Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 131 › Conversation 131-006

Nixon phone call with Haldeman on George C. Wallace

Wednesday, May 17, 1972 · 2:26 PM–2:35 PM ET · Camp David Study Table · 10 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob")Conversation131-006 on Tape 131 (tape position 00:04:56–00:14:24)StartWednesday, May 17, 1972 at 2:26 PMEndWednesday, May 17, 1972 at 2:35 PMRecording deviceCamp David Study TableSourceNixon Library record for 131-006 ↗ · National Archives Catalog, NAID 417175015 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and H.R. Haldeman discussed the logistics and potential political optics of a presidential visit to Governor George Wallace, who was recovering in the hospital following an assassination attempt. The two men also reviewed the ongoing 1972 election landscape, specifically examining George Wallace’s impact on third-party ballot access and the surprising momentum of George McGovern’s campaign through grassroots organizing. Nixon concluded the call by reflecting on the challenges of maintaining his own physical schedule and rest in anticipation of an upcoming trip to the Soviet Union.

Audio

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NARA Description

On May 17, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman talked on the telephone at Camp David from 2:26 pm to 2:35 pm. The Camp David Study Table taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 131-006 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 131-6

Date: May 17, 1972
Time: 2:26 pm - 2:35 pm
Location: Camp David Study Table
The President talked with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman.

[See also Conversation No. 189-17]

     George C. Wallace
          -President's visit
                -Harry S. Dent
          -Move to Walter Reed Hospital
                -Day and time
                -Dr. William M. Lukash
          -President's visit
                -Walter Reed Hospital
                -Holy Cross Hospital
                      -President's call
                -Walter Reed Hospital
                      -Advantages
                      -Logistics
                -Departure location
                -Date and time
                -Announcement
                -Dr. Lukash's report
                      -Cornelia Wallace
          -Condition
                -Call from President
                      -Considerations
                -Effect on President's visit, calls
          -President's visit
                -Walter Reed Hospital
                      -Press
                             -Advance notice
                      -Lukash
                      -Press statement
                             -Previous visits to Dwight D. Eisenhower
                             -Questions
                             -Content
                -Date
                -Announcement
                      -Lukash
                      -Considerations
Show the rest of the log (59 more lines)
     President's schedule
           -Trip to Soviet Union
                 -Preparations
           -Past week
                 -The President’s view

**********************************************************************

[Previous PRMPA Personal Returnable (G) withdrawal reviewed under deed of gift 11/03/2017.
Segment cleared for release.]
[Personal Returnable]
[131-006-w002]
[Duration: 1m 45s]

     Rest
            -Upcoming trip to USSR
                 -Time complications
                 -Scheduling
                 -Youth

**********************************************************************

     Blue Room reception
          -Response
               -Forthcoming call to Thelma C. (“Pat”) Nixon
               -Press reports

**********************************************************************

[Previous PRMPA Personal Returnable (G) withdrawal reviewed under deed of gift 11/03/2017.
Segment cleared for release.]
[Personal Returnable]
[131-006-w003]
[Duration: 2m 51s]

     1972 Election
          -H.R. Haldeman conversation with John Mitchell
          -George C. Wallace candidacy
                -Harry S. Dent
                -Third party ballot issues
                      -Michigan
                      -South
          -Michigan
                -Busing issue
                -Effect on the President’s vote
                -Effect on Democrats
                -Hubert H. Humphrey
                      -Labor
          -George McGovern
                -Colorado and Utah results
                      -Harry S. Dent’s report
                -District precinct conventions
                      -Hippies attendance and influence
                            -Kevin Phillips
                            -Barry Goldwater
                            -Young Republicans
                            -Politics
                            -Jack Drown
**********************************************************************

Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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Hello.
Yes, sir.
Did Harry Dent speak to you about the building calling?
What do you think?
I, on balance, think it's probably a good idea.
Yeah.
Without any announcement or anything, you know, just do it.
Yeah.
There is the one item which would help if it were, if you do that, but...
I understand he probably is going to Walter Reed, according to...
He's going today.
Oh, it says in two or three days.
Dr. Lukash tells me this is at 11 o'clock.
The move will take place in two to three days.
I'm trying to remember whether I got...
I think the report I got was after 11, was that he was going to move over there this afternoon.
That's good.
We'll see.
I don't think he should do it if he isn't over there.
I'm not going out to the hospital.
That's right.
I think a telephone call then does the trick.
Right.
But if he's over at Walter Reed, I think it's a pretty good move.
Then we could helicopter out there, could we?
No, I think it's easier to drive.
You create a stir if you helicopter.
Unless you came from up there.
If you were coming down from up there, you could stop on the way down.
Which wouldn't be bad.
That would be a hell of a good move, as a matter of fact.
Yeah.
If I were coming down, say, Friday morning, I could just hop over there.
Okay.
Well, let's not give any indication that we're thinking of that.
I won't tell Lukasz or anybody else.
Like today, it says Mrs. Wallace feels the governor's alert enough to take your telephone call today.
because Luke actually suggested I call him.
I said, well, I don't want to decide it right now.
And then Bob himself believes tomorrow would be better.
He's having morphine, is experiencing some difficulty hearing.
So I'm not going to come out there.
I'm not going to call him even for a couple days.
I don't think that... Of course, as you know, they do have press at Walter Reed, Bob.
Yeah.
And you'd get, that's right, there'd be press there, but I mean, we don't give any advance press word.
No.
I don't think, well, let's, when he gets over there, let's see what, we can get a good reading on the situation there because Lukasz can go over and see him.
Well, I suppose what you could do if he were there, so, I'd have to say a word when I left.
You know, remember when I used to go see Eisenhower?
Yeah, yeah.
Sons of bitches are out there.
But I would take no questions.
Yeah, you could just say you're encouraged, you know, you seem to be in good spirits and just that sort of harmless type stuff.
That's right.
And go on.
By the time I would do it, it would be Friday.
All right.
Something to do.
Fine, and we'll just say nothing, but just between you and me, I'll plan to do it.
Okay.
Don't tell Lukacs we're thinking about it.
No.
Because it gets around.
No, I won't, but we'll just get a reading.
Tell Harry that we just don't know yet.
That's what I told him.
See whether his condition, we've just got to be very sure it's the right thing to do.
I said it was something that we could possibly consider, but that you shouldn't say anything to anybody because it's not likely that you'd do it.
We'll just see what happens.
Right.
Okay.
Everything else going according to schedule today?
Yep.
All the planning and so forth?
Yes, sir.
Problems with our various things.
Boy, I must say, we've had quite a week, haven't we?
Really have.
Eight days, nine days.
Goddamn.
I hope you're catching up a little on sleep there, because you won't be getting much for the next couple of days.
Well, I did a foolish thing this morning.
I woke up at 6 o'clock.
Oh, dear.
So I got up, and I went to work until about 12.30, and then I tried to take a nap.
I slept a little.
But sleeping is going to be one hell of a problem, as usual, going over there, because...
problem is going that way is that i'll be getting up at the you know in the middle of the night yeah that's what i mean so yeah well i'll be getting up middle of the night but beyond that uh well we've got a time so you don't have a lot of stuff in the morning you go slow on the early morning stuff yeah so that'll help a little but it's hard to sleep anyway
Well, actually, staying up at night isn't going to be so hard over there, is it?
No, because it'll be earlier here.
Well, gosh, this sleep is just one of those things.
I don't know how the hell we do it.
I don't know how I used to do it.
I used to do it, but I can't.
Well, you just need more sleep as you have more in your mind.
Well, that's it, and it's harder to get it.
Well, that's it.
When I used to do it, I think that I'd hit the bed and I'd just sleep.
Dismiss everything from your mind.
But you don't do that.
You can't do that now.
I don't think there's anything else.
You continue to get good reactions in the blue room, I hope.
I'm going to call Pat.
Absolutely.
And there's good press on it, which they've said over here.
The press is starting to write some.
Yep.
Good.
Good.
They're writing good on it, are they?
Yep.
Well, that's fine.
Have you talked to Mitchell at all about the Wallace things?
Have you got any ideas?
He's just kind of puzzled.
He thinks it poses a hell of a problem, but he can't figure out what it is.
Yeah.
That's really kind of the way everybody figures it out.
Yeah, Harry Dent thinks it's going to make him a hell of a lot tougher.
Third party.
Well, either way, third party too.
Although...
Harry recognizes that there are a number of states where it's awfully hard to get on the ballot.
It'll be hard for him to get on in Michigan, for example.
Yeah.
There, of course, we might want him on.
I mean, it's the South.
Well, except it's the anti-busing people that would be with you if Wallace weren't there.
Yeah, that's true.
In Michigan.
That's true.
That's true.
Yeah.
But
Much easier for an anti-busing Democrat to vote for another Democrat than it is for an anti-busing Democrat to vote for a Republican.
But they seem to be so strong on anti-busing that I think you'd still pick up a bunch of them.
You'll get some, that's right.
And he sure showed that labor can't deliver for Hubert there.
Poor Hubert just took a hell of a bath.
He really took a bath.
Yes, sir.
And that damn McGovern keeps coming.
Harry says in Colorado and Utah he picked up a lot of delegates.
And he's, you know, he's working around.
That's it.
He's working on all those quiet ones, you know, where he just stacks them away.
That's right.
And the way Harry says, the hippies all go to these district precinct conventions and they've got nothing else to do.
Right.
And they're doing it.
They're doing it on a pretty systematic basis.
It isn't just haphazard.
They've got it, you know, they've got them figured.
He's got these
young kevin phillips types you know that yeah they're figuring it all out well also they got the types that you know that uh bill waterhead in 64 you know they're the type that used to love to sit down figure it all out the sort of the yr professionals types and uh politics is a great game for them yeah and uh i mean they they're just the opposite of some of the people that
I mean, the people we have had, some of our people, not all, but some who are just as good hearted as they could be.
Well, like a Jack Brown, for example.
Yeah.
You know, who wouldn't know how to count.
Yeah.
I mean, they just, these guys are just brutal and vicious.
And love it.
And love it.
And love to go in and do the grubby work and so forth.
Well, sir.
Anyway, we shall see.
That keeps it interesting.
Yes, sir.
Okay, bye.
Bye.

Also recorded on May 17, 1972

  • 189-017 2:26 PM · 6 min — President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David from 2:26 pm to 2:35 pm.
  • 131-007 2:35 PM · 11 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 2:35 pm and 2:36 pm.
  • 189-018 2:35 PM · 6 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David at an unknown time between 2:35 pm and 2:36 pm.
  • 131-008 2:36 PM · 4 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Walter R. Tkach talked on the telephone at Camp David from 2:36 pm to 2:40 pm.
  • 189-019 2:36 PM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Walter R. Tkach met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David from 2:36 pm to 2:40 pm.
  • 131-009 2:40 PM · 6 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 2:40 pm and 2:42 pm.
  • 189-020 2:40 PM · 6 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David at an unknown time between 2:40 pm and 2:42 pm.
  • 131-010 2:42 PM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman talked on the telephone at Camp David from 2:42 pm to 2:44 pm.

All 65 conversations from May 17, 1972 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 131-006, May 17, 1972. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives (NAID 417175015). Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/131-006 (accessed November 14, 2026).