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Conversation 018-066

TapeTape 18StartTuesday, January 11, 1972 at 3:43 PMEndTuesday, January 11, 1972 at 3:49 PMTape start time02:53:10Tape end time02:59:23ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President);  Kissinger, Henry A.Recording deviceWhite House Telephone
AudioNARA Description

On January 11, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and Henry A. Kissinger talked on the telephone from 3:43 pm to 3:49 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 018-066 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 18-66

Date: January 11, 1972
Time: 3:43 pm - 3:49 pm
Location: White House Telephone

The President talked with Henry A. Kissinger.

[See Conversation No. 312-26]

     Foreign policy annual report
          -Progress
                -Due date
          -Reception
                -1971 report
                     -Laos

     South Vietnamese
          -Capabilities
               -Alexander M. Haig, Jr.
                     -Two Corps

     Negotiations
         -US offer
                -Possible response
                     -Offensive

                      -Public opinion
       -Forthcoming revelation of secret negotiations

Soviet Union
     -North Vietnamese offensive
          -Possible timing
                -The President's trip to the People’s Republic of China [PRC]
          -Haig
          -Costs

Anatoliy F. Dobrynin
     -Arrival
           -Meeting with Kissinger

Maurice H. Stans

Soviet Union
     -Forthcoming PRC trip by the President
     -Dobrynin
           -Forthcoming meeting with Kissinger
     -Yuli M. Vorontsov
           -Tone
     -Relations with the PRC

The President’s schedule
     -Camp David
     -State of the Union speech

Draft of Kissinger's report

Domestic concerns

Haig
       -Laos
            -Army of the Republic of Vietnam [ARVN]
                -Helicopters

Laos
       -Situation
             -Vientiane
       -Public opinion
       -1971 US operation

     Weather in California
Transcript (AI-Generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

Hello?
Dr. Kissinger, Mr. President.
Hello?
Well, how's it going today?
President.
You got any more of your work done?
Yes, I think we are going to make February 8th now.
We are making good progress.
We're doing about a chapter a day now.
What?
I know it's a terrific job.
Yeah, but I think this time we'll get a much better reception.
Last year we put it out in the middle of the low ocean period.
Oh, God, that's right.
It was rough, wasn't it?
Well, they didn't attack it, but they sort of buried it because they weren't about to give you credit for it.
Well, I suppose this time we may expect that they'll be banging around there in Tucor and a few other places, from what Al tells me.
Yeah, I think...
But we can't do anything about it, Henry.
I mean...
As I was saying, you know, if the South Vietnamese can't handle it now, they never will be able to.
Well, that's right.
But that's where our move next week is going to help a lot, because if their answer to our peace offer is an offensive, that should certainly help us in public opinion here.
Yeah, that is why...
I think making it perhaps on that date, the 18th, is better than waiting because we just don't know when they're going to start hitting.
Otherwise it might look like a reaction to an offensive.
Exactly.
I think basically the Russians are putting them up to it to overshadow the... We have an intelligence report today in which one of their people in Paris says
They're going to do it in February so that they can overshadow your trip to Peking.
Uh-huh.
Well, it won't do that.
I don't think they've got that much power.
Yeah.
On the other hand, it's a double-edged sword for them because if they do it at that time, you're overshadowing their offensive.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
I hear from Haig, and you, of course, have had a chance to talk to him personally, and to the others, I don't think there's any question anymore that they're going all out to make the trip.
Oh, that's right, right.
I haven't talked to the others except briefly, but Haig gave me a rundown.
They've paid the price now, and they have no interest.
I mean, if they were to make the trip a failure, they've already paid the price for the trip, so...
they've got a heavier investment than we have.
Sure.
Anything further on your, with DeBrennan, have you checked with him yet?
As I've checked, he's coming in around the 15th.
I see.
And I've left word that I want to see him as soon as he comes in.
Well, that's the way to leave it.
In the meantime, you have pending the...
the thing from Stans, which...
Right.
I'll talk to Stans again tomorrow.
Yeah.
But that thing is going...
I have no doubt, Mr. President, they are going to try to embarrass us at the Peking summit.
They are really not so much attacking us as Peking.
Mm-hmm.
I see.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Well, fine, fine.
Then you can see them on the 15th, and that's that.
I'll see him.
If he wants to, yeah.
Well, he'll want to.
But he's already indicated he wants to see you.
Oh, yes.
Oh, yes.
They've already said he wants to see me as soon as he comes, yeah.
Did you talk to anybody there?
I just haven't called Vorontsov for a while.
No, I talked to Vorontsov.
Oh, you did?
Yes.
There's no...
I have every... How was his temperature?
Oh, he's very friendly.
They, in their turn, Mr. President, they are taking a cheap shot at the Chinese right now.
Right.
But as soon as that one is over, they're going to go all out on theirs.
Well, they'll want to overshadow the Peking one, won't they?
Of course.
That's what I would think.
I think they have too heavy an investment in theirs.
Right.
Right.
Well, okay, Henry, we'll...
I'll be out of touch now.
I'm going to Camp David in a couple of minutes, and I'll be out of touch until Thursday afternoon.
I've got to go into some writing, so I won't...
But I'll be back.
But if there's something you have to call me about, you call me, but I won't be calling you, okay?
But I'll be coming back Thursday afternoon, Mr. President.
I'll bring a draft up that I'll...
Same with Haig.
I'm not going to talk to him either, so if you let him know, get in touch with me if there's anything I need to know, but otherwise I'm not going to talk to anybody.
I'll have to concentrate on the domestic stuff in the meantime.
Haig was telling me that the Laotians want three Arvin divisions in there.
Of course, that's out of the question.
First, the Arvin wouldn't go without our helicopters, et cetera, and we're just not going to go into that right now.
It's too bad, but...
It's a tragedy because we're on the verge of victory.
That's right.
That's right.
What do you project in Laos?
Just continued deterioration?
I think they're going to lose.
They're going to...
I think they're going to make a major gain in the north, and they may have enough people in Vientiane.
But on the other hand, it's a sign of weakness on their part that they have to operate on the trenches.
Mm-hmm.
Well, there'll be some discussion of Laos here, but let's face it, most Americans are going to say stay the hell out.
But I think we'll be dominating the news now.
Because when we went into Laos last year, we didn't go in for the purpose of Laos.
You know, we pointed that out.
We went in for our own purposes.
Right.
How's the weather?
Pretty good, I hope?
It's warmed up.
Isn't that good.
Well, I hope you sit out in your little patio there and get a little sun.
Okay, Henry.
Goodbye.
You bet.
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