Nixon & Haldeman on Pay Board and George Meany

53:36We all realize the importance of mobilizing.
54:35But I was going to play with a bunch of others, and we got, you know, we figured I just got put out.
54:39They didn't just say there was a burglary in the state of the city.
54:44No, they picked up a few of them, but they weren't.
54:50Yes.
54:51All right.
54:51Is that why you put a good man on that spot?
54:54To follow up?
54:55You better put somebody on it.
54:58Chuck, you really got to work an exciting evening.
55:01Somebody has to watch that too.
55:04Yeah.
55:04I didn't hear nothing.
55:34But I was going to ask you, because that was my next question.
55:38He got on that bandwagon and recorded two reports that were being looked at by somebody.
55:43And they asked the first question, and Conley didn't even let them finish the question.
55:48They got kind of halfway through the question, and Conley weeped in with his first barrage.
55:52He was scared that they were going to cut him off.
55:55I don't think he was sure how long, how much time they were going to have.
55:58He knows about all those commercials he's done.
56:01Yeah, yeah.
56:02So he launched into his first blast, which was on the labor thing, and hit all our pitch, and he had all his points stacked up, you know, and he just spotted them all out.
56:14Then they asked him the next question on rising prices, and he turned that around to labor again, so they asked him a follow-up question on the prices, so...
56:24Then lunch, and he had a set of charts.
56:26He said, you know, food prices keep going.
56:28Look at the food prices, the way they go up and down.
56:30He said, my God, look at this.
56:32Meat prices here just caught up with where they were in 57 or something, you know.
56:35And he was going through all of this.
56:38All the prices were going all the way down.
56:40Then he picked up another chart, and these poor guys never, they kind of sat there with their mouths hanging open.
56:45All of this just overwhelmed him.
56:48The guy who came on, he had just awful good.
56:52And he made all the points
56:54They did it very forcefully and very, in a sense, graciously.
57:01I mean, they ask a tough question.
57:04You've got last year's Seattle, it was a success.
57:07But what did Clinton do?
57:09They tried to get rid of the buds versus...
57:11I didn't have a...
57:13I said, fine.
57:14I said, the farmer's price is only a small part of it.
57:17What's involved there?
57:18I said, no.
57:19If the fire secretary acts about everything exactly what Secretary Blunt is doing, his job is to speak for that state.
57:28Farmers' prices have only gone up 30%, but farmers' returns have only gone up 13% or something, and their costs have gone up 200%.
57:35Do they have a problem?
57:37They've got to work on that.
57:38The food prices aren't this.
57:40We're going to be looking into these retailers and how much money they're making on all of this transportation costs.
57:50He put that one around.
57:52Good.
57:53He came labor hard.
57:55He got in the...
57:55He said...
57:57I forget how he put it, but in effect he said, well, we are going to miss you.
58:03He never dropped by anyway.
58:05He said, this is a very able man to represent.
58:07He said, I can't recall his name.
58:09I mean, he still remember it when he went in to talk to Judge Bolt about his pen race the day it was began.
58:18That's what happened.
58:20He does it in such a, you know, in a way, a nice way.
58:22He doesn't laugh.
58:23He says, we aren't going to miss him, but she wasn't around anyway.
58:26And isn't this going to cripple all of us?
58:31You know, the thing about it is he puts that goddamn knife in.
58:38Oh, yeah.
58:40And I think that's an indication of why he probably would like to be more of a person.
58:46He knows that you do.
58:48He knows I do, and he thinks probably it's a good idea.
58:50And it may be right.
58:52It may be, but the more I read this, the more I discourage the objection of a lot of people, when they go through and actually pick up on what they've become, because they're here and there, and we've had a break.
59:12But it's like the response of the one I mentioned.
59:13Oh, oh, oh.
59:14It's not that none of us, I think we've come out of the way here.
59:43The board's been, he said, now that the labor people are off the board, the board will become a lot more, a lot tougher on wage decisions.
59:50A lot of wage decisions.
59:51No, no, no, I don't think so.
59:53Then he just completely turned it 180 degrees.
59:56So he got both sides of the answer.
59:58He said, no, I don't think it will become any tougher.
1:00:01Then he switched.
1:00:02He said, you know, the criticism of the board has been that they've been too easy on wage decisions with the labor people on it.
1:00:07He said, no, I think, you know, they'll really continue to be tough.
1:00:13He kind of ignores the question and then gives the answer to the guy.
1:00:20The CEO then comes back and gives him the answer to their question also.
1:00:24So he gets his answer in first, so he makes his point.
1:00:27Then he kind of wanders back to the question so the guy can't say that you didn't answer my question.
1:00:32And he comes on with such force that he does it before the guy finishes.
1:00:38He does the technique he used all the way through.
1:00:41He never let one of them finish their question.
1:00:42He never did.
1:00:43Never.
1:00:44The guy didn't hear the end of the question.
1:00:46John didn't know what he was saying.
1:00:50And he'd ride right over it.
1:00:52And start it on his answer.
1:00:53And then he'd come on so strong and hard on the answer.
1:00:55And he wouldn't let him ask another question until he said everything he wanted to say about that and everything else.
1:01:02And then he got all done.
1:01:05It was early when I watched him in my office.
1:01:07We were all practically staring at each other.
1:01:09We were laughing so hard.
1:01:12He just...
1:01:13He said, I've been saying this for a long time, but I never really believed it.
1:01:23But he said, I actually think it's true.
1:01:27I think he's been duped, or I was conspiring.
1:01:38I said, I just kind of realized that I was going through some of the clips, the rap magazine stuff, because I want to put it together, because I think people like us want to take a look at it.
1:01:48He said, because it's now, it's starting to convince me that what I've been saying is right.
1:01:55And, speaking for Arthur Burns, that he told it, and it gives you back to the same old thing, that Arthur Burns, Colbert Rowan, Nate, Zach Samuels, and all that.
1:02:08He said it isn't just an accident, because I think it goes beyond thought.
1:02:14He said every time Arthur goes out on a trip or starts something, it's a funny thing.
1:02:22Now all of these things start to pop up all over different places at the same time.
1:02:27What I think about it is, I think it goes like a curve.
1:02:31I think it goes through the curve.
1:03:05And to get over a vehicle, because the people in the same area...
1:03:08I put it all into it, and then get it.
1:03:10I'll get it done.
1:03:12I'll get it done.
1:03:13I'm sure he gets it.
1:03:15But he's right about it.
1:03:17I don't know.
1:03:18I kind of always have, but I'm an isometric man.
1:03:28I really am.
1:03:29I'm kind of worried about it.
1:03:34I try to keep quiet.
1:03:36I'm not innocent.
1:03:39I'm preparing at the first time.
1:03:42I'm preparing.
1:03:42I'm very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very,
1:06:03I might quit my life.
1:06:04And if I do, I will have missed the opportunity to be a son-in-law.
1:06:06To do this thing.
1:06:06And I do it now, and I think the Russians want it.
1:06:08It's one of the reasons they want it.
1:06:09It's one of the reasons we do it now.
1:06:10To get them out of Egypt, and reduce their trouble in Egypt by the way.
1:06:29At very small cost to us, because God damn Israel needs to hold back their own territory.
1:06:33They should trust the Jews here, but we can't hold on to the people.
1:06:44If you can talk about it.
1:06:48If you can talk about it.
1:06:49The point that I make is that Henry is a
1:07:00You, and he thought to me, you know, try not to, try to definitely kiss what prayers you would like to say to your husband.
1:07:09I didn't try not to in the whole world.
1:07:11He did quote a prayer that he tried not to do in the world.
1:07:15Oh, oh, oh, oh.
1:07:16Oh, oh, oh, oh.
1:07:17It doesn't matter.
1:07:26It doesn't matter how long it takes you.
1:07:3120% at the outside.
1:07:32On a really good day, you get 20%.
1:08:32all the countries in the world to do it, and thereby are losing any opportunity to keep the Russians out of, or us again, the UAR and other countries representing 160 people, and also most of the oil of the world.
1:08:46It's a problem.
1:08:47It's a great tale, and it's quite a long story.
1:08:52I do, and I raise it, and I don't care about the other people's problems.
1:09:01And I'm not going to miss the opportunity in the summer to do something to reverse the situation that we've had in the last 25 years.
1:09:08We've had a great career.
1:09:09So that's where I go.
1:09:10I slept around and got a man to do it.
1:09:12No, I didn't do it for the last 25 years.
1:09:13It's the thing the Russians want, that they have to go back there.
1:09:16They just didn't put the speed on the helicopter.
1:09:31That's when they get the whole police back.
1:09:35But they've got to get the hell out of there.
1:09:37They're occupying all these characters.
1:09:39They've got to go to war, Bob.
1:09:41And God damn it, if any other country's got something to go to war, look at the hell they've put.
1:09:46Drilled us to get the hell out of Okinawa.
1:09:48And the Japanese have sunk our whole ass fleet.
1:09:51Pearl Harbor.
1:09:52Here's the Israelis.
1:09:53What the name of Christ are we talking about?
1:09:56What about the double standards?
1:09:57Isn't that funny?
1:10:02...forcing him to deal straight because he has
1:10:33It's a matter of, it's the right time to put this group on, not whether it will win.
1:10:40And he did say, all groups, the early part of 7, just we can pass whenever we can.
1:10:50That's an argument that I've always had with Mitchell.
1:10:55My argument for that is that we lose absolutely nothing if they
1:11:28I'm not going to do that.
1:12:29Very wrong.
1:12:30They never are important in any respect.
1:12:31We're dealing here with cold-blooded goddamn murderers.
1:12:35And they know they are.
1:12:36They have a great purpose.
1:12:39They will have my strong.
1:12:45But I'm not going to allow them to do it.
1:12:51But I see this Jewish back here around me.
1:12:53I'm arguing with him because he's a sin.
1:12:56He never misses out on me.
1:13:01I got down to coming here to come and play, and that's what I'm doing.
1:13:07I love the Jews.
1:13:08And Len Garland.
1:13:09And everyone that sees me in this space is always crazy.
1:13:13They always drag me.
1:13:15They're Jewish.
1:13:15A lot of it's real.
1:13:16They're probably under, I'm sure they are, under enormous pressure from the Jews.
1:13:23Especially when they work on all their people who are, you know, Max is, he doesn't understand it, but he's a professional Jew.
1:13:30He's there for that purpose.
1:13:32They sure dropped that one.
1:14:03But it doesn't show.
1:14:06You know that.
1:14:10It sure doesn't show.
1:14:17Oh, let me ask you a couple of other things.
1:14:21What about the network play?
1:14:24I know they all reuse the tape over.
1:14:29They all use the tape over.
1:14:32AB left, AB D left, but the other C left, but they've been only used one minute and 20 seconds of your day.
1:14:37The other two, one of these two minutes, the other two minutes and 10 seconds, so I guess we're just a little bit out of line.
1:14:46Pretty much all of them, though.
1:14:47Any of them, two minutes, we're pretty close to all of them, but that's just...
1:14:52Very down to your point, though, then.
1:14:55That's the other limit, and that was the damn book.
1:14:59Ron even was saying on this, Ron, you didn't read my book, but Ron was saying, no, the book wouldn't happen.
1:15:08I said, why take the chance?
1:15:09Well, as a matter of fact, they used the best part of it, though.
1:15:13Yes, he did, yeah.
1:15:15They only used 120, and they did use postmarking, but that's one where it runs, right?
1:15:21It was hard to market, but that was too big an issue.
1:15:24Taking on George TV is a thing that's paying hard for the other to cut.
1:15:30Yeah, yeah.
1:15:32But they did.
1:15:34You can sell ABCs a little bit, but the other two are new.
1:15:39I want to know if you just do an 87 word, and I probably talk two minutes.
1:15:46Two minutes and a quarter.
1:15:46Two minutes.
1:15:48Maybe two minutes and a half.
1:15:51A little bit.
1:15:53In fact, you see, you take out all your stuff that you want, and the powder didn't come off.
1:15:59Did you see it?
1:16:01Yeah, and it came off very well.
1:16:03In fact, it was red and all the good butter came off.
1:16:07There was no kind of adversity at all.
1:16:09Everybody was very excited.
1:16:12It was very effective.
1:17:17I love it, I'll take it.
1:17:21It is neat.
1:17:22Now that's the other side of the whole argument of people that are against comedy.
1:17:31It comes up so hard and it scares you.
1:17:47Because he is basically a very strong man.
1:17:52And he is a little scary.
1:17:57Because his judgment is very subject.
1:18:02His judgment is erratic.
1:18:03Except that John can be reasonable.
1:18:06That's the other thing.
1:18:07And he can change his mind.
1:18:09It's a difficult thing.
1:18:10But he's a damn poor man to have around.
1:18:14That's what I'm talking about.
1:18:17I'm glad we had him do this, and I'd like to do the golf program and get him on the road again.
1:18:25He's so absorbed, well, he hasn't said he wants to, but then he's so absorbed that he never gets quite out to do it.
1:18:37Oh, I've decided I'm going to reserve him.
1:18:41Why don't you just...
1:18:45I'm not going to argue after that.
1:18:47It's hard for coming in alone that I cannot come in.
1:19:00Arthur Schultz confirmed to me he did come into a pretty beautiful
1:19:17He said, follow the paper process, do it all for the talent and all that, but he said, before you make the decision, I'd like you to have an opportunity to make an oral argument.
1:19:29He said, of course, that's the thing.
1:19:33But, well, I've changed my mind.
1:19:35Well, this one is, you're not even allowed to try to make an oral argument.
1:19:39Just say that several people want to make an oral argument.
1:19:41But he, George said, the way Burns put it to you was he wanted to make the decision
1:19:48He started to say, absolutely not, because you would make the decision that you were instructing Malik to make up a list of candidates based on Arthur's recommendations, Conley's, Seltzer's, and others.
1:19:58And then those would be refined down.
1:20:00And I said, I could find out as far as putting them on the end, and it would be totally intolerable to break up before everything that is in mind.
1:20:09And he said that the final list that Malik and Merriman had to do was to be reviewed by Arthur, and by any other before it was submitted to you.
1:20:17And that part, this is exactly how I had it.
1:20:19But then the one more step, George does confirm, did happen.
1:20:21I would then say, he liked the opportunity to make more of it.
1:20:25And the price of the price, I guess, and the price of the lovers.
1:20:28I'm not saying I could have won.
1:20:31No, he had been slamming.
1:20:33Cricket.
1:20:35You agree?
1:20:35Sure.
1:20:35I think he always said that.
1:20:44Good old comments.
1:20:46I think he loves to go on and on.
1:20:50He sure seems like it today.
1:20:53He has, he doesn't like it.
1:20:55He does it, if you have a thing, it looks like it does.
1:21:02He likes it.
1:21:03He was part of it last night.
1:21:08All the objections are very good in front of him.
1:21:10The houseguys, he mentioned it in his reference last night.
1:22:18It can hold, but it can't hold that, it will hold that.
1:22:20They're not even going to start pushing it somehow.
1:22:27They'll start pushing it.
1:22:29Oh, so there's nothing more for 96 times.
1:22:34Yeah, when I talk about the media, they're going to go by on all three networks.
1:22:43There's three or four of them.
1:22:45There's the RO scandal around the country.
1:24:19What I was waiting for was the benefit of the record that we got to make there.
1:24:28Crack the drug thing once.
1:24:34Crack the price thing once.
1:24:41That's what we do.
1:24:45We have to do what we do.
1:24:47Morality.
1:25:20Finding it our way to get it steamed up.
1:25:21You've got to remember, you can't paint it.
1:25:22You've heard of that show.
1:25:23All the time, yeah.
1:25:24It's how you do it.
1:25:24You were president.
1:25:24You walked yesterday.
1:25:25You did it presidentially.
1:25:26I'm thinking of you.
1:25:26I used to play a colorful one.
1:25:27You walked off the job.
1:26:47I don't care what his views are.
1:26:51I'm going to call him.
1:27:13Ron had a reaction to our thought about a precedent for the China hands.
1:27:47He was concerned about trying to expand it so the kitchen cabinet is not too bad, but the Moscow, the kitchen cabinet might be a problem, the Moscow thing, yeah.
1:28:08Probably is, and it may be just better to play it just in the new generation process.
1:28:14I agree.
1:28:14We can talk, try to complicate it.
1:28:16Otherwise, they do it that way.
1:28:18It's a selection process.
1:28:19You do it fine.
1:28:20I just think it should be a China group, and not their wife.
1:28:24Right.
1:28:25Right?
1:28:26Yes.
1:28:26That meant for a pop-up.
1:28:29Somebody in work.
1:28:35Okay.
1:28:38I think there are people
1:30:36And I didn't want to pay for it.
1:30:40I said you wouldn't do anything for me.
1:30:43You don't think we should try for three in the next period?
1:30:49You can't?
1:30:50I'm asking, but I wouldn't.
1:30:53Especially if you do, which I think would be a good idea, because it's destructive.
1:30:59If you do a fireside talk on drugs, I wouldn't do it.
1:31:03I wouldn't do it.
1:31:05Or as I talk, time to time.
1:31:06Yeah.
1:31:067.30.
1:31:06Oh, 7.30.
1:31:06Or Sunday evening.
1:31:06Sunday evening.
1:31:07Sunday evening.
1:31:07Depends on what they work out.
1:31:08What do they do?
1:31:09I think we do.
1:31:09They think we do, and I think we do.
1:31:10And they've got an interesting given.
1:31:12We've got to do it.
1:31:32Their drug writing is pretty sad now.
1:31:35We'll get to something as soon as they're done writing.
1:31:37What they've got is a new gimmick.
1:31:39He gives it a news quiz, which is a national telephone number.
1:31:42People are called to report it.
1:31:45There's one number for all over the country.
1:31:49It says he's got a 411 or something.
1:31:51Well, if he'd make it very real, I'd give it that, yeah.
1:31:56Now could I ask for also an encouraging factor?
1:33:01Basically, the trips to the country more.
1:33:04I would turn on a new one every month.
1:33:05In June.
1:33:06In mid-June, yeah.
1:33:06What will we send to your company?
1:33:07Uh-huh.
1:33:08I don't want to do one right now.
1:33:10We are going to do one.
1:33:11Then the Democratic Convention comes, right?
1:33:14You don't want to do one right before us?
1:33:16No.
1:33:16You don't want to do one during us?
1:33:29And we can't allow
1:33:58Ourself, putting our acts, that's why we want to vacation while they're in their convention, they're going to get quite anyways.
1:34:04Give them the whole thing then, and really vacation them out, so that, and then don't, then on, don't want to vacation them.
1:34:13Then on, you're really from mid-July through November, you just got to roll with these big couple days, and then you just have to roll over, and then you have to get out.
1:34:22You can't really get anyone out.
1:34:28Well, as a matter of fact, it still takes a good week off after the Capitol Republic convention, Governor, and call it a landing.
1:34:35Yeah, that's right.
1:34:36But we ought to go pretty hard in that five weeks between the two conventions.
1:34:40That's the point.
1:34:41That's the point.
1:34:42And it may be more important to go before the Democratic convention.
1:34:47Yeah, no, I go before the Democratic convention, too.
1:34:51I mean, building on the Russian thing.
1:34:58It's a sensitive problem, as I told you, Bob.
1:35:01I don't want to beat this to death.
1:35:03I do a very sensitive problem with Henry.
1:35:06I'm not good at the Jewish thing.
1:35:09And also, also, the network.
1:35:12Now, I simply say, well, can you make it a better deal?
1:35:18Call this business a good deal.
1:35:22And we're playing a hard line because, frankly,
1:35:53Dallas, so forth and so on.
1:35:54We do do all of these.
1:35:55We want to schedule it.
1:35:58What dates can you give us in your calendar?
1:36:00We've already done that.
1:36:01We work with this office.
1:36:02We're going to make sure your calendar is going to be sent out there.
1:36:05And you're going to do TV out there.
1:36:07Right out there in each of these places.
1:36:09We're going to arrange for you to be able to do the best TV talk shows.
1:36:15And Charlie's going to do them in Texas.
1:36:17He's probably going to sponsor these things.
1:36:23I have a couple.
1:36:25Rather than using your organization, I think in most cases it's better not to use our organization.
1:36:29It's better to put our own group together.
1:36:31Yeah.
1:36:32And he wants to do it twice.
1:36:33He wants to do one in Houston and one in Dallas.
1:36:35Great.
1:36:35Do you think it's a good idea?
1:36:37One at lunch and one at dinner on the same day.
1:36:38I think it's a good idea.
1:36:39Do you like the idea that he's doing it?
1:36:45I put it to him on the basis of his advice on how it ought to be done.
1:36:48Yeah.
1:36:49And I think obviously he's got to do it.
1:36:53That's a good thing for him.
1:36:54That makes him look good down home.
1:36:55You know, he runs around the country and puts his show on.
1:36:58He drops it in the Star Act.
1:37:02You know, it's not that mean.
1:37:06It's great.
1:37:08It's great.
1:37:09It's great.
1:37:10The way Hamilton got him off the college was nice.
1:37:16He said, we're going to put him on the show.
1:37:20A bigger audience was going to read from college when we found him.
1:37:24And, rather than doing this one shot of C.P.
1:37:26yesterday, and get out of there tonight, but to be competing against the movie, I put all that out there, competing against the movie, but I'm sure there's a small audience, and there's a lot of people behind this.
1:37:41Well, I'm glad that you'll say, oh no, Michael, that's not true.
1:37:43When the president went on, he didn't get away with it.
1:37:44He went on one network and had a bad time.
1:37:45Right.
1:37:45Even when you go on one network and have a good time, you get a mediocre audience.
1:37:47Right.
1:37:48Because people are doing the other things.
1:37:49Right.
1:37:49You'll feel like you're raising yourself to help us.
1:39:41I wouldn't defend him.
1:39:42He has a pregnant job.
1:39:42I wouldn't defend him because he hasn't done any good things.
1:39:45I let other people know.
1:39:46I just said...
1:39:47I said that...
1:40:36Thank you for watching!

Nixon & Haldeman on Pay Board and George Meany

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Also recorded on March 24, 1972

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