Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 169 › Conversation 169-022

Nixon phone call with Ziegler on Watergate and John W. Dean III

Wednesday, June 20, 1973 · 11:58 AM–12:02 PM ET · Camp David Study Table · 5 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); Ziegler, Ronald L.Conversation169-022 on Tape 169StartWednesday, June 20, 1973 at 11:58 AMEndWednesday, June 20, 1973 at 12:02 PMRecording deviceCamp David Study TableSourceNixon Library record for 169-022 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and Press Secretary Ronald Ziegler discussed concerns regarding J. Fred Buzhardt's investigation into Watergate-related activities, specifically focusing on a tape Charles Colson provided to John Dean and allegations surrounding the improper handling of campaign funds. They expressed frustration with Dean's conduct and discussed the potential for holding him in contempt for his refusal to testify in executive sessions before the Ervin Committee. To counter the negative narrative, the administration planned to have the Committee for the Re-Election of the President issue a letter demanding the return of the funds, while also coordinating media logistics for the upcoming visit of Leonid Brezhnev.

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Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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Well, yes, sir.
Are we able to get Brett?
Right.
He doesn't have anything.
What they're talking about here is the thing that we all have talked about before.
It simply is the tape that he has is the tape of Colson talking to Hunt, which Colson gave to Dean, you know, back...
some time ago why did he give it to him well this was back in december i think or november when colson apparently took the tape to dean and said that this sounds very curious dean said don't worry about i'll take care of it and uh dean never would give it back because we've talked about this a lot you know wait a minute wait a minute oh this is a case for a hunt that's right uh saying look uh
Colson has probably already addressed this.
Yeah, that's right.
So he has nothing beyond that.
That's what they're talking about.
Nothing beyond that.
I don't know where Hunt, in effect, said, I got to have clemency or so forth.
No, no, it doesn't relate to that at all.
It's just something like people aren't coming through with their commitments or so.
And Coulson said, that sounds very curious.
He gave it to Dean.
Dean said, I'll take care of it.
Don't transcribe it.
And, you know, Coulson felt, I assume, that Dean was, you know, handling the matter from a judicial standpoint.
But that's all it is, and I bet that probably Dean will try to tie Colson into... Well, perhaps so, but then Colson can answer that.
The point of it is, that is the light thought that was something like that.
See, well, we had talked about that at length.
We know, we know damn well, I mean, we at least we think that Dean didn't have any tape.
That's right, and he doesn't.
But basically, this is something that Colson gave him the tape for.
Isn't it funny that, well, isn't funny Colson worked that way, didn't he?
Yeah.
What about the committee?
Can they...
Dean can't refuse to go up there.
They can hold him in contempt, can they?
Yeah, what he refused to do was to appear in executive sessions.
Oh, well, that's all right.
Still, you can be held in contempt for that, too, right?
Yeah, if he pushes that line, I suppose, though.
They could do that.
So, that's all that was.
Fred must be just like a kid with a...
or the new toy with this money thing, you know, and brought that up himself.
How did he find that out, you know?
How in the devil did he do it?
I don't know.
I think he got a tip on it.
I just don't know.
I haven't asked him that.
Curious.
I'm going to do the curious thing here.
You know, I didn't.
Did you ever hear about the, did you ever think that Dean was still in money?
Never, never, never, never, never.
Good heavens.
You know, they can talk all they want about Alderman and Colson and the rest, but they're honest men, Ron.
That's right.
You know what I mean?
They wouldn't steal a penny.
That's right.
Now, this has got to...
I would think that even Time magazine would have trouble with this one.
Yes, sir.
Absolutely.
The golden boy business.
Right.
Huh?
Yes, sir.
Even the Post and Waller Cronkite, maybe, huh?
That's right.
The Nets didn't pick it up yet, did they?
Or did they?
Yeah, the Nets ran it.
Yes, sir.
How'd they run it?
Like, what, the charges?
I didn't see it, but they made reference to it.
And I think they'll be forced into more pickup on it here as the days go by.
But we stay miles away from it.
Yes, sir.
Does the letter run?
Yes, sir.
Unless it starts to drop, then we'll have to goose it.
Bizarre is having a letter written to Dean asking for the return of the money in a strike for creep.
That's good.
Yes, sir.
They should return the money.
It doesn't belong to him.
All right.
All right.
Our man is still unchained, so...
Okay.
As soon as we get... We'll be ready.
It'll take us about ten minutes to get the press back, so when we know the meeting's going to begin, I'll come over and I'll have them start bringing the press over.
All right.
Okay.

NARA Description

On June 20, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon and Ronald L. Ziegler talked on the telephone at Camp David from 11:58 am to 12:02 pm. The Camp David Study Table taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 169-022 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 169-22

Date: June 20, 1973
Time: 11:58 am - 12:02 pm
Location: Camp David Study Table

The President talked with Ronald L. Ziegler.

     Watergate
          -Ziegler’s conversation with J. Fred Buzhardt, Jr.
                -Tape of Charles W. Colson and E. Howard Hunt, Jr.
                      -John W. Dean, III’s conversation with Colson, December 1972
                      -Clemency offer
                -Dean
                      -Tapes
                      -Colson’s tape
                -Buzhardt’s view
                -Dean
                      -Handling of funds
                            -Press coverage
                                            -15-

                  NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                                            Conversation No. 169-22 (cont’d)

                      -Ervin Committee
                            -Refusal to appear in executive session
                      -Handling of funds
                            -Buzhardt
                            -Probity of H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman and Colson
                            -Time and Washington Post, Walter L. Cronkite, Jr.
                            -Network coverage
                            -Forthcoming letter from Committee to Re-Elect the President
                             [CRP]
                                  -Buzhardt

     Leonid I. Brezhnev’s visit
          -Schedule
          -Meeting with President
                 -Coverage

Also recorded on June 20, 1973

  • 169-019 11:21 AM · 33 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 11:21 am and 11:24 am.
  • 169-020 11:24 AM · 23 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Henry A. Kissinger talked on the telephone at Camp David from 11:24 am to 11:25 am.
  • 169-021 11:25 AM · 12 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 11:25 am and 11:55 am.
  • 169-023 12:02 PM · 12 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 12:02 pm and 12:20 pm.
  • 169-024 12:20 PM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Alexander M. Haig, Jr. talked on the telephone at Camp David from 12:20 pm to 12:22 pm.
  • 169-025 12:22 PM · 15 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 12:22 pm and 12:29 pm.
  • 169-026 12:29 PM · 3 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Alexander M. Haig, Jr. talked on the telephone at Camp David from 12:29 pm to 12:31 pm.
  • 169-027 12:31 PM · 12 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 12:31 pm and 12:51 pm.

All 31 conversations from June 20, 1973 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 169-022, June 20, 1973. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/169-022 (accessed October 9, 2026).