{"conversationCode":"281-070","tapeNumber":281,"conversationNumber":70,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-281-070","startDateTime":"1971-10-21T14:07:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1971-10-21T14:30:00.000Z","startDate":"21-Oct-1971","startTime":"10:07 AM","endDate":"21-Oct-1971","endTime":"10:30 AM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\"); Ziegler, Ronald L.;","description":"On October 21, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. (\"Bob\") Haldeman, and Ronald L. Ziegler met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building from 10:07 am to 10:30 am. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 281-070 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"EOB","recordingDevice":"Old Executive Office Building","latitudeEstimated":38.897567,"longitudeEstimated":-77.039147,"chronCode":2,"chronRelease":"Second Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"26-Oct-2000","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 281-70\n\nDate: October 21, 1971\nTime: 10:07 am - 10:30 am\nLocation: Executive Office Building\n\nThe President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman and Ronald L. Ziegler.\n\nThe President's announcement of appointees to the Supreme Court\n     -Television time\n          -Instructions for Ziegler\n     -Timing and length\n     -American Bar Association [ABA]\n          -Constitution\n          -Ziegler's press briefing\n                 -Knowledge of nominees\n          -John N. Mitchell\n                 -Mildred L. Lillie\n                 -Leak of ABA's ruling\n                       -William L. Safire\n                       -Richard A. Moore\n     -Press reports\n          -Barbara Walters\n                 -Dan Rather\n                       -Herschel H. Friday, Lillie\n          -New York Times\n                 -Fred Graham\n                 -Friday, Lillie\n          -Possible White House comments\n     -ABA\n          -Mitchell\n     -Moore’s role\n     -John A. Scali\n     -John D. Ehrlichman\n     -Ziegler\n     -Knowledge of nominees\n     -Ziegler's schedule\n          -Moore\n          -Forthcoming press briefing\n                 -Ziegler’s comments\n     -Moore\n     -Forthcoming press briefing\n          -ABA\n                 -Role\n                       -Senate\n                 -Attorney General\n                 -The President\n          -Timing of the President's decision\n          -Instructions for Ziegler\n\n                -ABA\n                      -Mitchell\n                -Timing and length of President’s announcement\n           -Timing\n           -Pool of candidates\n                -ABA\n                -Mitchell\n                -Ziegler’s comments to press\n                      -President’s options\n                -ABA\n                      -Leak\n                            -Ziegler’s comments\n                            -Mitchell\n                            -The President’s reaction\n                            -Lawrence E. Walsh\n                            -Lawyers' ability to maintain confidentiality\n                            -Lillie and Friday\n                                   -Views on civil rights\n                                        -Effect of publicity\n                            -Potter Stewart\n                                   -Pentagon papers\n           -Speculation on choices\n                -Ziegler’s comments to press\n                -Friday and Lillie\n                -People’s Republic of China [PRC] initiative\n                -Soviet Union initiative\n                -Phase II initiative\n           -ABA\n           -Moore\n           -Timing of briefing\n\nZiegler left at 10:28 am.\n\n           -Commentators\n               -Possible briefing\n                     -The President’s instructions\n               -Scali\n               -Herbert G. Klein\n               -Charles W. Colson\n               -Clark MacGregor\n\nHaldeman left at 10:30 am.","filename":["281-070-splice.mp3"],"tapeStart":"01:01:49","tapeEnd":"01:23:12","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\")","Ziegler, Ronald L."],"prevCode":"281-069","nextCode":"281-071","tapeTranscriptFile":"281a.mp3,281b.mp3,281c.mp3","transcript":[{"start":3725.83,"end":3728.23,"text":"All you do is to just go forward with your plan previously."},{"start":3729.05,"end":3732.75,"text":"If you ask the finance, what would you ask for now?"},{"start":3732.77,"end":3732.95,"text":"$739,000."},{"start":3732.97,"end":3733.85,"text":"$739,000."},{"start":3733.89,"end":3735.95,"text":"$739,000."},{"start":3735.97,"end":3736.23,"text":"$739,000."},{"start":3736.25,"end":3741.84,"text":"$739,000."},{"start":3742.16,"end":3744.14,"text":"$739,000."},{"start":3744.28,"end":3745.06,"text":"$739,000."},{"start":3747,"end":3763.86,"text":"with regard to the American bar system, or the American bar, I use the line of dissenting as the right, and this is under the Constitution, and there must be advice and consent in the Senate, because the Constitution does not require that you have consent in the Supreme Court, and so it's very well included in the House of Presidents and in the White House."},{"start":3779.43,"end":3780.43,"text":"The APA."},{"start":3792.71,"end":3797.51,"text":"We welcome the advice of everyone, but we do not require any consent."},{"start":3798.65,"end":3800.15,"text":"He does not have any legal power."},{"start":3800.17,"end":3807.4,"text":"In other words, let him hair off, officer, and take the regarding to go the other way."},{"start":3807.44,"end":3810.14,"text":"You don't know, so you can come up with anything."},{"start":3810.18,"end":3810.64,"text":"Is that clear?"},{"start":3810.9,"end":3812.98,"text":"Is that all right?"},{"start":3813,"end":3817.22,"text":"You don't know, as I have told you in all of them."},{"start":3817.26,"end":3819.74,"text":"Nobody knows except Jim Mitchell and me."},{"start":3819.88,"end":3821.48,"text":"Okay."},{"start":3822.18,"end":3844.13,"text":"And now, there's one where Jeff Mitchell's going to get out with the, on Lilly, and they said that they were, they thought she was probably the best qualified woman in the country to be, as a judge, but she wasn't qualified in the Supreme Court yet."},{"start":3848.43,"end":3850.27,"text":"I don't know."},{"start":3850.29,"end":3852.03,"text":"I told him to try to get it out through Sapphire."},{"start":3852.35,"end":3853.59,"text":"One of the leaders of the Corps or something."},{"start":3853.61,"end":3855.64,"text":"I don't want you to say that now."},{"start":3855.66,"end":3859.64,"text":"I don't think that's something you should say."},{"start":3859.66,"end":3862.1,"text":"Good to see you after this."},{"start":3862.24,"end":3865.8,"text":"And actually, the other columnist, Tom, is one of the leaders."},{"start":3865.82,"end":3869.4,"text":"Now, that can rise today because you've got the full story."},{"start":3869.42,"end":3873.02,"text":"Basically, giving a little... Basically, it's... No, I don't."},{"start":3874.36,"end":3874.58,"text":"Thank you."},{"start":3876.15,"end":3879.55,"text":"My point is quite different from that."},{"start":3879.99,"end":3886.38,"text":"But where they said she is the best qualified woman, there is no woman who is better qualified."},{"start":3886.78,"end":3891.74,"text":"And so therefore, there's no woman qualified for the court."},{"start":3891.84,"end":3898.48,"text":"But I don't want you to get, and I think I would say this with regard to the woman."},{"start":3900.39,"end":3902.09,"text":"I think the stack jury thing is good to put out."},{"start":3902.11,"end":3905.51,"text":"My gentleman up there, I don't know."},{"start":3905.59,"end":3912.54,"text":"You originally said you didn't want to say that."},{"start":3912.72,"end":3914.4,"text":"All right, there's somebody else to say it."},{"start":3914.44,"end":3915.2,"text":"Basically, this morning."},{"start":3916.44,"end":3924.43,"text":"in this situation where the water's not clear, for example, the speculation changes all over the place."},{"start":3924.51,"end":3935.89,"text":"You're right, it was on the air this morning, for example, saying that Friday was a certainty that Milley was not going to be appointed, and he made an argument out of it, so we don't know."},{"start":3935.91,"end":3937.09,"text":"The New York Times, it rained, it rained."},{"start":3937.57,"end":3938.63,"text":"What was he saying?"},{"start":3938.85,"end":3946.67,"text":"He said that Lilly, he said it's Friday for sure, and I'm uncertain about Lilly this week."},{"start":3946.85,"end":3957.81,"text":"So the question is, do we want to move the press to speculate some in this way?"},{"start":3957.87,"end":3961.78,"text":"That it may be from the 6th, but it may not be."},{"start":3962.14,"end":3965.32,"text":"And to get some degree shy of the APA,"},{"start":3966.16,"end":3978.36,"text":"Just through my response to questions along the line of Chief Mitchell's been out of the ADA for about a letter."},{"start":3978.4,"end":3981,"text":"The thing is, you'd better get in touch."},{"start":3981.24,"end":3982.78,"text":"Moore has got to be in charge of PR."},{"start":3982.92,"end":3986.68,"text":"This is very important because he's the only one who knows what's going to happen."},{"start":3987.86,"end":3990.46,"text":"And Moore, you've got to talk with Moore."},{"start":3990.48,"end":3991.78,"text":"I don't want anybody else in it."},{"start":3991.8,"end":3995.93,"text":"I don't want Moore or Scali or Hurley or any of these people."},{"start":3995.95,"end":3996.74,"text":"You and Moore talk."},{"start":3996.86,"end":4000.69,"text":"And Moore is not, it's going to become more, you're going to have to tell a lot more."},{"start":4000.71,"end":4002.03,"text":"I don't want to know."},{"start":4002.21,"end":4003.83,"text":"You don't know otherwise."},{"start":4003.85,"end":4005.67,"text":"Your credibility is seriously impaired."},{"start":4005.75,"end":4006.27,"text":"That's right."},{"start":4006.29,"end":4008.49,"text":"I think he's very clearly understanding."},{"start":4008.53,"end":4011.01,"text":"Well, I haven't written him hard."},{"start":4011.33,"end":4013.15,"text":"I haven't talked to him in hell."},{"start":4013.17,"end":4014.33,"text":"I haven't told anybody."},{"start":4015.07,"end":4018.76,"text":"Well, I don't want to convey to the press, sir, that I'm not aware of it."},{"start":4018.8,"end":4021.26,"text":"Well, you probably want to find one of these."},{"start":4021.28,"end":4022.94,"text":"We may not."},{"start":4023.22,"end":4028.46,"text":"I don't know."},{"start":4028.52,"end":4029.28,"text":"I don't know."},{"start":4029.32,"end":4032.92,"text":"I'll talk more about it."},{"start":4033.8,"end":4036.72,"text":"And I would be trying to record it and also the letter and along the line what she has said and what I would say."},{"start":4036.74,"end":4038.44,"text":"I'll weigh in on the yes and then I think I'll stow them all on all of that ."},{"start":4060.11,"end":4069.03,"text":"The question is, we want to, I think, leave them in the same posture that we left them after."},{"start":4069.07,"end":4069.79,"text":"That's right."},{"start":4069.85,"end":4072.83,"text":"You got it beautifully handled so far."},{"start":4074.95,"end":4076.55,"text":"But you don't want me to convey to them"},{"start":4078.71,"end":4081.01,"text":"The guy can be very firm on the ADA."},{"start":4081.05,"end":4085.53,"text":"Morris, not in anger, can say, well, now let's understand that the ADA is totally the right thing."},{"start":4085.65,"end":4091.09,"text":"The Constitution requires the advice and consent of the Senate."},{"start":4091.14,"end":4095.3,"text":"It does not require consent of the ADA."},{"start":4095.48,"end":4101.42,"text":"And that's the President's position."},{"start":4101.46,"end":4103.92,"text":"They will ask, have you received"},{"start":4106.25,"end":4112.94,"text":"This whole thing with the ADA is his item, not mine."},{"start":4114.14,"end":4115.78,"text":"I have never indicated."},{"start":4115.8,"end":4120.08,"text":"This is the Attorney General's proposition that you should make clear."},{"start":4120.14,"end":4126.6,"text":"Well, the Attorney General advises the President, the Attorney General advises the President on this."},{"start":4126.72,"end":4132.06,"text":"And the ADA is one of several organizations in the Constitution."},{"start":4134.15,"end":4136.09,"text":"and they don't have the veto power."},{"start":4136.65,"end":4141.29,"text":"But the President does not have, I've had no conversation whenever with anybody, have anybody in the ADA don't attend."},{"start":4141.31,"end":4142.93,"text":"The Attorney General makes the recommendations."},{"start":4143.47,"end":4149.31,"text":"But I will say that you talked to the Attorney General."},{"start":4149.34,"end":4155.78,"text":"Yes, I've been in very, I've been in contact with the Attorney General, period."},{"start":4156.38,"end":4161.2,"text":"Now, then they will say, has the President made the decision?"},{"start":4162.12,"end":4162.32,"text":"What?"},{"start":4162.78,"end":4166.93,"text":"And has the president, when I announce the fact that you're going on executive?"},{"start":4166.95,"end":4167.35,"text":"Oh, yes."},{"start":4167.37,"end":4169.33,"text":"They'll say, as of now, has the president decided?"},{"start":4169.35,"end":4169.47,"text":"Yes."},{"start":4169.49,"end":4169.81,"text":"Oh, yes, yes."},{"start":4169.85,"end":4171.79,"text":"Sure, I would go on and say yes."},{"start":4171.81,"end":4173.27,"text":"And when did he decide?"},{"start":4173.65,"end":4174.65,"text":"When did he decide?"},{"start":4175.09,"end":4175.87,"text":"Yesterday's meeting?"},{"start":4175.89,"end":4176.05,"text":"No."},{"start":4176.55,"end":4176.69,"text":"No?"},{"start":4176.75,"end":4176.91,"text":"Uh-huh."},{"start":4179.49,"end":4182.13,"text":"Gentlemen, I'm not going to tell you."},{"start":4182.84,"end":4183.27,"text":"I don't know."},{"start":4184.96,"end":4190.26,"text":"I don't think you want to get into that, because they'll say that the ADA turned us down and then we went to somebody else."},{"start":4190.66,"end":4195.05,"text":"See, I said yesterday that we went to the point where we have the point."},{"start":4195.09,"end":4196.21,"text":"Just say that I'm not going to take that."},{"start":4196.39,"end":4199.03,"text":"The president, the president has kept this very closely in mind."},{"start":4199.81,"end":4200.79,"text":"He's kept this very closely in mind."},{"start":4201.93,"end":4206.85,"text":"He's had a number of names in mind, including the names that are speculated about."},{"start":4207.41,"end":4211.35,"text":"He has not personally discussed, has not talked to any of the candidates himself."},{"start":4211.37,"end":4212.79,"text":"He's followed that practice."},{"start":4213.77,"end":4219.07,"text":"And as far as the president, when he decided in his own mind, I cannot tell you."},{"start":4219.11,"end":4219.41,"text":"You'll see."},{"start":4219.53,"end":4232.18,"text":"I said that you weren't going to talk to me yesterday if you had not decided."},{"start":4232.2,"end":4232.86,"text":"Yeah, that's right."},{"start":4233.53,"end":4234.13,"text":"Well, he's all right."},{"start":4234.15,"end":4236.95,"text":"He can still say he don't know when he decided."},{"start":4236.97,"end":4238.07,"text":"Yeah, I don't know."},{"start":4238.25,"end":4238.71,"text":"I don't know."},{"start":4238.73,"end":4238.93,"text":"I don't."},{"start":4238.95,"end":4241.33,"text":"You tell him that you know that he is kept."},{"start":4241.35,"end":4242.07,"text":"That he doesn't."},{"start":4242.11,"end":4242.59,"text":"He hasn't."},{"start":4242.69,"end":4245.87,"text":"I don't know when he decided with his own mind."},{"start":4246.03,"end":4253.32,"text":"But I know that, in fairness, with everybody concerned, until the ADA, he deliberately, that he, that he,"},{"start":4253.93,"end":4263.06,"text":"that, gentlemen, I would expect that the president, frankly, had decided in his own mind several, probably over the weekend, that he can't take it."},{"start":4263.16,"end":4270.43,"text":"On the other hand, he deliberately, because of the, as a courtesy to the ADA,"},{"start":4271.5,"end":4274.02,"text":"He had thought he was going to decide it."},{"start":4274.1,"end":4276.12,"text":"He may have decided it, but I can't tell you."},{"start":4276.16,"end":4278.74,"text":"But as it occurs, the ADA held it open."},{"start":4278.82,"end":4285.35,"text":"I mean, I thought that he should not make a final, irrevocable decision until the ADA then came in."},{"start":4285.37,"end":4288.25,"text":"As it occurs, it's in the ADA."},{"start":4288.29,"end":4295.23,"text":"Now, they may get you on this, too."},{"start":4295.29,"end":4299.2,"text":"When did he decide, when did the President decide to make the announcement tonight?"},{"start":4301.61,"end":4307.93,"text":"Oh, well, right after he got the word from the ADA last night."},{"start":4307.97,"end":4309.93,"text":"That's what I did."},{"start":4310.71,"end":4312.49,"text":"Ended up the word at 5.30 last night."},{"start":4314.03,"end":4314.95,"text":"You don't want to say that?"},{"start":4315.03,"end":4316.09,"text":"Just say he made it this morning."},{"start":4316.11,"end":4319.78,"text":"Or I can say yesterday he ended up talking to the Attorney General."},{"start":4320.8,"end":4323.26,"text":"They decided that they should make the announcement."},{"start":4323.4,"end":4325.68,"text":"And he turned it on today, turned it on this morning."},{"start":4325.7,"end":4330.89,"text":"Yeah, the Attorney General just said the President announced last week, he's going to announce it this week."},{"start":4330.99,"end":4342.85,"text":"And once he got, once he, no, once he received the word from the APA and had a chance to discuss it as he did the considerable length last night with the Attorney General, he made the decision this morning."},{"start":4343.6,"end":4348.75,"text":"We'll go on tonight and make his, and announce his decisions."},{"start":4352.23,"end":4356.83,"text":"How's that sound?"},{"start":4356.85,"end":4357.09,"text":"Okay."},{"start":4357.11,"end":4360.91,"text":"Brian and I screwed around the 730."},{"start":4360.99,"end":4364.46,"text":"That's okay."},{"start":4364.48,"end":4365.16,"text":"All right."},{"start":4365.22,"end":4367.08,"text":"We got as good money as the 730."},{"start":4367.1,"end":4368.94,"text":"Yeah, that bothers me."},{"start":4368.96,"end":4371.66,"text":"And then that's our important question."},{"start":4374.49,"end":4379.35,"text":"It's going to be brief and it's very hard."},{"start":4387.54,"end":4389.26,"text":"It's a damn good thing to do it this way."},{"start":4389.34,"end":4392.62,"text":"They'll get your... Sir, we've got our story out here first."},{"start":4393.02,"end":4394,"text":"You're goddamn right."},{"start":4394.06,"end":4395.98,"text":"That's why we're never going to the ABA again."},{"start":4396.12,"end":4398.7,"text":"Boy, if Mitchell gets burned, he'll hit his fist off."},{"start":4398.72,"end":4400.24,"text":"We haven't done it now."},{"start":4400.82,"end":4402.18,"text":"He'll never go to the ABA again."},{"start":4402.28,"end":4402.94,"text":"That's why you're right."},{"start":4402.98,"end":4413.59,"text":"When I'm in a subtle way, you know, according to Attorney General Rogers, see, we have not up to this point, I have not confirmed the list of six."},{"start":4413.81,"end":4416.53,"text":"Could I suggest that"},{"start":4417.53,"end":4422.4,"text":"This list of six was a group that was under the ."},{"start":4423.26,"end":4423.85,"text":"Oh, yeah."},{"start":4425.06,"end":4432.42,"text":"Oh, yeah, in the sense that you can say that he has had a number of names in mind, including those that have been circulated."},{"start":4432.58,"end":4441.38,"text":"Yeah, no, I said, gentlemen, ladies and gentlemen, I said, I asked the president this morning, wasn't he listed six?"},{"start":4441.5,"end":4450.79,"text":"And he smiled and said, well, the difficulty is that the press, as usual, I put it this way, and I understand that because they didn't pay him."},{"start":4451.22,"end":4453.41,"text":"They had part of the story, but not all of the story."},{"start":4454.05,"end":4459.21,"text":"All six of these were under consideration, yes."},{"start":4459.59,"end":4469.47,"text":"All six, wait a minute, all six were, not all six were not submitted, no, no, all six were under consideration."},{"start":4470.61,"end":4473.79,"text":"In Tutsman, they had been highly recommended."},{"start":4473.81,"end":4476.41,"text":"But the story missed."},{"start":4476.44,"end":4482.76,"text":"It wasn't for the story, but there have been others under consideration at an equal level."},{"start":4483.26,"end":4484.15,"text":"There have been others."},{"start":4485.25,"end":4485.95,"text":"There have been others."},{"start":4487.42,"end":4488.02,"text":"Then they'll say..."},{"start":4488.04,"end":4489.32,"text":"Wait a minute, wait a minute."},{"start":4489.42,"end":4496.17,"text":"I don't want them to get carried off and they were not going to... Well, what I could do is to say, gentlemen..."},{"start":4496.33,"end":4497.41,"text":"But the list is not exclusive."},{"start":4497.65,"end":4503.53,"text":"He's had thousands of letters recommended, hundreds of qualified people, disabled people, able people."},{"start":4504.01,"end":4504.85,"text":"The impression I want to make"},{"start":4507.21,"end":4514.45,"text":"the whole world can become a world of sex far from others who have been under consideration."},{"start":4514.51,"end":4519.71,"text":"If then I went, oh, ah, then you're going to, if you say others under consideration, that'll be, that'll get real."},{"start":4519.75,"end":4520.43,"text":"I said that yesterday."},{"start":4520.45,"end":4521.75,"text":"I've already said that."},{"start":4521.77,"end":4522.67,"text":"We're already on record, isn't it?"},{"start":4522.69,"end":4523.69,"text":"Well, that was back before yesterday."},{"start":4523.71,"end":4528.11,"text":"Well, long before yesterday, when we said that others have been under consideration."},{"start":4528.13,"end":4533.81,"text":"But I could use this to try to be a little bit, I say, unless we can solve it on sex, because we can solve it all along."},{"start":4534.59,"end":4537.91,"text":"made that story leak, and others were under consideration."},{"start":4537.93,"end":4548.14,"text":"Now gentlemen, you know that the ABA, they, within an hour after the list was submitted to the ABA, it became public, legal."},{"start":4548.38,"end":4551.26,"text":"It wouldn't become legal."},{"start":4551.28,"end":4552.42,"text":"Well, I don't mind it."},{"start":4552.52,"end":4553.7,"text":"I don't mind it."},{"start":4553.78,"end":4555.96,"text":"I like to hit it on the high level."},{"start":4555.98,"end":4563.36,"text":"I tend to say that the President was frankly, was quite as a lawyer,"},{"start":4565.13,"end":4585.42,"text":"was surprised and disappointed when that happened because he, as a lawyer, knows that one of the"},{"start":4590.81,"end":4602.1,"text":"The first responsibilities of a lawyer, one of a lawyer's highest efforts is confidentiality."},{"start":4603.7,"end":4616.53,"text":"And to hear the top lawyers in the country so blatantly preach confidentiality was a surprise to him."},{"start":4616.57,"end":4618.53,"text":"He ended up saying, may I say, gentlemen,"},{"start":4619.41,"end":4630.29,"text":"It was not Mr. Walsh, you know, that Mr. Walsh was also, put it this way, he was also surprised and distressed that this happened."},{"start":4630.47,"end":4632.25,"text":"God damn it, put this down."},{"start":4632.75,"end":4635.15,"text":"This is more important than all this shit you're asking me about."},{"start":4636.49,"end":4642.12,"text":"You know what's getting at, don't you?"},{"start":4642.14,"end":4643.1,"text":"Confidentiality leaks."},{"start":4643.3,"end":4646.18,"text":"All these assholes around the White House that leak everything I tell them."},{"start":4647.67,"end":4655.39,"text":"It's a very good point to make, and you should make it."},{"start":4655.77,"end":4659.29,"text":"I was surprised and distressed that lawyers would leave."},{"start":4659.33,"end":4662.02,"text":"But I expect leaks to occur."},{"start":4662.96,"end":4664.02,"text":"That lawyers would leave."},{"start":4664.38,"end":4670.16,"text":"It's like a doctor, you know, letting a patient die, rather than try to save his life."},{"start":4670.2,"end":4676.04,"text":"Because a lawyer is supposed to be, above everything else, able to keep a confidence."},{"start":4680.78,"end":4683.31,"text":"This is a reflection of our lawyers as a group."},{"start":4683.4,"end":4686.05,"text":"It's a reflection of our lawyers as a group."},{"start":4686.09,"end":4694.17,"text":"But the top lawyers in the country believe something of how government should become competent in China."},{"start":4694.19,"end":4698.06,"text":"I'll tell you why they believe that."},{"start":4698.12,"end":4704,"text":"Both, though, and to a certain extent, pride in the way that we've turned it on because of their attitude on civil rights."},{"start":4706.24,"end":4715.54,"text":"which means, well, by reason of the league, the law school teams, the left wings, and all the types, and the blacks, and so forth, go in and back to them."},{"start":4715.56,"end":4720.85,"text":"Just as that poor, weak son of a bitch, Polly Short, caved on Pentagon paper."},{"start":4721.01,"end":4722.19,"text":"That's my part about the league."},{"start":4722.39,"end":4723.39,"text":"The league, they're going to get me."},{"start":4723.41,"end":4726.91,"text":"That's what I want you to think is going to be fine."},{"start":4730.92,"end":4731.2,"text":"Okay."},{"start":4731.79,"end":4733.61,"text":"We'll give them a day that I'm going to remember them today."},{"start":4733.93,"end":4734.33,"text":"Yes, sir."},{"start":4734.35,"end":4738.34,"text":"But we're just sure to keep them hearing often the wrong thing."},{"start":4738.4,"end":4738.66,"text":"I know."},{"start":4739.06,"end":4744.19,"text":"Don't give them any idea or any other... Do you think there's any..."},{"start":4745.12,"end":4758.33,"text":"If they ask, well, is there a chance that somebody other than you, this overwhelming vote against Ludd and so forth, that somebody other than Friday and Lilly will be recommended general, I would say that I would expect you to go."},{"start":4758.45,"end":4767.7,"text":"I mean, I don't know, but just for your guidance, for your guidance, I would expect you to go."},{"start":4767.72,"end":4771.36,"text":"And I want you to get just a little bit pregnant of that."},{"start":4771.4,"end":4772.56,"text":"You don't mind that, do you?"},{"start":4772.62,"end":4773.42,"text":"Because you don't know."},{"start":4774.71,"end":4777.41,"text":"You don't know, maybe I put up on Friday in the city."},{"start":4778.21,"end":4782.62,"text":"I'd say, I wouldn't speculate on that."},{"start":4782.66,"end":4784.28,"text":"I'd say, do you gentlemen know China initiative?"},{"start":4784.3,"end":4785.22,"text":"It's always initiative."},{"start":4785.3,"end":4786.8,"text":"It pays to initiate."},{"start":4786.82,"end":4789.46,"text":"The president plays important matters close to his best."},{"start":4789.52,"end":4790.2,"text":"Put it that way."},{"start":4790.24,"end":4794.8,"text":"And I would urge you not to speculate on what he's going to do."},{"start":4794.82,"end":4800.89,"text":"That's a nice thing to put in, too."},{"start":4801.01,"end":4803.69,"text":"He plays the important matters close to his best."},{"start":4804.95,"end":4808.25,"text":"All right."},{"start":4808.48,"end":4812.96,"text":"One thing we said yesterday was that it is possible"},{"start":4823.89,"end":4827.37,"text":"Yeah, but hitting the bar today will look like you're going to hit the bar."},{"start":4827.57,"end":4830.66,"text":"It looks like you're laying the groundwork before going to hit the bar."},{"start":4830.7,"end":4832.26,"text":"Maybe the derelict will be out."},{"start":4832.48,"end":4837.14,"text":"Check to see if more of the derelict is out already before you go out to your briefing."},{"start":4839.56,"end":4841.92,"text":"Don't have a briefing before you speak to the commissioner."},{"start":4843.02,"end":4846.06,"text":"If you say you won't have a reason, I won't read the chapter."},{"start":4846.1,"end":4857.24,"text":"The question is the presence of knowledge, and I won't read the chapter."},{"start":4857.77,"end":4858.95,"text":"That would be very good."},{"start":4858.97,"end":4859.17,"text":"Okay."},{"start":4859.21,"end":4867.65,"text":"Question whether we want to take any step in trying to sell the commentators ahead of time."},{"start":4871.36,"end":4876.59,"text":"I don't think they can."},{"start":4876.67,"end":4878.85,"text":"I don't think they can."},{"start":4879.15,"end":4886.64,"text":"I mean, they're not going to be able to do it."},{"start":4886.84,"end":4890.28,"text":"Come on."},{"start":4890.34,"end":4893.18,"text":"Well, I'm just thinking about it."},{"start":4893.2,"end":4893.88,"text":"I'll be ready."},{"start":4893.9,"end":4896.31,"text":"It won't help, but I guess I did wonder about it."},{"start":4902.44,"end":4905.22,"text":"It's a good positive reaction test."},{"start":4905.24,"end":4909.02,"text":"It will get them, I'm sure."},{"start":4909.12,"end":4914.02,"text":"The TV guys are coming right after you."},{"start":4914.04,"end":4914.52,"text":"Oh, that goes."},{"start":4914.64,"end":4915.36,"text":"Now, wait a minute."},{"start":4915.44,"end":4916.32,"text":"Now, wait a minute."},{"start":4916.56,"end":4921.58,"text":"Let's focus these people on their left-wing kitesaw adventures for the most part."},{"start":4921.78,"end":4924.16,"text":"Either the cockpit is what people are ready for."},{"start":4924.34,"end":4924.72,"text":"Correct."},{"start":4924.78,"end":4925.97,"text":"All right."},{"start":4926.05,"end":4927.43,"text":"But when they come on,"},{"start":4929.4,"end":4942.06,"text":"Whatever we do for something, always in the loop, is to try to build up and get on, cry and hide to our audience, the natives, the Bay of Plum, and the St. Louis, the Pride, the President."},{"start":4942.12,"end":4946.96,"text":"They don't know, then they have to come on, really, in reaction only to what you said."},{"start":4946.98,"end":4948.34,"text":"Let them come on like they did after China."},{"start":4948.84,"end":4952.32,"text":"Don't tell the fuckers anything, and give each other a nice valet key, it's not a shame."},{"start":4953.38,"end":4953.82,"text":"No problem."},{"start":4953.9,"end":4954.46,"text":"They're coming at 6.30."},{"start":4954.5,"end":4956.93,"text":"No, he was getting down at 6.30."},{"start":4956.97,"end":4958.27,"text":"No, close to that."},{"start":4960.33,"end":4964.03,"text":"I don't want to tell any client, any of those people."},{"start":4964.05,"end":4964.17,"text":"Okay."},{"start":4965.93,"end":4967.41,"text":"I think we just..."},{"start":4967.43,"end":4968.57,"text":"I think we have to."},{"start":4968.63,"end":4969.71,"text":"I will on any trigger on it."},{"start":4971.61,"end":4971.75,"text":"What?"},{"start":4971.77,"end":4972.97,"text":"We just covered both."},{"start":4973.03,"end":4986.53,"text":"Closer to my grave, but they ought to have a really, really great man on that with some southern support."},{"start":4986.56,"end":4986.68,"text":"Okay."},{"start":4986.72,"end":4987.19,"text":"All right."},{"start":4987.22,"end":4988.11,"text":"Move to part..."},{"start":4988.83,"end":4989.49,"text":"Who's that for?"},{"start":4989.51,"end":4990.3,"text":"The barrel horse."},{"start":4993.56,"end":4993.74,"text":"OK."},{"start":5024.06,"end":5027.14,"text":"where I quote the left-hand thing that balanced ."}],"transcriptBoundary":{"start":3721.88,"end":5024,"startMethod":"llm-alignment","endMethod":"llm-alignment"},"transcriptConfidence":"high","transcriptSource":"bigtape","aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon met with H. R. Haldeman and Ronald Ziegler to coordinate the public relations strategy and press messaging regarding his forthcoming Supreme Court nominations. The discussion focused on managing the American Bar Association’s (ABA) role and its reported leaks regarding potential candidates like Mildred L. Lillie and Herschel H. Friday. Nixon explicitly instructed Ziegler to maintain a position of ignorance regarding the specific nominees during press briefings and emphasized that Richard A. Moore should handle the primary communication strategy for the announcement.","topics":["Supreme Court appointments","American Bar Association","Press relations","Ronald Ziegler","H. R. Haldeman","John N. Mitchell"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T13:15:43.530Z"},"topicSlugs":["supreme-court-appointments","american-bar-association","press-relations","ronald-ziegler","h-r-haldeman","john-n-mitchell"],"audioDurationSec":1305,"audioFiles":[{"file":"281-070-splice.mp3","bytes":20882539,"durationSec":1305.13,"bitrate":128002,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T14:10:32.233Z","originalFilename":["281a.mp3","281b.mp3","281c.mp3"],"spliceSource":{"spliceType":"bigtape","sourceFiles":["281a.mp3"],"cutStart":3720.38,"cutEnd":5025.5,"adjustedStart":3720.38,"adjustedEnd":5025.5,"boundaryMethod":"llm-alignment","confidence":"high","splicedAt":"2026-09-18T14:10:32.233Z"},"transcriptPrev":{"segments":296,"replacedAt":"2026-09-18T14:14:09.615Z"},"audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/281-070-splice.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/281-070","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/281/conversation-281-070","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}