{"conversationCode":"164-025","tapeNumber":164,"conversationNumber":25,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-164-025","startDateTime":"1973-04-29T00:20:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1973-04-29T01:10:00.000Z","startDate":"28-Apr-1973","startTime":"7:20 PM","endDate":"28-Apr-1973","endTime":"8:10 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"estimated","participants":"Ziegler, Ronald L.; Camp David operator; Warren, Gerald L.;","description":"On April 28, 1973, Ronald L. Ziegler, Camp David operator, and Gerald L. Warren talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 7:20 pm and 8:10 pm. The Camp David Study Table taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 164-025 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"CDST","recordingDevice":"Camp David Study Table","latitudeEstimated":39.648333,"longitudeEstimated":-77.465,"chronCode":"5.5","chronRelease":"Fifth Chronological Release: Part V","chronReleaseDate":"21-Aug-2013","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 164-25\n\nDate: April 28, 1973\nTime: Unknown between 7:20 pm and 8:10 pm\nLocation: Camp David Study Table\n\nRonald L. Ziegler talked with the Camp David operator.\n\n     Request for telephone call\n          -Gerald L. Warren\n          -Charles W. Colson\n\f                                             -21-\n\n                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                             Conversation No. 164-24 (cont’d)\n\nZiegler talked with Warren.\n\n     Watergate\n          -Washington Post story\n                -John W. Dean’s evidence on H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman and John D.\n           Ehrlichman and cover-up\n          -Dean’s knowledge of illegal activities in White House\n          -Wiretapping\n          -Possible sworn testimony\n          -White House confusion since April 17, 1973\n          -Bob Schoegrin (sp?)","filename":["164-025.mp3"],"tapeStart":"","tapeEnd":"","participantsList":["Ziegler, Ronald L.","Camp David operator","Warren, Gerald L."],"prevCode":"164-024","nextCode":"164-026","transcript":[{"start":0.22,"end":2.6,"text":"Yes, Pace?"},{"start":2.74,"end":3.77,"text":"Hi, this is Ron Zuckler."},{"start":3.79,"end":4.15,"text":"Yes, sir."},{"start":4.17,"end":4.99,"text":"Would you do me a favor?"},{"start":5.91,"end":5.99,"text":"Yes."},{"start":6.01,"end":9.24,"text":"Have one of the operators get Jerry Warren on the line for me right away."},{"start":9.26,"end":15.49,"text":"Then have the other operator place a call to Chuck Colson and hold him on the line until I can come back on."},{"start":15.51,"end":17.07,"text":"Thanks a lot."},{"start":19.52,"end":19.66,"text":"Thanks."},{"start":46.69,"end":49.33,"text":"Mr. Warren."},{"start":49.57,"end":50.27,"text":"Yeah, Jerry."},{"start":50.29,"end":52.54,"text":"Well, I just got my first hint of what the Post has."},{"start":52.56,"end":53.02,"text":"What is it?"},{"start":53.3,"end":55.54,"text":"They have a wire service, you know, that goes out to clients."},{"start":55.58,"end":55.88,"text":"Right."},{"start":55.9,"end":56.3,"text":"What is it?"},{"start":56.32,"end":66.37,"text":"The story says John Dean has evidence to show that he has been under the direction of Haldeman and Erichman conducting a cover-up of White House involvement in the Watergate case."},{"start":66.39,"end":73.84,"text":"Just a moment."},{"start":73.86,"end":74,"text":"Mm-hmm."},{"start":74.08,"end":74.18,"text":"Yeah?"},{"start":74.91,"end":79.15,"text":"and had been reporting to them regularly."},{"start":79.33,"end":83.7,"text":"Reporting to them regularly."},{"start":83.72,"end":93.61,"text":"Hold on just a second."},{"start":93.63,"end":95.05,"text":"Yes, sir."},{"start":95.07,"end":95.23,"text":"Hello?"},{"start":95.25,"end":95.55,"text":"Yes, sir."},{"start":95.57,"end":104.22,"text":"The story also says Dean also has knowledge of other illegal activities in the White House."},{"start":106.17,"end":114.15,"text":"including wiretapping, going back to 1970."},{"start":119.63,"end":122.2,"text":"Dean is prepared to testify to this under oath."},{"start":125.08,"end":132.25,"text":"He goes on to say one reason why there hasn't been a faster action"},{"start":133.38,"end":145.81,"text":"in the White House following the President's statement on the 17th, is that there is confusion since officials and Bob Sjogren, who called me... Yeah, go ahead."},{"start":145.85,"end":147.03,"text":"I don't have time for that crap."},{"start":147.21,"end":147.72,"text":"Go ahead."},{"start":147.74,"end":157.95,"text":"Officials, apparently Hallman and or Ehrlichman, are trying to mount a counter-defensive against Dean."},{"start":157.97,"end":158.63,"text":"Is that it?"},{"start":159.73,"end":160.35,"text":"That's it."},{"start":160.37,"end":161.49,"text":"Thanks a lot."},{"start":161.51,"end":161.61,"text":"Okay."},{"start":162.23,"end":166.64,"text":"Thank you."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"Ronald L. Ziegler initiated a call to Gerald L. Warren to receive a briefing on an impending Washington Post story regarding the Watergate scandal. Warren reported that John Dean was prepared to testify under oath that H. R. Haldeman and John D. Ehrlichman directed a White House cover-up and possessed knowledge of illegal activities, including wiretapping. The conversation highlights the internal state of alarm and the chaotic efforts by senior officials to mount a counter-offensive against Dean's damaging allegations.","topics":["Watergate scandal","John Dean","H. R. Haldeman","John D. Ehrlichman","Cover-up","Wiretapping","White House press operations"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T09:21:05.261Z"},"topicSlugs":["watergate-scandal","john-dean","h-r-haldeman","john-d-ehrlichman","cover-up","wiretapping","white-house-press-operations"],"audioDurationSec":172,"audioFiles":[{"file":"164-025.mp3","bytes":5498880,"durationSec":171.72,"bitrate":256178,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:20:04.104Z","findingAidSource":"nixonlibrary.gov subject log (2024-05), reslice-v2","findingAidUpdatedAt":"2026-09-18T08:42:58.124Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/164-025.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/164-025","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/164/conversation-164-025","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}