Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 165-023
Date: Saturday, May 12, 1973 at 2:04 PM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haig, Alexander M., Jr.
Recording device: Camp David Study Table
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/165-023

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[0:00] Hello?
[0:01] Yes, Mr. President.
[0:03] Hello, Al.
[0:03] Any developments?
[0:04] Yes, sir.
[0:05] Al is held up and won't be in now until Monday, I see.
[0:13] We've been going over a game plan here, which involves getting some good coverage on the issue of the McCarthyism issue and
[0:29] but a kind of a new window that's going out.
[0:31] Now Ron hit very hard bridging off the Florida.
[0:36] And he had his breeding already?
[0:39] Yes, he's done it, and it's just about right.
[0:43] So I think we've got some backdrop against the dribbling that's come out today on Gray.
[0:51] On the other hand, what we do have to do is... You haven't gone Gray yet?
[0:57] No.
[0:58] We've got a message with the girl, the woman in his house, for him to call.
[1:03] And he has not called.
[1:05] His lawyer has just disappeared.
[1:07] We can't find him anywhere.
[1:10] Now, I think we have to go to get this sort of a backfire responsibility bill in a more careful, delicate way.
[1:22] And we've got a very good game plan for that.
[1:25] We use a
[1:27] over in defense.
[1:29] We've got excellent contacts, as you know.
[1:32] Yes.
[1:33] Stennis is working covertly all through the Hill now.
[1:36] He's active doing that.
[1:38] Right.
[1:39] We're going to get with the legal profession, and that's going to be done very carefully.
[1:45] Jack Kilpatrick, we have a good way to get him.
[1:49] Yeah.
[1:51] And then we will have, of course, some key pressure points countrywide.
[1:57] Uh, outside of Washington, all of the focus is right here.
[2:01] Right.
[2:02] So, uh, I think it's important to get this kind of thing built.
[2:06] Yeah.
[2:07] You see, what we have here, sir, is a, a very, a weird need of keeping this thing, uh, impressed for, for moderation.
[2:17] Insanity.
[2:18] Right.
[2:19] But tell me about, about Ron.
[2:21] Did Ron hit hard on the fact of, goddammit, that President did not, uh,
[2:25] Oh, yeah.
[2:28] He said, get the hell off and get your ass off into the work or whatever.
[2:32] I don't know.
[2:33] No, no.
[2:33] He hit very hard.
[2:35] He reiterated the same points made Miami, or to keep his game explicitly as hard.
[2:42] All right.
[2:44] Yeah.
[2:45] No, he didn't.
[2:45] You know, we did not because this is not playing that heavily.
[2:49] Actually, it doesn't.
[2:50] It's a great story.
[2:51] Yeah, it's not.
[2:53] And as a matter of fact, the post played it in a very interesting way.
[2:57] How did they play it?
[2:59] So we got the wire service, the Daily News, and... What do you say the post played in an interesting way?
[3:06] Well, you see what happened here.
[3:07] There are two forms, the committee and the jury.
[3:12] Right.
[3:13] And there is an obvious difference in the interpretation of the two audiences or the sources from those audiences.
[3:22] And the post just laid it out, one being quite good.
[3:26] They read a jury later in the day, which made it very clear that you were not warned.
[3:35] Well, I was warned.
[3:37] Well, they said it was not a warning, it was a... Information.
[3:41] Yes, and that they're going on with this.
[3:46] The point is, did Ron hit hard on the one plight that is in the only good plight, that whole gaggle of stuff that investigates the facts?
[3:57] Exactly.
[3:58] Did he hit that or not?
[3:59] Yes.
[4:00] Yes, he hit that very hard.
[4:01] Good.
[4:02] Good.
[4:05] Well, that's good.
[4:08] So, what's the plan for the rest of the day?
[4:11] Still trying to get Gray and hope he makes a statement.
[4:14] Yes, we're going to continue on that.
[4:16] And maybe bug him one more time, that girl up there, the woman.
[4:21] He knows.
[4:21] He knows.
[4:23] We're trying to get him working, but that's where he is.
[4:25] We haven't gotten him from positive.
[4:27] Yes.
[4:28] Now, we've worked over Ruckelhaus a little bit on his statement for Monday.
[4:35] He did.
[4:36] It was our idea to shake him up on that.
[4:39] get that thing out the right way.
[4:42] I'll be sure we're going to all the things that were done before we got here.
[4:46] That's right.
[4:48] The details on past administrations.
[4:51] Right.
[4:52] Right.
[4:55] Necessary for national security.
[4:57] That's right.
[4:59] Now, Ruckelhaus had some in-house pressure over there to release the names of the newsmen.
[5:05] Let me say this.
[5:06] I thought about that
[5:08] The release of anybody who was investigated is out.
[5:12] It's a disaster.
[5:13] That's right.
[5:14] No, it will not release the names of anybody because that would impinge upon the rights of innocent people.
[5:19] That's right.
[5:20] That's right.
[5:21] And then we go to Dan first.
[5:22] No, sir.
[5:22] No, sir.
[5:23] It says it will not release any names.
[5:26] Under any kind of pressure, can he resist that?
[5:28] Yes.
[5:29] Yes.
[5:30] Yes, he's convinced it's the wrong thing to do now, but the czar needed about 30 minutes of logic with him before he understood this.
[5:37] All right.
[5:38] It's dangerous, isn't it?
[5:40] Well, it's just dangerous, but it's wrong.
[5:42] Good God, I mean, like Henry Brandon should be, maybe not a goddamn thing.
[5:46] That's right.
[5:47] And then they have no alternative but to fight you.
[5:49] They have a remedy.
[5:50] That's right.
[5:51] That's right.
[5:53] I think we may have just gotten gray on the phone.
[5:58] No, but could you call me right back then?
[5:59] Yes, sir.
[6:00] All right.
[6:01] Hello?
[6:02] Yes, sir.
[6:02] I'll call you right back.
[6:04] Yeah, okay.
[6:04] Good.