Conversation 153-001

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I was a matter of fact, uh, when I was, uh, I learned from Rose, you'd call the

When we were in Florida, I said, well, when I get back, I'll give you a ring.

I'm at Camp David now.

I just met with Hague.

He's back from Saigon.

Back from Saigon.

And that, incidentally, is going just right.

Going just right.

Yeah.

As you can imagine, we had the wraps on those last two or three days, and they were charging.

There was nothing going on.

But you can be sure it's all done.

Oh, I was well aware.

But I can't tell you it's been such fun because of our opposition, what is told to the jury.

Well, they must be.

I can't tell you it's been fun.

They must be dying because, you know, they all were right to the last.

They were saying, oh, it's going to change and the polls will come down.

And now they're stuck with it.

Whether it's their 61-38, that's...

You know, they are... All they can say is we didn't win the Congress.

Well, that doesn't mean much these days.

That doesn't mean much.

Not as things are going now.

It's one of the most fantastic... You must be getting a lot of reactions from people, your old friends.

I'm having a good time.

Yeah?

A really good time.

Yeah, really?

I'm mean as a hornet.

That's great.

I try and keep my cool.

Yeah, of course.

I nearly didn't in the campaign.

There were moments when I felt...

But nobody needed me.

If I was ever needed, I was there.

Of course, of course, of course.

Yeah, yeah.

And I kept— Well, you know, they talk about tactics and all, Watergate and all that.

Have you ever heard, I mean, a president attacked as roughly as we got as the Shriver-McGovern people took us on?

I mean, the names that they called.

I mean, I look back to the time that, you know, your father was in, and they talked pretty rough in those days.

But they used a term like a rat or something like that, but my God.

The world murderer.

And as a matter of fact, Pat used the rat on himself.

And he said, even a rat when cornered will fight.

Poor William Howard.

Even a rat when cornered will fight.

Yeah, I'll never forget that.

Yes, but we behaved very badly.

We did.

The Bull Moose, we behaved dreadfully.

Yeah, well.

We were dreadful, but never mind.

That language was nothing compared to what they used, though.

Oh, but dear Mr. President, I'm nice to call you.

I nearly wrote you a note.

call you dear dick because it was between time well of course between the nomination and the next right right i retreat now right to mr president right and dear pat she's doing such a good job yes well actually you know they uh they they i really was proud of the family pat and julie and tricia they they banged her out at 30 states oh i think but of course when i look at when i consider the

As I've told the people about me, my mother and I were put behind a screen door in the drawing room and allowed to listen, but we couldn't be seen.

When my father was nominated for vice president.

Vice president, right, right, right, right, right.

Oh, and the rest of the time, once I did dedicate...

dedicated bridge or something.

Right.

Before he went out.

And that is considered iconoclastic.

Of course.

Boy, how times have changed.

Well, I hate to see you.

Let me know sometime when you and Patterson are around.

Well, we'll do it.

But you're in good spirits, obviously.

I'm not quite in good spirits.

I'm rather old.

Well, so am I.

Did you realize that I will reach that magic age of 60 on January the 9th?

January 9th, 60.

And that is really old.

For this office, you know.

Yes, that's right.

For this office.

I was reading a biography of your, of T.R.

T.R.

And he died when he was 60, didn't he?

I know.

Didn't he?

He was a little bit over 60.

Remember, he was, because he left the presidency when he was only 52.

He was only 52 when he left the presidency.

And he just managed to get there about...

two months earlier than John Kennedy did.

Right.

Well, one thing I think we really must—you know, when you stop to think, after all of the abuse we took, that we took—we not only got forty-nine states, and Julie, who went to Smith, said, if we had to lose one, I'm glad it was Massachusetts, because they treat them pretty rough up there.

But anyway, you get the point.

But we also, as it turned out, you know, we had the biggest numerical margin and also the biggest—

Yes.

Oh, yes.

The biggest in America.

And also the biggest percentage spread.

It was bigger than—you see the what?

They're very pleasing figures.

I've gone through them all with very many channels.

Oh, what fun.

And now there's no word used still.

Yeah, we are going to try the Vietnam thing, as I said.

When the story comes out, I think you'll think we look pretty good, because we knew, I knew three days before that we were going to go forward with everything, you know?

Did you really?

Of course, but I couldn't say it.

No, of course not.

Because, you know, he didn't want to blow it.

But it's all right.

It's all right.

I figured it.

And I knew we were going to take heat for it, but it was a little rough to have them saying that the whole damn thing was a hoax.

Well, you know, and to have some of our brethren in the press play it that way, like Peter Lissigar, people like that.

A little bit shocking.

Well, all right.

But I do hope I'll see you soon.

Yes, we will.

We'll get together and we'll have a little fun with some good reactionaries, if you don't mind.

Good reactionaries.

Good.

And let me know when I can come down and see Pat.

Great.

I'll do it.

Okay.

Bye.