Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 165-008
Date: Friday, May 11, 1973 at 7:08 PM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haig, Alexander M., Jr.
Recording device: Camp David Study Table
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/165-008

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[0:00] Hello, Mr. President?
[0:02] Hi, Al.
[0:03] Yes, sir.
[0:05] We've just gone through this thing, and it's really very clean.
[0:11] We've got six newsmen, ten staff.
[0:16] We cut off date.
[0:17] The last one was done on February 9, 1971.
[0:21] But what about Lake?
[0:22] Lake is the same.
[0:25] He's unpacking.
[0:26] But was it done by the FBI?
[0:29] Yes.
[0:30] And everyone... No, but wait a minute.
[0:31] Lake was in 71 Lake, wasn't it?
[0:36] Yeah, we have February 9th, 71 cut off on every one of these cases.
[0:41] Including Lake?
[0:42] Yes, sir.
[0:43] Yeah, but Lake retired Al in late 71, didn't he?
[0:48] Oh, no, no, no.
[0:49] After Cambodia.
[0:50] That's right.
[0:51] That's spring of 71.
[0:55] Well, the spring, but what about lake stuff?
[0:57] Was it done by the FBI or by... All by the FBI.
[1:02] Now, what this could mean is that there could have been some other tasks, but they would have been done outside of this framework, and they're not with this material.
[1:14] All right, that's the main thing.
[1:15] We don't have anything in the White House on it.
[1:17] We have nothing here in the White House on it, and...
[1:19] For that reason, we can take a very strong stand.
[1:23] Good.
[1:23] Now, we've been with Ruckelhaus.
[1:26] Correct.
[1:26] What I found out is what's really happened here.
[1:29] What is it?
[1:30] This stuff was sent to the White House by Bill Sullivan.
[1:33] Right.
[1:33] Because J. Edgar Hoover told him, or inferred that he was going to use it to blackmail the White House.
[1:41] Hoover said that?
[1:42] That's right.
[1:43] Blackmail the what?
[1:44] What the hell?
[1:45] What?
[1:46] Well, there's an awful lot of juicy stuff in here.
[1:49] You mean about what?
[1:51] Well, different people.
[1:53] Oh, in the White House, yeah.
[1:54] In the White House.
[1:56] And Sullivan just felt that he never had reached the point of his dotage in which he couldn't afford this.
[2:03] Now, this is all wrapped up in this terrible gut fight that's been going on within the FBI and between the FBI and justice.
[2:12] Right.
[2:12] Where there's even been threats on people's lives and everything else.
[2:16] That's right.
[2:17] That's right.
[2:17] Now, Ruckelhaus says that
[2:20] He's got to finish his investigation, which the last interview will be tonight.
[2:26] And that's me.
[2:28] Good.
[2:29] So I'm ready to give him some juicy wounds on the foot.
[2:32] Now, he doesn't think he can go until Monday with his announcement.
[2:36] In terms of all of us.
[2:38] All right.
[2:38] Problem.
[2:39] So what Henry can do tomorrow is just bridge off.
[2:42] He said, I understand the director of the FBI has completed an investigation.
[2:48] And we'll have something to say on this the first of next week.
[2:51] But I want to emphasize that every report we had was received by a duly authorized director of the Department of Concerns, CIA, or the Federal Bureau of Investigation.
[3:05] Right.
[3:06] And they were, now, in this respect, they'll be sure that you get in the facts that I pointed out earlier, Al.
[3:13] I mean, how many were done in the Kennedy administration?
[3:16] How many were done in... That's what we're putting in Ruckelhaus' overall statement.
[3:20] That's right.
[3:21] Yes, sir.
[3:22] Absolutely.
[3:23] So we'll have a good zapping statement from him.
[3:26] Everything is... Oh, and I want him to feel very comfortable with it.
[3:29] You know, he's got to believe it.
[3:30] Well, he's coming over here tomorrow.
[3:32] These things are so clean, he ought to look at them.
[3:34] I want to look at them, and I want Lazard to look at it.
[3:37] Well, he's been... Lazard has?
[3:39] Yes, in fact, he...
[3:41] Almost every packet has a...
[3:43] A memo on it signed by Mitchell.
[3:46] Approved by Mitchell.
[3:48] What about the Lake one?
[3:53] Well, you know, I don't mean each man's name, but there are several memos here.
[3:57] Lake is the one that I'm concerned about because of the fact that... Well, I know that after he was in the other camp.
[4:04] But if that was done by Hunt, God knows where it is, and it was not done within the...
[4:13] It's not in the White House files.
[4:17] No.
[4:19] Okay.
[4:20] I have Ruck looking at everyone.
[4:23] Does Ruck want to make a statement then?
[4:24] He wants to do it Monday.
[4:25] He said he'd need all weekend to sort through these things because the eyeballs are always internal sabotage and brawling.
[4:34] What's his ruling about Felt?
[4:37] Well, I think Felt will be a victim of this thing.
[4:42] I wouldn't, you know, my point is, why push him at a time when he can then go out and babble around, you know what I mean?
[4:50] Well, maybe to the point where he can't even risk not doing it.
[4:55] He's not willing to discuss his internal investigation.
[4:59] I know.
[5:00] But, uh...
[5:01] But, uh, see, Sullivan is against the vote, you know.
[5:04] Very much.
[5:05] Very much.
[5:06] Sullivan's our man.
[5:07] That's right.
[5:08] If this thing comes out clean...
[5:11] And there's a house cleaning over there.
[5:13] Well, I don't know.
[5:14] We'll just see.
[5:16] But we've got to be in a position where we put it all out.
[5:19] That's right.
[5:21] There were a number of... We conducted these investigations.
[5:25] They were less than have been done previously.
[5:28] They were for national security purposes, period.
[5:31] Well, you look at this operation.
[5:33] It was so modest.
[5:35] Sixteen people.
[5:36] Men, staff, and six businessmen.
[5:40] Yeah, that's correct.
[5:41] That's nothing.
[5:42] Yeah, but that includes Lake.
[5:44] That includes Lake.
[5:48] And the purpose was to check leaks.
[5:53] Exactly right.
[5:55] Well, good.
[5:59] But just be sure Reckonsaws knows we're not holding anything back.
[6:02] He can look at anything he wants to look at.
[6:04] That's right.
[6:05] And we want the whole thing out.
[6:08] Let him, because he's Mr. Clean, you see, let him hang it out.
[6:11] That's exactly right.
[6:12] He's not just for, you know, I don't know, Ruck will play the game.
[6:16] Oh, hell, he's a good man.
[6:17] I'm just not sure if he wants to do that job.
[6:21] Or, you know, he's the best guy for that job.
[6:23] Maybe he is.
[6:24] Maybe we ought to leave him there if he gets worked into it.
[6:27] All right.
[6:28] Clean it out, then.
[6:32] Good.
[6:32] I'm glad you've gone through it.
[6:33] You'll feel a little more comfortable then.
[6:35] I feel like we're all set, sir.
[6:36] And Henry's well geared.
[6:38] We'll go over it again.
[6:39] Henry, let's go and have a briefing then.
[6:41] Yes, I think we ought to have it.
[6:42] I'll tell you what the hell.
[6:43] Face up to it.
[6:44] We don't have to be prepared.
[6:46] And you should just go out and say, look, I'm not going to discuss these.
[6:52] Whatever was done, there were a modest number done.
[6:55] I mean, there's a modest number in any administration for purposes of leaks.
[7:02] That's right.
[7:03] And everyone signed by the agency had concerns.
[7:08] But they were all legitimate.
[7:10] That turns out a lot of those, yeah, hell, he knew.
[7:13] You know, at first, he sort of planned the game.
[7:15] He didn't know about any of these things.
[7:17] Yeah, we don't understand that.
[7:19] I just don't understand.
[7:20] I understand that he's trying to say he didn't do a damn thing, but God damn it.
[7:25] It wasn't done without his approval, you know, Al.
[7:29] Well, his signature's on these papers, so he's going to have a red face.
[7:33] It's a signature of the Lake Papers, by any chance?
[7:40] No, it's a separate piece of paper, but it has a listing of the various documents.
[7:46] And I think the Lake Papers are included in that listing.
[7:52] You know, it's a summary.
[7:54] Yeah, but you see, you never know what Hunt's going to say, what the hell he was doing.
[8:00] Well, Ehrlichman assures me that
[8:04] Well, as assured me, he doesn't believe that Hunt did any bugging.
[8:09] Well, I don't think he did either.
[8:11] You don't?
[8:12] No, because it's a very risky, difficult thing to do.
[8:17] Yeah, you have to have a lot of complicated material.
[8:20] The agency doesn't, the Bureau doesn't, in co-coordination with the phone company.
[8:24] That's right.
[8:27] Okay, boy.
[8:28] Well, I think we're coming along.
[8:32] Henry is in LA as
[8:33] God damn, I don't know what to say to him this morning, but he's just humming.
[8:37] Well, I want him to go out there tomorrow tough and strong and say, of course we did this.
[8:41] You know, if he's asked, but then say, I'm not going to discuss it.
[8:45] But I want to talk about the Soviets.
[8:46] You know, there'll be a report, and a report's going to be made, a full report, and that everything we've done is done for the purpose of national security.
[8:55] That's right.
[8:56] And what have you thought?
[9:00] Have you done any more thinking about what you ought to put out there?
[9:03] I kind of think it won't pay off.
[9:07] That's my feeling.
[9:08] It's a little too...
[9:09] It's really vicious and it's sort of vicious and rough.
[9:13] It's not the bitches that deserve it, but it isn't really the issue we need.
[9:17] Tell me what we need.
[9:19] Let's leak out about a week or two from now.
[9:22] That's what I think.
[9:23] That's right.
[9:24] Okay, I'll go ahead, sir.
[9:26] Fine.
[9:27] All right.
[9:27] And you got Cigarette on board?
[9:28] Yes.
[9:29] Yes, I've been over it with Ron, with Ron Henry, and I'm going to bring him a breast now, a vocal health problem, but he can't do it till Monday.
[9:38] Fine.
[9:39] He's in good shape.
[9:41] Fine.
[9:42] Okay, I'll thank you.
[9:43] Bye, Mr. President.
[9:50] Bye.