Nixon phone call with Haldeman on Watergate and Campaign strategy

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NixonI think that the Connally observation is a [cough]

NixonI think he's absolutely being extremely helpful, and we probably should have caught ourselves, and uh, he's absolutely right. You know, he's got a hell of a sense for the [unintelligible].

NixonI should have, I, well, I sensed it. I sensed it in terms of, Patricia had too, you know. In terms of not having the political press conferences. Yep, I knew that, but I

Nixonwhat I just wanted to be sure of is that they just didn't have that too much in, basically, well partisan activity. You know what I mean? I think the, I really,

Nixonand I think what happened here is that, well, maybe they've got, I mean and and of course Pat approved, but I, but we've got to, I should look over her schedules too or somebody should, to, to be sure that, that, that they, they don't,

NixonI know we've set them, you know, for her to do these things. Well, we told them to do some part of that thing like that headquarters thing, you know Mrs. Reagan's

— 7 min 12 s with no transcribed speech —

NixonSee,

NixonI just don't think you know, and Connally put it very well, "McGovern is now the issue. Unless don't make me the issue, and unless don't make uh, Agnew the issue, unless don't make uh uh, the family the issue. That's the thing we have to be concerned about, right?

NixonYou know, it's too bad that you, I guess we don't have somebody like Ziegler to do Pat's press relations.

HaldemanShe is, and and it's she'll do what she's told. That's the key is we've just got to make sure she clearly understands She understands what up try, you mean. Just

NixonIf you give the speech, she gets through, she makes a thank you. She says 5, 3 minutes, you know, "I'm glad to be here." and gets the hell out, and just looks pretty. That's what we've got to understand. Well, I think people like that better than a smart dame who gets up there and tries to show that she knows everything.

NixonYou remember the old lady, Roosevelt, how up, they turned it off because she was always talking. Now, Pat should not talk, she just shouldn't get caught, she shouldn't get out there yakking around, you see.

NixonAnd uh that's why Well, they're both the both the kids they should always talk positive, and that's why by not taking questions they don't get into negative things, you see.

NixonYou out, you'll have to follow through on this, and follow through with Chapin here, right? Who does the scheduling, Chapin? Well, then tell, you agree though that Connally's intuition's correct? Yeah. I mean think maybe we're overreacting to what he said, but I think

NixonI think Connally, the thing that concerns me is that we didn't see it, you know, and it shows you why this kind of a meeting is important, goddammit. You've got to constantly check You've got to check our, you know, check our own intuitions with other people.

NixonNow Mitchell didn't raise this. No, not at all.

NixonNo, Connally does, and Connally's right. He's right. See, it's She's a hell of an asset, Pat, but it can be

HaldemanAnd the other side of it is you don't need any assets. Oh yes, that's one of the things we've gotta keep in mind. I mean, so we have assets, so put them in the bank, and leave them there. We don't need to spend our assets.

NixonYou stopped, you stopped in the convention, uh and it's I'm so glad Gallup went up there, and said the polls will close. That's great. Why his check is when they do, that's fine, and if they don't, that's fine, too.

NixonThey're gonna have a hell of a time closing in Sindlinger's, unless he's, unless he's smoking, or drinking. Uh, you're not going to see any much shift in the polls this week, you realize that? I don't think you are. They can't. Well you might, I don't know.

HaldemanSubject to other events, if nothing's What the hell happened to changed the polls? And nothing's happened. Watergate's on. But that's reflected in Sindlinger already. It's reflected in Sindlinger and Watergate didn't have that much of a bounce. That indictments didn't weren't that much of an event. And Watergate is pretty much gone away. Actually, the grain deal is worse than Watergate at the moment, probably.

HaldemanThat is, it's there's gonna be one of those, it's whatever it is. Oh, sure. How is Pat Nixon campaigning, or something? I mean, they're just, they're dealing with those things. Those, none of those are things that are gonna cause somebody not to vote for you for president.

NixonTake the pole about the the wife of campaigning, I wonder if that doesn't say, "Well what the hell, he's sitting in the White House, and his wife's out working." Well, that it says he's working at the White House, and his wife, because he's busy back at the White House, his wife's

Haldemangetting out to make sure the folks know he's also interested in their help, right? Wants their help. But we don't need much. That's all. Sure. We don't need too much, no.

NixonAll right. We got Colson all set. He He will quit putting out those releases. I don't know whether he put them out, or the Re-Elect Committee, or what. Does he put out those schedules? I can't imagine he would, but he may have. I wouldn't think so, but I would guess, as he's said,

NixonHe said it could be RNC, and he said it was quite funny. He said, "Well we'll stop it." He said, "we," so I don't know, maybe he meant Of course, he controls, basically, what they put out. All right, well that's in there. But he He said they put, I said, "How the hell did they get this?" "Well, we put it out." That's what he told me.

HaldemanWe've been I wonder if that, if they get it from Monday. We've been running, I haven't even thought about it, but we run all the key people's schedules in Monday, and we have been for a year, just so people know.

NixonKnock it off. Let's stop that, too. Knock it off. Knock it off. Don't put it in Monday. Let it be out, I mean, that's Now is the time to to put everything undercover. Always do that way. I think

NixonThe other thing I want to ask you about, and I I don't know what you think, Bob, is, I I think I think we got Connally sold on the foreign affairs speech. That'll be a blockbuster. It'll be a hell of a speech. He's the one to make it, and I'm so delighted he's not going to go out for Democrats for Nixon alone, he'll just say, "I call on the Democrats, call on everybody." That's brilliant what he thought about, about the retreat from sworn, to show that vote up there.

HaldemanYeah, and Nixon, John Connally. Yeah. And McGovern was against it. He was for Henry Wallace's position. Right? Sure. And that, that just visibly demonstrates his, this whole point of the tradition. That's right. A strong America, and all, every president has regardless of his party, he stood for that, right? Right.

NixonNow when is, when and, when and comes uh I think it's 5 minutes, what is, when is this 5 minute, when, when Tonight at 10:55.

NixonHe and I are as well, you know, which which network is it? American Network. So, let's share a secret. Don't tell me, I don't want to watch. Now, the other thought I was going to say is that do you feel

Nixonrather comfortable? I think it's I really feel he ought to run the negative ad. You know, Democrats ad, next week. I really think he should. I don't think there's any reason why he shouldn't, and it will set the stage for what is happening after, do you agree? Yeah, and it isn't that bigger thing either way, I mean, most people won't see it, that's right.

NixonThe second point is the question is whether or not you agree with MacGregor on running that positive, you know, Yeah, I do. Why? The only Because I think it's it's good, there's no way you can lose by it, and it's it rekindles in the minds,

Haldemandoesn't matter with our people, well, it's good with our people, it stirs their juices again, but where it matters is the that fringe kind that China made the difference to, or that Russia made the difference to, that that young people, Yeah.

Haldemanthe folks Yeah, but have you seen them, and are they that good? Oh, yeah. 5 minute ones. They are. Very. They're very good. And 5 minutes is a marvelous length, because it, you know, it's over before you realize it started, pretty much.

HaldemanAnd they're interesting, they hold your interest. There's no pitch, you know, it's not a not a hard sell type thing at all. But it makes the points, and it re-establishes those pictures

Haldemanthat are in people's minds, of Nixon in China, Nixon in Russia, at the time that they're seeing on the news, the pictures of McGovern running around, making an ass of himself, and Shriver even more so.

NixonMcGovern going out to the having a conversation with this person, or a conversation with that. I don't think we want to load a big bundle of them on, and I don't think we want to do any more weight than McGovern is. That's the only negative I see in that is looking like we're outspending him. Sure. I think we've got to make sure he's outspending us.

NixonCould we get our story right away as to how that he started his ads earlier than anybody ever did. Yeah. They ought to do that. They've done that, but now he's, it's interesting, he today tried to buy a 1/2 hour on CBS tomorrow night.

HaldemanAnd CBS wouldn't sell it to him. Uh he didn't try on ABC, or NBC. He has now canceled his spots for next week, his 1-minute, his commercials on television.

HaldemanThe story being to use the money for a 1/2 hour speech. So, he's going to go on the air next week with

Haldemanthing. Uh the story that we get from the we're talking about our [unintelligible] who are guy traveling with him is that they're the way that

NixonThe reason for that is

Haldemanuh He's tired. We cling up after the No, the the problem is is he's he got pissed off last night after this miserable days schedule, and today is just as bad, and they got him this week just running his ass off. Any holiday the candidate gets sick and he gets mad. I've been through it. I've been mad.

NixonGod damn Most of them get mad after one day.

HaldemanYou didn't get mad after one day.

NixonI got mad after eight weeks. [chuckles]

HaldemanBut uh he's he's I can't take it. He said, "I'm not going to do any more of this. Uh the There's no point in all the press all over the country looking at me. We'll go back to Washington. We'll sit there, and I'm going on television to ask for money, and make my pitch to the people." He's probably right to do it.

NixonIt won't do him any good, I don't think, cuz he isn't any good on television. Well, the point is, he's

HaldemanHe's on one network. And nobody'll watch. He'll have a Hooper about 10.

NixonRight. Oh no, he won't get a 10.

HaldemanNo way.

Nixon15 A paid political? No, he won't get any He won't get that much.

HaldemanA paid political? No, he won't get any He won't get that much.

NixonParticularly I hope he go goes up against good programs.

HaldemanWell, he can't avoid it now because this is the introductory season. Everybody's going to be looking for the new programs. This will be a very interesting thing to see how much he gets.

NixonHe'll get no audience.

HaldemanUh he even But he might pick up that money.

NixonNo, well, you've got to get somebody listening before you can get the money.

HaldemanWell, I don't even know if he can make that up.

NixonHe might pay for it. I don't think he'll do any better than that.

HaldemanCost a lot.

NixonThat is funny.

NixonOn the Texas thing, I I have a deep feeling in my mind reaction is correct. But I should um But I should not have the Q&A. Why?

HaldemanAll right. I think it would be desperately I mean I mean, John was just thinking, "Well, it was good the other times, so we'll do it again." But we don't want to make it an end thing. We're going to get some asshole dumb question, and it's a big audience. There's a lot of other reasons why.

NixonI want to get around and move them. I want to be friendly and all the rest of them. Be very above the battle. I'm going to tell them that and tell and tell John that I want him to be thinking of taking Connally. I'd like Mrs. Connally to take Mrs. Nixon to the other table, see what I mean? We'll We'll all do a little table-hopping

HaldemanRight.

Nixonand have sort of an a chair saved around, move around from the tables, and then we'll try to all, both of us, and that and I think that both the Connallys and the Nixons should both eat after the dinner. See? So that we can feel free to move during the dinner, see? Use the time during the dinner to move among the people

Nixonand talk with them a little bit. That's going to make time, believe me.

HaldemanYep.

NixonMuch more than the questions. Am I right?

HaldemanAnd you can do it with the way he has those set up. Those tables of 10 or whatever it is, cuz you

NixonYeah, right.

Haldemanyou do a table and talk to a couple of people there, you've, in effect, done the whole table. So, you don't have to talk to each individual, but you get They think you have.

NixonThat's right, and shake This is Connally's trip taking. This is excellent around there. But, I think the personal touch is what they really like. Tell him, for example, the Fitzsimmons or uh on that guest, he'll be there, It'll mean far more to him and his wife if we go to his table and say how much we appreciate what he did, and also, for everybody who appears at the seat.

HaldemanEspecially meet the wives. That's Boy, that's it.

NixonMeet the wives, cuz they'll all look Nice makes the wives. Cuz then they go through the line, it will be quick and they're run and pushed, then we have a chance to move around. And, even though we miss others, they'll all say how nice. That's right.

HaldemanThat's right.

NixonWe should eat afterwards. Tell them that we will try to grab a little something in the middle of the afternoon, and then the Connallys and we'd like to have dinner after the guests leave with them.

HaldemanHe'd like that.

NixonHe'd like that.

HaldemanMm-hmm.

NixonEating is terribly, really It's terrible to do, you sit there and you show everybody's watching. I hate it. I don't like didn't like to do it anyway. We'd like to have dinner afterwards.

HaldemanGives you time with the guests.

NixonGives you time with the guests. Now, the other thing is that uh is that because of that, I am re-evaluating, too, whether we ought to do the regional press conference.

HaldemanRegional press conference, period.

NixonJust not sure. We can just walk into I don't I don't think you need to prove a god damn

HaldemanUh I don't know what we could substitute for it. But let's just remember, we're not going to let the fucking press determine what we do here. You know what I mean? You've just got to remember that and uh and, or influence what we're going to do.

NixonI've demonstrated I can do a press conference.

HaldemanSure.

NixonRight.

HaldemanYep. And this won't demonstrate it anymore anyway.

NixonNo one's in it, come on. We've got the national press, and so, they squeal around, and you go, let's face it, it's predictable what they want to hear, Watergate, and all that. Now, the one thing I could do,

Nixonin order to in order to blunt the whole thing, is to have one in the god damn office. You know what I mean? Just to have the bastards in on a

HaldemanUh-huh.

Nixonon a Saturday morning, say, or something, you know what I mean? And in order to get so that they say I've had one, see what I mean?

HaldemanYeah.

NixonAnd uh unlike which I think is worthwhile. I think it's worth just having one so that you get it out of the way on a day that you're doing something else, just so to speak. Th- That's That's what I have. I'm telling you. But, I think going out to the country having a press conference, I mean, it's it's a good event,

Nixonbut I'd like to find some other event to do in Atlanta, some other event.

HaldemanOkay.

NixonI'm just thinking I'm just thinking, you know, the thing of again, thinking back to that damn Italian picnic. So, maybe I go there for the purpose of going to a to honor somebody, or or uh, you know,

HaldemanYeah.

Nixona couple of wreaths, and the rest say I go to Martin Luther King and lay a wreath, and my god. But, uh there must be something you can do in Atlanta that's uh

NixonLike Yep. I just don't think the press conference is the is is the point. Why greet them? Why greet them?

HaldemanNo.

NixonOr you go Or maybe Maybe there is something to be said for it. I don't know it's My My point is I've done the drill. I've proved the performance. So, I think we could do a press conference, I mean, I I mean an office press conference. I mean, I'll just catch them unawares sometime when I don't want to say much, you know, and knock off a few questions

Nixonafter Watergate is passed, and the rest, just as we come into the Soviet thing, period. Right? See the point?

NixonWhat the hell would you do? I, in Atlanta? The other thing you can do is to is to finally go in, and then make it basically a political appearance.

HaldemanYeah.

NixonYou motorcade in. What I would do is simply have a reception, basically, for all of our chairmen, the Nixon chairmen, the Democrats for Nixon, the candidates, and so forth, and so on. In other words, just a a private reception.

HaldemanRegional reception.

NixonRegional reception. Why not that? And do it in the Northeast, too.

HaldemanRegional.

NixonHave the Have Have the people come in. So, I just come in for a reception, shake their hands, and stuff like that. I guess it can't be private. The press would have to be there. But, the motorcade would still make the news. Or, could it be private? Maybe it could be, couldn't it?

HaldemanWhy not?

NixonGo there for a reception for the uh Or, could it be? I'm not sure.

HaldemanIt can't be.

NixonSee, I'd like I'd like to have basically a I'm going in there for a regional reception for all of the candidates, and so forth, and so on, and uh we should drop a statement or do something that that touches some kind of Well, drop a statement, so if the press gets under it,

HaldemanYeah.

Nixonnecessarily. What do you think?

NixonPut that out as a statement?

NixonOr the other thing could be to the radio, is it is to come in and make a er when they come in and then I'll I'll have a reception and do a radio talk.

NixonSee, I'm doing a radio talk and to in New England for the New England area and so forth and so on. And, uh, I don't know how we'd talk about the five. Sharp that, as you say, release the radio talk that gives an opportunity to right out. You might say that he's going to make a radio talk while he's here.

NixonNot a television talk. It would kill the television, you know, for the other. I'm telling you, I don't want a television. I don't want a television thing at all.

HaldemanRight.

NixonI mean, I, I,

HaldemanWell, and you force the TV to be the motorcade.

NixonExactly.

NixonYou see, you basically end up with two of them. You end up with a reception for the your your committee to re-elect the various candidates and the rest and shake their hands and do that as low key as possible and do a radio talk and make that be the statement for the suburban area.

NixonAnd then you go to the other place and these are basically political events. You call everybody out to get out the vote and so forth and so on. Yeah. Doing that, I think you do that, but I think that's better than going in and doing press conferences.

NixonI think it's far less dangerous. And, uh, it's less work.

HaldemanYeah.

NixonIt's just there isn't the need for it. I don't think.

HaldemanWell, we don't gain anything from it. What did what good did it? You've got to realize press conferences benefit the goddamn press.

HaldemanWell, and you don't They don't get you anything on television. You don't want anything on television anyway, because you want the motorcade.

NixonThe motorcade.

HaldemanAnd they don't get you anything, and they don't get you anymore in the writing press than you would get by issuing a statement or making a radio speech, which is no work at all.

NixonAnd there's no risk. I would like to have them prepared. I mean they should be 1,500 words. 15-minute things. Well, 1,500 words. That's basically what we're talking about, because we say 15 minutes they'll give you 2,000. 1,500 words.

HaldemanYeah.

NixonAnd, uh, it would, uh, just a couple three or more crisp lines in it, the rest of it's charges.

HaldemanMaybe those speeches are where you do the thing Teddy White's talking about, where you, at some point, you've got to say something about the four years. Yeah, about four years. What you, why you, why you want to come back. What you what you want to finish.

NixonThat's right.

HaldemanWhat you plan to do. You could talk about the South.

NixonThe future of the country, the future of America, the future of New England.

HaldemanYeah.

NixonThe, uh, foreign policy and so forth. Some of the things we want. Spirit of America kind of thing, what I want to see for this country. Why not that sort of thing in Chicago and others?

NixonA 15-minute speech. It'd be fine. Make one rally speech of 10 minutes at the conclusion of a hell of a show.

HaldemanYeah.

NixonTelevised.

HaldemanRight. Yeah.

NixonPlay it this way.

HaldemanGood.

HaldemanAnd that's a way to get your speeches.

NixonYeah. Isn't it really?

NixonAnd have And make these, uh And they've got to get They've got to get Price to work on those right away and, uh,

NixonIt's going to be so different from the radio speeches we made in '68. Hell, then I was a candidate.

HaldemanWell, that's- They didn't pay a hell of a lot of attention. All that-

Haldeman-Nixon on the issues stuff. This is This aren't issue speeches.

NixonNo, sir.

NixonThis should be High level. It's the President speaking to the country about his hopes for this country for the next four years. You know, and, uh, what we're trying to do.

NixonLook beyond. I mean, uh, looking beyond to bipartisan [unintelligible]

HaldemanYeah.

NixonYou know?

HaldemanIn New York, Mitchell, one thought he's he's urging is that the way to solve your Jewish thing

Haldemanis not to have a public Jewish event, but when you're in New York, at the Waldorf, let him bring in about 20 to 25 top Jewish Nixon backers

Haldemanfrom around the country. Most of them from New York, but they'd be they'd bring Feuer and, you know, some of those in from L.A., and have a session with them.

NixonSure.

HaldemanLet John sit in.

NixonAnd talk about the Soviet Jews.

HaldemanLet John sit in and, uh, go through it and let that be it. Not have a public Jewish event, but just let the Nixon Jewish leadership meet with you privately, just as we're meeting with the

Haldemanleadership of the South when we're in Atlanta.

HaldemanNow, I think that's a good idea. I think an overt Jewish event ain't going to work.

NixonI don't want an overt Jewish. Well, we talked about that, you know, when Yeah, I I know I did. Because I didn't know anything else. This is much better, much better.

HaldemanAnd also, he says it's much better to do it there than in the White House. It's less noticeable. You're at the Waldorf. You can just have them in, and uh, just say you met with a group of people and

NixonYou've all or you've already talked to Lasker that we aren't going to do the table-hopping, I hope?

HaldemanWell, that's our other problem is this: Lasker will not bring a group of people in ahead of time. He says he can't he can't get down to a small enough group to bring them in.

NixonHe wants me to table-hop again?

HaldemanNo.

NixonI won't do it.

HaldemanNo, he doesn't want you to table-hop. He's agreed to put the head table on the dais. That's all worked out. And what he's pleading for is that you either come in 15 minutes before the telecast

Haldemanor you stay at the head table for 15 minutes after the telecast so that some of these people can come up and do some handshaking.

NixonI'll stay.

HaldemanEverybody feels that it's better for you, if you will, to stay rather than to come in beforehand.

NixonOh, hell, yes.

HaldemanBecause the in ahead is a- Well, it ruins the telecast if you come in. It kind of takes the edge off of it.

NixonWell, and it also ruins me.

HaldemanYeah. Well, you were saying you'd come in and sit an hour.

NixonI know, no, no. I I I would much rather do It wasn't that I was only doing it just to be good. No, I would much rather do it the other way, absolutely, absolutely.

NixonSure, I'll stay afterwards and gass around with them then. And then I'll stay more than that. I'll stay a half hour and let them bring all of them around.

HaldemanAll right, now the problem that creates is it's going to get you back to Washington awful late,

Haldemanand you have to leave pretty early.

HaldemanWhich raises a question whether you don't want to save yourself a couple hours and go to stay in New York that night at the Waldorf and then leave for California from there.

NixonYeah.

HaldemanIt makes more sense, really, split it once you're on the road.

NixonWe should stay in New York. It's too late at night. We'll stay in New York. It will save two hours. You're right. That's what we should do.

HaldemanAnd being at the Waldorf, a different hotel, I think will help, and you know

NixonWell, the Waldorf is comfortable. We'll be all right there.

HaldemanGood.

NixonBecause it and especially if I stay at all after the TV, because that see, it's 10:30, 11:00, 11:30, you know, then I'd have to leave about 9:00 next day, probably.

HaldemanYeah.

HaldemanMaybe even eight. No, no, it's about 9:00. You get-

NixonOh, no. I mean, we have a three-hour time-break,

HaldemanTime, time-break, so

Nixonso it's four hours.

NixonWe can get there by 11:00.

HaldemanFine, we can get in in time to get over to the

NixonYeah, yeah.

Haldemanand uh, have lunch and relaxed.

NixonWe can walk right in the plane.

HaldemanIt's easier, though, than having to get on the plane, go back, come into the White House, go to bed, get up.

NixonWe, though, now, they have scheduled a terrible schedule in terms of what he said.

NixonI think I'd cut him back. I'd cut him back, and uh,

NixonI'm very much for his next step.

NixonI don't know, I'd, I'd The more I hear, good god, what I hear, Helms is running a lousy campaign. Jesus Christ, he can't, he couldn't lose in North Carolina.

HaldemanWell, Helms is not a good candidate. He can't get himself going, is what what they're saying. Truly just

NixonHe isn't a good candidate. He's a good campaigner.

NixonI know, but he's from the Right.

HaldemanThat's right.

NixonThat's murder. Stinking murder. That may do it. I mean, we even with a turkey, it may do it.

NixonHow about Wilson?

Nixon phone call with Haldeman on Watergate and Campaign strategy

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Nixon phone call with Haldeman on Watergate and Campaign strategy

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Also recorded on September 19, 1972

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