{"conversationCode":"203-013","tapeNumber":203,"conversationNumber":13,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-203-013","startDateTime":"1972-08-17T14:16:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1972-08-17T14:54:00.000Z","startDate":"17-Aug-1972","startTime":"10:16 AM","endDate":"17-Aug-1972","endTime":"10:54 AM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\");","description":"On August 17, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. (\"Bob\") Haldeman met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David from 10:16 am to 10:54 am. The Camp David Hard Wire taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 203-013 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"CDHW","recordingDevice":"Camp David Hard Wire","latitudeEstimated":39.648333,"longitudeEstimated":-77.465,"chronCode":4,"chronRelease":"Fourth Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"10-Dec-2003","aogpRelease":"Abuse of Governmental Power Release","aogpSegment":"Segment 0","lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 203-13\n\nDate: August 17, 1972\nTime: 10:16 am - 10:54 am\nLocation: Camp David Hard Wire\n\nThe President talked with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman.\n\n[See Conversation No. 140-23; four items have been withdrawn]","filename":["203-013.mp3"],"tapeStart":"","tapeEnd":"","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\")"],"prevCode":"203-012","nextCode":"203-014","transcript":[{"start":1.99,"end":28.35,"text":"Yeah, at the right time."},{"start":28.53,"end":29.63,"text":"Couldn't get into the rules."},{"start":31.49,"end":50.27,"text":"That operation is on."},{"start":63.85,"end":67,"text":"That's right."},{"start":67.03,"end":70.42,"text":"What it should be is just have them out there, hand in the mouth, as you do."},{"start":107.64,"end":113.61,"text":"Give me one."},{"start":113.63,"end":114.89,"text":"He's a first-class man."},{"start":116.45,"end":125.41,"text":"That starts us with our... That would be a very good example of our open-door policy, Bob."},{"start":125.42,"end":128.17,"text":"Well, he can make an absolute strict commitment."},{"start":128.19,"end":128.37,"text":"Fine."},{"start":128.89,"end":131.33,"text":"Fine."},{"start":131.35,"end":131.59,"text":"Fine."},{"start":156.41,"end":157.95,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":157.99,"end":160.24,"text":"Sort of a respect there."},{"start":160.44,"end":161.58,"text":"Now you're talking."},{"start":161.6,"end":165.56,"text":"In other words, a white paper on it."},{"start":165.59,"end":166.63,"text":"Right?"},{"start":166.65,"end":171.23,"text":"Also, going back to this earlier, and the interference of foreign policy."},{"start":171.25,"end":172.53,"text":"Let's start with the Truman quote."},{"start":172.96,"end":177.54,"text":"I would start with the Truman quote, and I'd say, did I prefer the Truman quote, if I could"},{"start":186.97,"end":194.62,"text":"and all of his troubles abroad, and there was no order, and other reports."},{"start":194.64,"end":199.71,"text":"Now, here is the conduct of the Governor-Commissioner, and the negotiations are very active."},{"start":200.13,"end":201.05,"text":"They're doing this."},{"start":201.07,"end":201.59,"text":"Here is the record."},{"start":201.62,"end":202.94,"text":"It just broke in."},{"start":202.96,"end":203.26,"text":"No rhetoric."},{"start":203.28,"end":204.2,"text":"No charge on the Patriot Committee."},{"start":205.08,"end":206.5,"text":"Just say, not that one."},{"start":206.52,"end":206.82,"text":"It's wrong."},{"start":207.4,"end":213.01,"text":"Oh, hell no."},{"start":244.38,"end":249.88,"text":"All right, how about eight?"},{"start":249.9,"end":250.04,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":250.06,"end":252.87,"text":"I'll tell you, Margaret Smith would be better."},{"start":253.15,"end":257.44,"text":"You know, her decoration across the projects kind of thing."},{"start":257.46,"end":257.7,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":277.52,"end":282.71,"text":"He doesn't think so, but we don't know."},{"start":285.82,"end":288.69,"text":"Even now, it would be a big crisis."},{"start":288.7,"end":294.22,"text":"That's my point."},{"start":305.67,"end":311,"text":"On the other hand, it does point out our failure."},{"start":311.1,"end":314.55,"text":"I'm just going to say I'm disappointed."},{"start":314.57,"end":315.15,"text":"I'm sorry."},{"start":315.77,"end":316.41,"text":"We're doing our best."},{"start":323.4,"end":324.2,"text":"That has been."},{"start":338,"end":357.05,"text":"No, no, they don't understand it."},{"start":357.07,"end":357.41,"text":"How about that?"},{"start":360.5,"end":362.88,"text":"Well, well, why don't you..."},{"start":362.9,"end":366.32,"text":"I want to prompt you to it."},{"start":366.34,"end":367.06,"text":"No, no, he's not going to do it."},{"start":368.5,"end":396.92,"text":"how about frankly Margaret Smith sounds awfully good if she could do it or you could check around the city for relations well that I like yeah"},{"start":397.12,"end":400.12,"text":"I think that would be good."},{"start":401.24,"end":407.09,"text":"But we should write it for him so as to keep the rhetoric down."},{"start":407.21,"end":408.49,"text":"I think that's the best."},{"start":408.59,"end":409.24,"text":"I really do."},{"start":409.94,"end":424.3,"text":"If he bid on that at all, just say that I don't feel, frankly, that it ought to be done in a partisan format."},{"start":424.32,"end":424.68,"text":"Secondly,"},{"start":425.3,"end":428.52,"text":"but I believe it could better come from a Democrat."},{"start":428.54,"end":433.71,"text":"And third, that I think it would really be a very great shift."},{"start":433.73,"end":441.1,"text":"They'll expect him to make sort of a slashy thing, but he could put it in terms of more thorough and an anchor along the lines."},{"start":441.12,"end":447.29,"text":"And he said, I just want to talk about bipartisanship in foreign policy without indicating why he's for next week."},{"start":447.31,"end":447.49,"text":"That's a"},{"start":459,"end":470.21,"text":"I think he's by far the best person to do it."},{"start":470.25,"end":471.53,"text":"By far the best."},{"start":471.73,"end":482.18,"text":"And also, I like the idea that he is getting involved in foreign policy for those reasons."},{"start":482.2,"end":484.18,"text":"I just think it's great."},{"start":484.5,"end":488.02,"text":"But let's ask him if he wants..."},{"start":490.99,"end":513.23,"text":"Well, it takes to get the facts, but then on the speech writing."},{"start":513.25,"end":516.29,"text":"My colleagues will let him work on this."},{"start":516.31,"end":517.25,"text":"The facts you don't understand."},{"start":520.98,"end":525.21,"text":"lead back on mine and all the changes I've made to take all the partisanship out."},{"start":526.15,"end":528.47,"text":"But I think Conley's by far the best."},{"start":528.67,"end":530.13,"text":"Let's have bipartisanship."},{"start":530.33,"end":534.72,"text":"Let's don't play politics with peace."},{"start":534.74,"end":538.59,"text":"That should be the title of the speech."},{"start":538.61,"end":543.01,"text":"Let's not play partisan politics with peace."},{"start":543.11,"end":543.99,"text":"You know what I mean?"},{"start":544.01,"end":544.89,"text":"And then find out, congratulating the BFW."},{"start":551.46,"end":557.66,"text":"I think that's the best."},{"start":557.88,"end":560.85,"text":"I would call it."},{"start":567.48,"end":573.85,"text":"No, no, no, no, no, no, no."},{"start":573.87,"end":575.23,"text":"I want to keep Ron."},{"start":575.25,"end":579.99,"text":"I want to keep Ron."},{"start":580.6,"end":584.64,"text":"All clients stay out of it, too."},{"start":584.66,"end":594.31,"text":"All of my house's spokesmen, they stay out of this kind of thing."},{"start":594.33,"end":594.51,"text":"See?"},{"start":594.53,"end":595.41,"text":"It's just too close to us."},{"start":595.43,"end":603.22,"text":"I think particularly since it's being given to me, I just keep going."},{"start":603.24,"end":608.24,"text":"I get elevated to the state president of Texas."},{"start":608.32,"end":609.86,"text":"Now, the only thing I would suggest to him,"},{"start":610.69,"end":618.44,"text":"I think that's so vicious."},{"start":618.46,"end":619.8,"text":"Okay."},{"start":619.98,"end":620.8,"text":"All right."},{"start":620.82,"end":628.39,"text":"That's good."},{"start":628.41,"end":629.37,"text":"I kind of feel it."},{"start":629.85,"end":632.72,"text":"What I mean is, I don't want Ron to say a word."},{"start":633.62,"end":636.54,"text":"What I mean is, the purpose of this is defending."},{"start":636.56,"end":639.65,"text":"The purpose of this is they're charging low roll."},{"start":640.28,"end":646.72,"text":"I want the charge and the word used that it's a dirty, low-road campaign."},{"start":646.74,"end":663.44,"text":"A campaign of slander, lies, and vilification."},{"start":663.46,"end":663.6,"text":"Got it?"},{"start":663.62,"end":663.98,"text":"On everything."},{"start":664,"end":664.12,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":664.14,"end":666.12,"text":"I want this to be the idea of a low road."},{"start":666.32,"end":667.3,"text":"Let Dole say that too."},{"start":669.14,"end":673.15,"text":"I tell them all that it started in the government, a low-growth campaign."},{"start":673.17,"end":681.09,"text":"Well, they figure a better word, a campaign of smear and fear."},{"start":681.11,"end":681.21,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":699.82,"end":704.54,"text":"I haven't heard from Ron, so I assume he didn't do anything about that bitch."},{"start":705.81,"end":707.31,"text":"No, there's that."},{"start":707.33,"end":708.57,"text":"There's many, many more."},{"start":708.71,"end":710.07,"text":"There's many more."},{"start":710.17,"end":713.29,"text":"But I just think it's more important for the moment."},{"start":713.89,"end":716.88,"text":"Long term, I just want to be sure you all understood."},{"start":716.9,"end":718.26,"text":"A guardian has to be put on her so she doesn't get at anybody again."},{"start":718.28,"end":723.14,"text":"And the other thing is that she's sick."},{"start":723.16,"end":726.92,"text":"And that CPS is going to be screwed with regard to the handling."},{"start":731.8,"end":738.32,"text":"and don't give one to CBS."},{"start":738.34,"end":738.5,"text":"Perhaps."},{"start":738.52,"end":739.59,"text":"And that's the way I do it."},{"start":739.61,"end":740.41,"text":"Very obvious."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and H. R. Haldeman discussed strategies for countering political attacks by characterizing the opposition's campaign as a \"low-road\" effort defined by smear and fear tactics. They deliberated on potential speakers for a speech promoting bipartisanship in foreign policy, ultimately favoring John Connally to deliver a message emphasizing that peace should not be treated as a partisan political issue. Additionally, Nixon instructed that White House spokespeople, including Ron Ziegler, should remain distanced from these public rebuttals to maintain an elevated, non-partisan posture.","topics":["Bipartisanship","Foreign Policy","Political Strategy","John Connally","Campaign Rhetoric","White House Communications"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T10:17:03.435Z"},"topicSlugs":["bipartisanship","foreign-policy","political-strategy","john-b-connally","campaign-rhetoric","white-house-communications"],"audioDurationSec":753,"audioFiles":[{"file":"203-013.mp3","bytes":18081540,"durationSec":753.32,"bitrate":192019,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:35.864Z","transcriptGapSeconds":132,"transcriptGapShare":0.17,"transcriptQuality":"incomplete","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/203-013.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/203-013","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/203/conversation-203-013","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}