On December 28, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and Henry A. Kissinger met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David from 9:41 pm to 10:07 pm. The Camp David Hard Wire taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 237-007 of the White House Tapes.
Transcript (AI-Generated)This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.
Hello.
I wondered if you were able to reach either Rogers or Rush.
Right, you let that go then.
Right.
I see.
I agree.
Well, I...
I didn't want you to tell more, but I didn't rush so you can tell more at the same time.
It's perfectly all right.
12 hours makes no difference.
Yeah.
All right, fine.
Now, I've been thinking about my own position.
I'm inclined to think that I will have Warren come up here.
I think he should make this announcement.
I don't want to build it up, but I don't want to go down there, which will look like something is happening.
And he could just be up here.
He makes other announcements.
He can make that in a little key way here.
That's on the right.
You see?
Well, if you see, if it's done without my being, it's going to look a little too casual if I'm sitting around Camp David.
The doctors have to go down.
That's a problem, you see.
The thing is that it has to be.
Even though we want it low-key, it has to be very clear that this is no accident.
This is all part of our deliberate policy.
I don't want to...
Think about it.
The only thing I would maybe do is to warn him to come up and make some other appointment announcements anyways.
If he does, I'll do it.
I don't know what they do on television or anything.
And up here, there's no television, unfortunately.
So, uh... As for the Harry Shorten thing, yeah.
Think about it.
It's time.
Well, that's the plan tonight.
So, the plan tonight.
Yeah.
Replace it, so there's no problem.
We've been making announcements up here all the time, so.
Anybody else that, uh, I don't think anybody else needs to be informed.
I mean, the only, the only point that could be made would be to, uh, have a 4-day announcement, uh,
what I'm speaking about if it's a
Well, they just read the announcement.
What I was thinking, I would have them do would be to read the announcement that Warren is going to make and say at 10 o'clock he's going to make this announcement.
We just want to give you a little notice of the fact and say nothing more.
That's what I was thinking.
Oh, with no contradictions.
That's why having it out of him rather than out of your shop is better because your people would be asked questions.
I'll think about it.
I'm not sure that we'll inform anybody.
We hold out on it.
And we may not do any on Saturday morning.
We're probably not going to be able to reach anybody this week anyway.
Straight away.
And you will take care of Alex Johnson.
And you will take care of Rush Moore.
And they can both be trusted to keep them out of Sheffield County for a day.
They have to know anyway because they've got to turn off the...
And more is equipped well.
Thank you for that.
Any time.
I can do it with one.
I have space of 12 hours.
No problem.
That one takes about 12 hours.
We've covered all the bases, everyone.
Roger, you will know what you've been trying to do, too, which is good.
And, uh...
I said you've been trying to do, too.
I said you've been trying to do, too, and I, you know, I mean...
I feel they're in on the game.
He's out of the country.
He's in Mexico.
He's in Mexico.
I tried to reach him today on the mini start-up situation.
He's gone, so I just let him go.
That's all we need.
Everybody's going.
Don't give it to anybody else.
Just speak for itself.
I have to take the, and not try to interpret it, because everybody's going to be, they'll be after you, head over heels, trying to get the, what I mean is, they'll be after you to get it interpreted, you know, and that's one thing we just, I don't know, must lay off of cooking this time.
No interpretation, whatever.
Do you agree?
And, uh, I'll tell, I'll tell Kennedy, he never says anything.
He just, just, just, well, you know, speaks for himself.
We have nothing to add.
For, as I've said, the case of Warren, who follows orders meticulously, is just to do it in writing.
And he reads this, and he reads the answer to the question.
You know, and that's all.
And beyond that, he says nothing.
I have no comment, no comment.
You see what I mean?
By having them down, that's why I want to, I'll take a look at what you're giving to be sure that it's just as matter-of-fact as possible, and I'll tell Warren to go a bit beyond it under any circumstances.
I just don't want to stray, I don't want to stray in the questions.
Well, people have to answer one question about the bombings.
Because you see, you can say you can't ask any questions, because that will have to be asked and answered.
And on all other questions, he just says no comment.
Because he'll have questions, oh, is this hopeful?
Or are you surprised?
When do you find out?
No comment, no comment, no comment.
So I'll instruct him on that.
But again, they'll have the question about the bombing will be asked.
And they have to just read the answer to that as well.
That's why I wanted them to just read it so that there's absolutely no misinterpretation.
The forward had already suggested an answer to that question.
The announcement had the answer to the one question.
That's all okay.
It might break it early, you think?
I don't know whether it would do any good for you and your communication with them to say that this is the time that we're all, for both parties now, to pipe down on the rhetoric.
What did you tell them?
Restraint, or at least what may have some effect to tell them that may have some effect.
But whatever they say, we'll just have to hold our...
I don't know.
That's it.
They say we're trying to bomb the Conqueror's table and it's never worked.
As a matter of fact, that's the only way they ever go there.
That's what the Conqueror's does now, what they say.
They've never taken restraint before, has it?
Right.
You have to avoid, for that reason, any kind of a meeting with any kind of leaders until after you have completed your negotiations, which is going to be goddamn hard because Berlin's got a lot of domestic stuff that he wants to take up with him, you know, the white partisan leaders and all that stuff.
But I think it's just critical not to have any meeting with him at this point.
Don't you think so?
What I'm talking about is with the Congress back on the 3rd, 3rd, come back on the 3rd.
They come back.
Yeah.
But they, but they, yeah, and then they will come back on the 3rd.
And they will meet.
And they're meeting the Republicans as well.
You see, prior to the time that things broke off, right after the election, I told Mansfield, of course, what it is.
He's pretty good that way.
I wouldn't tell Scott a goddamn thing.
That could, that could happen.
Who?
I agree, but not Scott.
Yeah.
And so, uh, I think, you see, I tentatively have told Nancy I'd see him as soon as he gets back, which would be the second or the third.
And he's not going to be back, and he's unexpected.
When will you get back here?
That's a way, you remember, on Cambodia and other things, to bring out a piece of paper saying, this is what I think you ought to do.
I don't want to be in that position this time, you see.
Yeah.
Well, let me suggest this, knowing that I have got to see him.
Then I suggest that after this announcement is made, you know, a Saturday, if you could place just one call to him and tell him that the President has asked you to greet him when he returns.
Now he will, and then you just take him on the mountaintop and say, which is, and say, look, this is it.
And then you can say, Senator, the president is not briefing the leaders.
I mean, because of the sensitivity of the negotiation.
He's not briefing the Republican leaders, anybody else.
He's only going to talk about domestic matters at this point.
But he wants to...
to be brief on this matter because of your special interest.
Only Mansfield.
Don't do Fulbright.
Don't do anybody else.
Don't need to do Stennis, Dave Barrett, and the rest.
But I think with Mansfield, because of a certain special relationship that I have.
See, it isn't that I want it done for this.
I really want it done so that I can open the way to talk to them about some of our domestic cooperation.
It's very essential.
In order to do that, I've got to have this out of the way first.
So if you, on Saturday morning, give him a call, you know, I've got it at 7 o'clock out there.
Well, when you get up, yeah, you're up.
Wherever he is, he can be reachable.
He can be reachable.
And, uh,
See, they've got a lot of them have got to go down to that box, the memorial service on the 4th, and a lot of them will be going to the Truman General on the 5th, or the Truman Memorial Service on the 5th, so that'll knock out the 3rd, they'll be organizing, the 4th they go to New Orleans, the 5th they'll have the Truman thing, and that just about blows that week.
Then by, over the weekend, you'll be taking off.
You take off about the 7th, right?
Yeah.
That's Sunday, isn't it?
That's all right.
Then by the next week, I can start meeting with the leaders on domestic matters, which I will try to, and I'll just say I'm going to listen to domestic matters.
At this time, because of the sensitive negotiations.
There's a letter to lie right there.
Try to keep them all shut up.
I suppose there's one haunting thing here which has occurred to them.
They may figure that they're pushing us up to another deadline.
That's why they shut up.
Get more around, come on.
Maybe that's a bad sign either.
I know.
Definitely.
They're not easy.
They were being held by their friends, the Jews.
Give Nancy a call and say that the president is asking him to come.
And please, not to tell anybody else because we're not sensitive to this.
And the president is only going to meet with the leaders.