that it's good in one way it means a more peaceful Europe but in terms of competition with the United States it's a block of enormous enormous threat to us I don't say that

in a fearful way, I just say it in a realistic way, and looking at the Russians and the Chinese, remember, they're a very, very capable people, I mean, with the communist system, and the Eastern Europeans, even Marshall, because basically they have their traditions, I mean, and the Czechs were the highest per capita in communism.

So Czechs, even under communism, are gonna be a significant factor.

Looking further down the road.

Latin America.

And of course the balance of Asia.

All these are potential competitors for the United States.

What I'm simply suggesting is that

And there isn't any question that our system is the best.

There isn't any question of our ability to win any race we get into.

But you only win races when you move ahead.

You never win when you're standing still and the other guys catching up.

And that's what our focus is on, is to remember we're in a real race.

We can talk about what Pete has just said about these big docks and these big ships and the rest of them.

Let me say here, I want to see the American fishermen.

That's still to be second.

I mean, now maybe get 260,000 is the right size, maybe 500 is too big.

That may be the argument.

But in terms of having, I'd like to see ours be the best boats, just like the Yankee Clipper was the best ship 100 years ago.

I want ours to be the best.

And, and, and, and,

in various areas.

That's why I was such a strong opponent of the SST that one day we're going to build it.

I mean, I do not want five years from now, seven years from now, eight years from now,

for Americans and for the people that traffic to the world would be carried around the world in Russian and British and French super soft sonic transport people say well who wants to go who wants to go three times as fast as we do today isn't a bullet fast enough and the answer is no I mean if you're going to take that long flight across the Pacific from Los Angeles to Tokyo or the long flight across the Pacific from Los Angeles to

or San Francisco to Pekin, or Washington to Pekin.

Let me tell you, it's going to take you 16 hours for free.

What are you going to ride in?

The American, just to prove you're going to like the American.

Or that rocket.

You're going to try the transport.

You're going to ride the rocket.

So let's build it.

That's the way we have to look at these things.

And I think that that's the attitude that Pete and all of us have been trying to get.

But we need your cooperation.

We need the cooperation of industry.

We need the cooperation of labor.

I mean, not simply to say, now look, we've got to have this, the government's got to help us here.

We've got to have these subsidies so we can continue to have the jobs.

That's not an attitude that will survive because in the end, what the government gives, the government can take away.

What we have to say is that I recognize the government role.

I recognize that other countries have their ways of subsidizing and do.

And we can't have an unsubsidized American industry competing with a subsidized industry in other parts of the world.

But what I am saying is that with this American assistance from them, that we are getting what we need.

And what I think about this last year is that

We need industry that is vital, strong, and competitive.

We need labor unions that recognizes that this is just a question of taking this present pie and cutting it up, expanding it, and welcoming the new developments, even though it may temporarily mean less jobs.

In the long run, there's going to be more, or some.

That's the real point, because in the long run, if you remain that competitive, there won't be any.

And I think this is an attitude that I think we owe a great deal to our leaders.

for their cooperation to the end.

What I'm suggesting is take the long view, look down the road, look at this country, and let's just be sure that the U.S. recognizes whether the race is on the scene or in the air or any place else that we don't like to lose.

I mean, I know that that's not rational these days.

They teach it in college.

I mean, it doesn't make any difference.

I mean, that's jingoistic to talk about an R&B number one.

We just might as well be number two.

yeah they cheer they aren't cheering for losers we're not a people that like to lose and that's good that's good and the main reason it's good is that not because we want to put somebody else down and have them be second because once a people ever accepts the proposition that we are going to strive to be number one we cease to do our best and we cease to be as good as we can be and that's not a good thing

it's not good for people.

I mean, you've got to hand it to our Soviet friends.

You've got to hand it to our Chinese friends.

And in their own way, I'm talking about the leadership.

They're not going to make it in my opinion, as far as we're in competition with us, because their system is not as good.

But I do know this, that the most important thing is attitude.

and you've got to have the business people, you've got to have the labor people, and we've got to inculcate it in our young people, that by God, let's have some of that spirit that said, well, the United States is going to sit back and let somebody else go ahead and we can help them.

We can do it through the merchant marine.

Maybe I'll help you with some of that.

Well, we have to adjourn this part of the meeting.

We always give you a little cricket here when you come to the White House.

These are the usual, the company who passed the bill with security last year.

These people aren't living in color.

We've got the presidential seal as it appears in the presidential flag.

which is an election year.

If you get that for your wife, and if you get that for your husband, if you get that for your wife, you have a new little pen that's with the presidential seal on his hand.

They'll all ask where he's worried and say, well, I was going to talk to the president of Washington and say, now come to me.

Mr. President, before we break up, I think that speaking for the industry, the shipbuilding industry, I think we can say that there are people in the administration, I think we've had all of that, I mean, Andy Gibson, Bob Blackwell has done one fantastic, fabulous job for us in the property business at Unlimited.

They're very capable, and I've heard a lot of people, a lot of people, with their elections, really, that's what they've done.

They've done a tremendous job implementing your programs.

We appreciate it very much and we thank you personally.

You all agree with that?

I say that our American crew is second to none.

I say that having experience of 20 years with foreign crews.

Let me say that.

I say that regardless.

I'm going to fly ahead.

When we first started talking about the Russian government, we ran it down.

We had a meeting with Andy Gibson, and we met with some of our more efficient operators.

And it was pointed out to us that on the American ship, if we took all the crew off, that we could then, with a full subsidy,

on our, on our business.

I see.

The reason we shifted from being builders is three basic laws.

It's not just a machine.

That's the 1970s.

Accelerated the appreciation and the attack on investment credit.

Without the combination of those three and the cooperation of everybody, the shift would not have been built.

It's that made it possible for us to get to the world market and compete.

Well, let's say I deliberately have not gone into this very delicately with the Russian regime and so forth and so on.

That's something, as I understand, that we've been planning and you're still working on.

Just let me say, the best thing is let's not lose the deal.

We want the deal for reasons that are taking a long haul.

And I don't see a reason to let somebody else have the deal.

It's got to be done.

Let's take it as far as we can.

I remember that's the biggest thing when I was a kid.

You know, we used to save up.

We had firecrackers.

Had a lot of fun.

The only... Are they going to rule out everything?

The only thing that's going to rule out this year is going to be seeing a devil.

That's already started.

I imagine daily is going to have fun.

That's already started.

That's what I would say.

Nixon, Calhoon & Berger on Merchant Marine and Shipbuilding

AI Summary

Audio

NARA Description

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Transcript (AI-generated)

Also recorded on July 1, 1972

Cite this conversation

Nixon, Calhoon & Berger on Merchant Marine and Shipbuilding

AI Summary

Audio

NARA Description

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Transcript (AI-generated)

Also recorded on July 1, 1972

Related conversations

Cite this conversation