{"conversationCode":"281-004","tapeNumber":281,"conversationNumber":4,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-281-004","startDateTime":"1971-10-21T12:30:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1971-10-21T13:33:00.000Z","startDate":"21-Oct-1971","startTime":"8:30 AM","endDate":"21-Oct-1971","endTime":"9:33 AM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"estimated","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\");","description":"On October 21, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. (\"Bob\") Haldeman met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at an unknown time between 8:30 am and 9:33 am. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 281-004 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"EOB","recordingDevice":"Old Executive Office Building","latitudeEstimated":38.897567,"longitudeEstimated":-77.039147,"chronCode":2,"chronRelease":"Second Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"26-Oct-2000","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 281-4\n\nDate: October 21, 1971\nTime: Unknown between 8:30 am and 9:33 am\nLocation: Executive Office Building\n\nThe President talked with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman.\n\n     The President's October 21, 1971 speech announcing Supreme Court appointees\n          -William L. Safire\n          -Notifications\n                -Timing\n                      -Clark MacGregor\n                      -Charles W. Colson\n          -John N. Mitchell\n          -John D. Ehrlichman\n          -Richard A. Moore\n          -Ehrlichman\n          -Mitchell\n          -Moore\n                -Efforts\n          -Leonard Garment\n          -Herbert G. Klein\n          -John A. Scali\n          -Moore’s role\n          -Question of a woman appointee\n          -Timing\n          -Haldeman's schedule\n\n               -Moore\n                    -Mitchell\n          -American Bar Association [ABA]\n          -Warren E. Burger\n          -Media\n               -People's Republic of China [PRC]\n          -Woman candidate\n          -Moore\n               -Mitchell\n          -Timing\n          -Stock market\n               -Possible effect on announcement\n\n     Marilyn B. (“Missy”) Chandler\n          -White House luncheon\n          -Kennedy women attendance\n               -Ethel (Skakel) Kennedy\n               -Possible press story\n               -Betty Beale\n               -Mrs. Paul N. McCloskey\n          -White House luncheon\n\n     The President's schedule\n          -John B. Connally\n               -The President's dinner with Nobusuke Kishi\n                      -Discussion topics","filename":["281-004-splice.mp3"],"tapeStart":"00:14:06","tapeEnd":"00:23:11","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\")"],"prevCode":"281-003","nextCode":"281-005","tapeTranscriptFile":"281a.mp3,281b.mp3,281c.mp3","transcript":[{"start":856.55,"end":864.54,"text":"I used Sapphire today because I was working on it myself last night."},{"start":864.78,"end":874.2,"text":"With regard to the notifications, at no earlier than 6.30, I'm going to set it up and get the breaker."},{"start":876.66,"end":876.92,"text":"Cool."},{"start":878.7,"end":879.3,"text":"That's important."},{"start":881.94,"end":882.14,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":884.27,"end":886.57,"text":"I had an ad on the house that said they're gone."},{"start":888,"end":888.77,"text":"That's good."},{"start":888.82,"end":889.03,"text":"Sure."},{"start":890.62,"end":891.84,"text":"That's great."},{"start":891.86,"end":891.96,"text":"Okay."},{"start":894.34,"end":895.84,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":896.14,"end":896.64,"text":"I have a deck of them."},{"start":897.74,"end":898.6,"text":"There'll be some of them around."},{"start":898.64,"end":900.92,"text":"I don't care."},{"start":900.98,"end":911.27,"text":"The court special will have to handle the people, the candidates, the birds, the events that involve the birds."},{"start":913.95,"end":915.47,"text":"He said, you better get together in a group."},{"start":917.13,"end":927.54,"text":"And at 6.30 in the morning, he said, you know, go on at 7.30."},{"start":927.56,"end":937.22,"text":"And Mitchell's doing that job."},{"start":937.24,"end":938.32,"text":"He said, you know, go on at 7.30."},{"start":938.36,"end":939.8,"text":"He said, you know, go on at 7.30."},{"start":939.86,"end":942.35,"text":"He said, you know, go on at 7.30."},{"start":943.16,"end":946.52,"text":"Well, I think that's just probably the way it is."},{"start":946.68,"end":947.2,"text":"Right, yeah."},{"start":990.13,"end":995.62,"text":"Well, he's got to wait until just about when I go on."},{"start":995.64,"end":996.62,"text":"He'll write the same story."},{"start":997.69,"end":1007.61,"text":"More, you might just, if I may suggest, don't have firemen always, other people who get into this on scale, just to work with more."},{"start":1008.63,"end":1018.77,"text":"More and more, John has commented, mentioned his confidence more, and I've got to keep this closely going on, it's just one of those things that I, and more I have every confidence, and he represents it, and we do too."},{"start":1018.79,"end":1020.09,"text":"So, there's that."},{"start":1020.11,"end":1033.88,"text":"As far as the woman question is concerned, she was trying to say if it was 11-1 against her, and get out of the square, and she said she was the best qualified woman, and there was no woman qualified for the court."},{"start":1033.9,"end":1034.18,"text":"They did."},{"start":1039.69,"end":1040.04,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":1041.39,"end":1045.24,"text":"Yeah, if you do it in the evening news, then it just knocks, knocks out what we do at the seat."},{"start":1045.26,"end":1053.34,"text":"I mean, that's, that's why every time you make something at the seat, it knocks out what you do at the seat."},{"start":1053.36,"end":1059.08,"text":"So just, you get a little bit more and tell them what your problems are and have them come to the next room and work it out at the next room seat."},{"start":1059.1,"end":1059.5,"text":"Everything rides."},{"start":1060.52,"end":1063.32,"text":"That's the time I put it out at the seat."},{"start":1063.34,"end":1065.76,"text":"Let the evening news bastards go and hurry off and do all the things."},{"start":1068.69,"end":1069.21,"text":"What's your name?"},{"start":1069.25,"end":1071.51,"text":"What's your group?"},{"start":1071.53,"end":1074.47,"text":"He doesn't have the slightest idea of what I'm thinking."},{"start":1074.49,"end":1077.81,"text":"He doesn't have the slightest idea that I'm not going to nominate these two."},{"start":1077.83,"end":1078.87,"text":"But I said, look, he's playing real easy."},{"start":1079.67,"end":1081.21,"text":"Today, he's just going to follow everything."},{"start":1081.56,"end":1082.34,"text":"He says, he just doesn't know."},{"start":1082.36,"end":1083.88,"text":"I said, my friend, you don't know."},{"start":1083.9,"end":1085.84,"text":"And that's what he's going to say about you."},{"start":1085.86,"end":1087.38,"text":"He said, my friend, he doesn't like to say that."},{"start":1087.44,"end":1087.96,"text":"But he will."},{"start":1087.98,"end":1090.2,"text":"I just know he's going to do that for you."},{"start":1090.24,"end":1092.58,"text":"That's what it's going to be."},{"start":1098.36,"end":1112.39,"text":"Maybe, maybe, true, but I'm just inclined to think that it's like China and the rest, that it's just the best to let them appear to be just assholes, you know, like they were before, you know, and all of a sudden it's surprising, and it's a bombshell."},{"start":1112.43,"end":1116.33,"text":"If you start guiding them, somebody's going to smell a rat."},{"start":1116.73,"end":1125.96,"text":"I'm just worried about having to do credit guiding on this episode, and I just let it go."},{"start":1127.04,"end":1136.73,"text":"You start guiding it, and then some of the boys will come along and tell one of his friends, and once you do it, don't get off on that, and then it's all over the place."},{"start":1136.75,"end":1137.61,"text":"I'd let them just ride."},{"start":1137.63,"end":1138.11,"text":"Just don't walk."},{"start":1138.13,"end":1140.27,"text":"Goddammit, nobody in the staff knows what I'm gonna do."},{"start":1140.61,"end":1141.47,"text":"How's that for a lot?"},{"start":1141.59,"end":1143.39,"text":"Tell them where that's gonna lie."},{"start":1143.41,"end":1147.09,"text":"And I go, it may be a woman thing, but get out of the way, out of the bar."},{"start":1147.11,"end":1147.97,"text":"That's fine, that's all I'm gonna do."},{"start":1148.03,"end":1152.65,"text":"But the Mitchell people are running the story, if not, you're gonna do something."},{"start":1155.76,"end":1169.98,"text":"From tomorrow, I'm going to work on the strategy because I've got to work for so long here."},{"start":1170.03,"end":1171.81,"text":"Fair enough."},{"start":1171.89,"end":1172.37,"text":"11 o'clock."},{"start":1172.43,"end":1172.77,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":1172.95,"end":1182.33,"text":"He can call me before he goes up and says everything's okay."},{"start":1182.71,"end":1184.85,"text":"I'll say yes."},{"start":1185.09,"end":1185.27,"text":"Okay."},{"start":1187.38,"end":1191.18,"text":"Okay, what else is there to do?"},{"start":1191.2,"end":1197.9,"text":"Maybe change the markets for the builders."},{"start":1203.33,"end":1208.33,"text":"You know, that's one that I've always worried about, but I have to worry about."},{"start":1208.35,"end":1213.62,"text":"Maybe I'll change my decisions."},{"start":1216.22,"end":1221.42,"text":"A lighter note that really shambles that poor Mrs. Chandler had lunch."},{"start":1221.44,"end":1232.08,"text":"She went there, you know, and she didn't go in for an hour because, you know why?"},{"start":1232.14,"end":1233.68,"text":"You know who they were?"},{"start":1235.53,"end":1237.7,"text":"Oh, no, no, no."},{"start":1239.59,"end":1243.49,"text":"She always turns like, the Kennedy ones."},{"start":1245.32,"end":1246.34,"text":"Ethel and the rest."},{"start":1246.36,"end":1247.98,"text":"I'll get out a story on that."},{"start":1248.14,"end":1251.28,"text":"And the main thing is to get out a story to embarrass myself."},{"start":1252.5,"end":1253.77,"text":"The Kennedy women didn't come."},{"start":1253.79,"end":1253.92,"text":"Oh yes."},{"start":1253.94,"end":1256.07,"text":"We know."},{"start":1256.09,"end":1257.17,"text":"Pat had a guest list."},{"start":1257.81,"end":1260.95,"text":"They were on the guest list."},{"start":1261.01,"end":1262.25,"text":"The Kennedy women didn't show."},{"start":1262.27,"end":1263.37,"text":"They stood up the thing."},{"start":1263.39,"end":1265.37,"text":"It was a terrible thing."},{"start":1265.43,"end":1266.37,"text":"Pat didn't hear you see it."},{"start":1266.77,"end":1270.49,"text":"It was terrible that you heard that they didn't show."},{"start":1270.56,"end":1273.52,"text":"But the two Kennedy women didn't show and they didn't regret it."},{"start":1275.48,"end":1278.78,"text":"They were on the guest list, but they said you can't deny it."},{"start":1278.86,"end":1285.77,"text":"So for once, I mean, she might be calm, you know, she's not very smart, but she might be good."},{"start":1285.83,"end":1288.11,"text":"On a thing like this, she's smart and all that."},{"start":1288.23,"end":1291.37,"text":"But this is a pretty good thing to speak of."},{"start":1291.43,"end":1296.79,"text":"The guest was here, I guess, the two of them, and we got to tell the story."},{"start":1296.81,"end":1297.77,"text":"Betty Hill was there."},{"start":1299.4,"end":1302.69,"text":"They were on the guest list for the show."},{"start":1303.57,"end":1307.33,"text":"Two chairs and a ramp."},{"start":1307.35,"end":1310.53,"text":"The other thing was to invite such assholes."},{"start":1310.69,"end":1314.6,"text":"She had Mrs. McCloskey there."},{"start":1314.68,"end":1320.4,"text":"For Christ's sakes."},{"start":1320.54,"end":1321.3,"text":"Well, anyway."},{"start":1321.44,"end":1322.56,"text":"Well, anyway."},{"start":1322.62,"end":1327.03,"text":"Well, anyway."},{"start":1329.05,"end":1330.91,"text":"She didn't have anything to drink."},{"start":1330.93,"end":1331.49,"text":"She's always on time."},{"start":1331.51,"end":1332.21,"text":"Where are you going?"},{"start":1351.49,"end":1356.17,"text":"Put a note, tell Connelly that I'm hanging up dinner and Keisha went on and I didn't call him."},{"start":1356.91,"end":1358.37,"text":"I'm deranged trying to call him."},{"start":1358.39,"end":1364.58,"text":"Sometime when I'm preaching, maybe about 12 o'clock his time, 3 o'clock our time."},{"start":1364.62,"end":1370.2,"text":"Go over and wait until he wants me to say that."},{"start":1370.34,"end":1376.62,"text":"I'll call him a boy then."},{"start":1376.64,"end":1378.54,"text":"11 o'clock his time."},{"start":1380.27,"end":1386.51,"text":"Well, I can call it late today."},{"start":1387.31,"end":1391.34,"text":"Okay."},{"start":1391.64,"end":1406.17,"text":"The fight was made by a friend."}],"transcriptBoundary":{"start":855.22,"end":1392.65,"startMethod":"llm-alignment","endMethod":"llm-alignment"},"transcriptConfidence":"high","transcriptSource":"bigtape","aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and H. R. Haldeman coordinated the logistics and communications strategy for the President's upcoming public announcement regarding his Supreme Court nominees. They discussed the involvement of various staff members, including Richard A. Moore and John Mitchell, and weighed concerns regarding public perception, the American Bar Association, and the impact of the announcement on the stock market. Additionally, the pair touched upon social matters involving the Kennedy family and potential press coverage of White House events, as well as the President’s upcoming schedule.","topics":["Supreme Court appointments","Media strategy","Public relations","H. R. Haldeman","White House logistics"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T13:09:36.355Z"},"topicSlugs":["supreme-court-appointments","media-strategy","public-relations","h-r-haldeman","white-house-logistics"],"audioDurationSec":540,"audioFiles":[{"file":"281-004-splice.mp3","bytes":8647201,"durationSec":540.42,"bitrate":128006,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T14:10:31.010Z","originalFilename":["281a.mp3","281b.mp3","281c.mp3"],"spliceSource":{"spliceType":"bigtape","sourceFiles":["281a.mp3"],"cutStart":853.72,"cutEnd":1394.15,"adjustedStart":853.72,"adjustedEnd":1394.15,"boundaryMethod":"llm-alignment","confidence":"high","splicedAt":"2026-09-18T14:10:31.010Z"},"transcriptPrev":{"segments":81,"replacedAt":"2026-09-18T14:14:03.456Z"},"audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/281-004-splice.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/281-004","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/281/conversation-281-004","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}