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Conversation 157-024

TapeTape 157StartFriday, December 8, 1972 at 12:05 PMEndFriday, December 8, 1972 at 1:12 PMParticipantsShultz, George P.;  Camp David Operator;  Ehrlichman, John D.Recording deviceCamp David Study Table
AI Summary

George P. Shultz and John D. Ehrlichman discussed personnel matters regarding the second-term administration reorganization, specifically noting that Arnold R. Weber declined potential appointment offers. The pair reviewed a request from Samuel R. Pierce, Jr. to serve as a circuit court judge after completing his current Treasury duties, rather than accepting an ambassadorship. Additionally, they addressed a request for a presidential pardon for William R. Ming, Jr., a Chicago lawyer facing tax fraud charges, which Ehrlichman agreed to refer to John W. Dean, III.

Second term reorganizationArnold R. WeberSamuel R. Pierce, Jr.Presidential pardonJudicial appointmentsPersonnel management
AudioNARA Description

On December 8, 1972, George P. Shultz, Camp David operator, and John D. Ehrlichman talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 12:05 pm and 1:12 pm. The Camp David Study Table taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 157-024 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 157-24

Date: December 8, 1972
Time: Unknown between 12:05 pm and 1:12 pm
Location: Camp David Study Table

George P. Shultz talked with the Camp David operator.

[See Conversation No. 234-16]

       Request for a call to John D. Ehrlichman

Ehrlichman talked with Shultz at an unknown time between 12:05 pm and 1:12 pm.

       Second term reorganization
            -Arnold R. Weber
                  -Job offer
                        -Department of Health, Education, and Welfare [HEW]
                        -Shultz’s deputy
            -Samuel R. Pierce, Jr.
                  -Treasury Department memorandum
                        -Chicago lawyer
                              -William R. Ming, Jr.
                                    -Tax case
                                    -Health
                                    -Tax case
                                          -Possible penalty
                                                -Fine
                                                      -Compared to jail
                                          -Pardon
                                                -Christmas 1972
                                          -John W. Dean, III
                  -Ambassadorship
                  -Circuit Court Judge
                        -Completion of current work
                                               -32-

                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                        (rev. Apr.-08)
Transcript (AI-Generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

John Ehrlichman, please.
There you are.
Thank you.
John?
Hi, George.
Yeah.
On Arnie Weber, we're pushed for an answer here.
No.
He won't take it?
No.
Will he take anything?
I doubt it.
He might have been interested in ATW, but sensing that somehow he doesn't quite want it there, I think by this time he wouldn't take that.
Okay.
He would take probably something.
I probably could have gotten him to be my deputy, but I don't think it would have been a good idea.
I get it.
Okay.
Thank you.
I got a couple of other things for you.
I have a memo from Sam Pierce in the Treasury about a Chicago lawyer, a black lawyer named Ming, who was found guilty of fraudulent behavior on his income tax.
Apparently he's a brilliant black lawyer.
And he's guilty.
He had a heart attack.
He's had all sorts of mitigating things.
And there's a fair amount of pressure for imposing a strong fine but not sending him to jail, I gather.
that the president is the one who issues these pardons and at Christmas time there may be some.
So I've got a piece of paper on this which I'll leave with you if you're the proper person to look at it.
John Dean processes those.
Okay.
Well, I'll leave that with him.
Yeah.
Okay.
Very fine.
What do you want to do with Pierce?
Pierce does not want an ambassadorship.
He wants to be a circuit court judge.
I mentioned that to the president.
He said, well, fine.
He wants to stay in the department for about eight months or so.
He's got a number of things that he's doing that he wants to complete.
Okay.
And then he'd like to leave and be a judge.
Okay.
Very good.
Thank you.
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