{"conversationCode":"338-025","tapeNumber":338,"conversationNumber":25,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-338-025","startDateTime":"1972-05-09T16:09:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1972-05-09T16:13:00.000Z","startDate":"9-May-1972","startTime":"12:09 PM","endDate":"9-May-1972","endTime":"12:13 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"estimated","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Rockefeller, Nelson A.;","description":"On May 9, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and Nelson A. Rockefeller met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at an unknown time between 12:09 pm and 12:13 pm. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 338-025 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"EOB","recordingDevice":"Old Executive Office Building","latitudeEstimated":38.897567,"longitudeEstimated":-77.039147,"chronCode":3,"chronRelease":"Third Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"28-Feb-2002","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 338-25\n\nDate: May 9, 1972\nTime: Between 12:09 and 12:13 pm\nLocation: Executive Office Building\n\nThe President talked with Nelson A. Rockefeller.\n\n[See Conversation No. 24-54]","filename":["338a.mp3","338b.mp3"],"tapeStart":"00:53:27","tapeEnd":"00:58:21","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Rockefeller, Nelson A."],"prevCode":"338-024","nextCode":"338-026","tapeTranscriptFile":"338a.mp3,338b.mp3","transcript":[{"start":3190.35,"end":3192.67,"text":"I guess I wanted to make a little apology."},{"start":3192.73,"end":3199.53,"text":"You know, when I talked to you Sunday, I didn't know about that goddamn letter, and I have raged hell around here."},{"start":3199.59,"end":3212.3,"text":"Well, you see, what happened is that we had a forum, and apparently the letters and all that sort of thing were presented, but not certainly for the purpose of publication."},{"start":3212.38,"end":3215.42,"text":"And I just raged hell, and I may have told God."},{"start":3216.31,"end":3229.26,"text":"It'll never happen, it'll never happen, and I'm just sorry to embarrass you, but I, frankly, maybe it'll help me a little bit, but as you know, I just don't want to, I didn't want to put me in a position of being against you on something."},{"start":3229.28,"end":3236.78,"text":"It'd just burn my ass, believe me."},{"start":3238.28,"end":3238.52,"text":"Well,"},{"start":3244.61,"end":3244.87,"text":"Sure, sure."},{"start":3244.89,"end":3246.07,"text":"Well, it was one of those things."},{"start":3246.09,"end":3250.26,"text":"I was writing my speech at that time, and I just didn't have any idea what was going on."},{"start":3253.86,"end":3259.01,"text":"Well, I tell you, you've been a great support of some of this, and we've done the right thing."},{"start":3259.05,"end":3262.41,"text":"What did you put a statement out?"},{"start":3262.43,"end":3262.61,"text":"Oh, good."},{"start":3262.69,"end":3265.05,"text":"I'm going to get them at noon, so I'll be treating them all, so..."},{"start":3270.76,"end":3272.78,"text":"I think we can..."},{"start":3298.89,"end":3309.7,"text":"But if they cancel the summit, we're going to say, well, don't you think we just say, well, because I think you would agree I couldn't possibly go to Moscow with Russian pants rumbling around through the streets of the UAE."},{"start":3309.78,"end":3310.4,"text":"Yeah, that's right."},{"start":3311.4,"end":3327.15,"text":"We don't take too much heat from what they call the witnessing liberals in there."},{"start":3332,"end":3334.8,"text":"Well, I appreciate your, but I must say I was so embarrassed when I came in."},{"start":3334.82,"end":3340.02,"text":"See, I didn't know, but as a matter of fact, I got in the next morning and I picked up, I had to see the paper."},{"start":3340.04,"end":3350.93,"text":"I picked up the paper and I thought, what in the name of God is this?"},{"start":3351.15,"end":3352.43,"text":"And I didn't really know what to see."},{"start":3352.51,"end":3356.65,"text":"And when you talked to me about it, I didn't know what it was about."},{"start":3356.67,"end":3357.21,"text":"Unbelievable."},{"start":3360.01,"end":3365.18,"text":"You see, but I, over the weekend, of course, I was writing a speech."},{"start":3365.22,"end":3366.4,"text":"I did it myself."},{"start":3367.14,"end":3369.78,"text":"It's going to take so much energy."},{"start":3371.24,"end":3381.19,"text":"But anyway, you can be sure, if you would just be sure that all of our viewers and my friends know that this was just a damn coup."},{"start":3386.21,"end":3386.77,"text":"We're looking."},{"start":3387.29,"end":3387.93,"text":"We're looking around."},{"start":3388.15,"end":3389.31,"text":"I'm trying to find the culprit."},{"start":3390.26,"end":3391.54,"text":"Okay, thank you."},{"start":3482.45,"end":3484.25,"text":"Sit with me, please."},{"start":3484.29,"end":3488.38,"text":"Sit with me."}],"transcriptBoundary":{"start":3178.375,"end":3488.375,"startMethod":"silence","endMethod":"silence"},"transcriptConfidence":"high","transcriptSource":"bigtape","aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon met with Nelson Rockefeller to apologize for an unauthorized letter that caused public embarrassment for the New York Governor. Nixon distanced himself from the leak, labeling it a \"coup\" and vowing to identify the culprit within his administration. Additionally, the two discussed the geopolitical implications of the upcoming Moscow summit in the context of ongoing international tensions.","topics":["White House leaks","Political strategy","Moscow summit","Nelson Rockefeller","Administration internal affairs"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T15:59:55.787Z"},"topicSlugs":["white-house-leaks","political-strategy","moscow-summit","nelson-rockefeller","administration-internal-affairs"],"audioDurationSec":294,"audioFiles":[{"file":"338a.mp3","bytes":116742589,"durationSec":7313.26,"bitrate":127705,"missing":false},{"file":"338b.mp3","bytes":100655368,"durationSec":6305.43,"bitrate":127706,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":true,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:41.909Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/338a.mp3","https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/338b.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/338-025","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/338/conversation-338-025","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}