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Conversation 189-012

TapeTape 189StartWednesday, May 17, 1972 at 10:33 AMEndWednesday, May 17, 1972 at 10:43 AMTape start time00:57:35Tape end time01:07:21ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President);  Dent, Harry S.Recording deviceCamp David Hard Wire
AudioNARA Description

On May 17, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and Harry S. Dent met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David from 10:33 am to 10:43 am. The Camp David Hard Wire taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 189-012 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 189-12

Date: May 17, 1972
Time: 10:33 am - 10:43 am
Location: Camp David Hard Wire

The President talked with Harry S. Dent.

     Connecticut
         -Trip
         -Support for Vietnam action

     An unknown man
          -The President’s view

     Vietnam
          -Vote in Congress
               -Republican vote
                     -Soviet summit

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[Previous PRMPA Personal Returnable (G) withdrawal reviewed under deed of gift 09/10/2019.
Segment cleared for release.]
[Personal Returnable]
[189-012-w001]
[Duration: 1m 47s]

       1972 election
              -Michigan primary
                     -The President’s attempted May 16, 1972 telephone call to Harry S. Dent
                     -George C. Wallace vote
                            -Significance
                            -Potential Michigan electoral victory by the President
                            -Impact on Democratic Party
              -George C. Wallace
                     -Sympathy vote
                     -Southern states
                     -Texas
                            -Possibility of getting on ballot
                     -Michigan
                            -Possibility of getting on ballot

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     George C. Wallace
          -The President’s view
          -Dr. William M. Lukash's report
                -Possible call by President
          -President's call to Cornelia Wallace
          -Possible visit by President
                -Hubert H. Humphrey visit
                      -The President’s view
                -Telephone call
                -Day and time
                -Arrangements
                      -H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman
                      -Day
                      -Press coverage

*****************************************************************

[Previous PRMPA Personal Returnable (G) withdrawal reviewed under deed of gift 09/11/2019.
Segment cleared for release.]
[Personal Returnable]
[189-012-w002]
[Duration: 3m 11s]

     1972 election
          -John N. Ashbrook
                -The President’s opinion
          -Democrats
                -Nomination
                      -Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy
                           -John B. Connally's view
                      -George C. Wallace
                           -Michigan victory over Hubert H. Humphrey
                           -The President’s reaction
                      -Comparison to the President's 1968 campaign
                -California primary
                      -Importance

                     -George S. McGovern
                           -Momentum
                -Hubert H. Humphrey
                     -Potential deal with George C. Wallace
                -George S. McGovern
                     -Supporters
                           -Loyalty
                -George C. Wallace
                -Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy

*****************************************************************

     Vietnam
          -Blockade
               -Henry A. Kissinger
               -President's decision
                     -The President’s view
                     -John B. Connally
                     -Melvin R. Laird
                     -William P. Rogers
                     -Necessity
                     -Alternative
               -South Vietnam and US troop morale
          -Future of war
               -The President’s view
Transcript (AI-Generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

Yeah.
Well, I, uh, did you have a good time up in Connecticut?
Uh, that's the stuff, yeah.
Yeah, they support, support what we did in Vietnam a little bit, yeah.
What's the price of matter at this time?
He is out of his mind.
They should.
They should.
Just before the president goes to Moscow, for any Republican, they could have gone fishing, but they should vote against him.
Well, anyway, I tried to call you last night only to get the results from ahead now.
But that Wallace thing was unbelievable, particularly in Michigan.
Now that just shows you Michigan can be won.
I mean, if we play it right, that shit's, that shit's right and I never cut it down.
Yeah.
Because of the sympathy and everything.
Yeah.
On the other hand, I would think, Harry, that he's going to have to make an awful tough decision with regard to...
He's missed quite a few states, hasn't he, in terms of, I don't know, I don't suppose many southern states, but it's awful hard for us, I understand, for him to get into Texas, for example.
It's pretty hard for him to get on the ballot for Michigan, I think.
Well, we can't tell about what's going to happen in this case.
The poor devil has got a deal signed for him.
Incidentally, the doctor tells me that he did not take a telephone call.
I called his wife.
Well, I think the call is better.
I mean, if I go by, I mean, I thought Humphrey was way out of line to go rushing out to the hospital.
That's what he said about it.
Well, if I do that, you may go over.
Go over to Friday.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That would probably be better than calling on the phone.
And I won't call it.
Yeah.
Yeah, talk to Holland about it later.
See if he's worried something on Friday.
Without telling a soul, I just go out there and I wouldn't tell the press or anything else.
And then it'll get out.
It's getting out, not publicizing it.
That's the way I want to do it.
Not helping Ashbrook much these days, is it?
Yeah.
Oh, John.
Too bad they didn't get the hell out.
He ought to.
I mean, he ought to unite, but he didn't look to.
He's getting his ride.
Sort of a pathetic character.
Yeah.
But looking at the Democratic side, who's going to get nominated here?
Teddy.
Connelly still thinks it's going to be Teddy.
Well, what surprised me is that he beat Humphrey, Michigan.
Good God.
Where?
Really?
yeah yeah just like we did in 68 yeah well i think the real test is california if he could if he could win that damn thing i don't it might be impossible to stop me what do you think
Harry, how could Hubert make a deal with Wallace after what he said about him?
What do you think?
The McGovern people may want to stick with McGovern.
They really feel that way, don't they?
On Wallace's.
I mean, you think it worries him.
You think it worries him.
I imagine what the other reasons are.
Well, anyway, it's not Bell, is it?
Well, I'll tell you the best decision, I'll just tell an old Kissinger.
I said, you know,
It was the toughest decision any president's made since World War II.
But it's certainly, in my opinion, the best one I've made was that Vietnam.
However it comes out, it's the right thing to do.
And you know, we had no, as I'm sure you know, except for just among us, except for Meg Connolly, we had no strong support.
But I would say the others all have gone around beautifully.
Larry Rogers has done great since we've done it.
But you know what I mean?
But we had to do it.
And I mean, some people say, well, will it work?
And the point is, I'm damn sure nothing else would have worked.
And we've now got these people where it's changed the morale of the South Vietnamese.
It's helped the morale of our own forces out there.
And I think it's helped the morale of all the people of this country.
What do you think?
I heard that one.
Good, good, good, good.
All right.
Yeah.
Well, one thing.
Well, there's still going to be some battles won and lost in Vietnam.
I don't think it's going to make that much difference now because they know that we've thrown down the gauntlet.
These bastards are either going to play or that's it.
We'll try.
We'll try.
We'll try.
OK, Eric.
Bye.
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