On May 9, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon, Henry A. Kissinger, Alexander M. Haig, Jr., and Adm. Thomas H. Moorer met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building from 12:37 pm to 1:12 pm. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 338-031 of the White House Tapes.
Transcript (AI-Generated)This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.
Ron said you did a great job.
I was talking to Reagan.
Ron said that I won't bother you too much.
It's just more important that you spend your time here.
Reagan said you'll find a job.
I called Ron because it was difficult.
because, you know, he was so glad about it.
Well, I told him, I said, I don't know about the goddamn letters, the form letter that they saw on the car loan.
Then the car loan put him off.
Anyway, he understood me.
I said, I'm going to fire somebody as a result.
He's put out a statement.
I didn't know me.
What did Reagan say?
Oh, he said, it's your finest hour.
He said he's dropping everything.
He said he's going to get on the telephone with
I got a little lair.
I told him that he should not go.
He should be available to go on tomorrow.
I don't think we can have Rogers gone.
I think the lair is the one to go on.
Peter Cutto.
Roger just doesn't have enough fire experience.
It's not just what he says.
He's so goddamn worried about the Foreign Relations Committee.
I want to hide it.
Laird can get out there.
Now, Laird's lined up now.
You know what I mean?
He knows.
Laird is a patriot.
Once you're committed, and Laird is a tough guy, you don't have to worry.
Once you've got him put in, he's like a corner draftant.
How do you feel about that?
I haven't talked to you in 10 years.
My oldest got out first.
I had this, I must say, depressed.
I was about an hour first.
I put out the whole record about changes.
And I said it took us months to set it up.
Yeah.
And then all we got when we got there.
So, and then, but, you know, they were happy.
But if I compare this to Cambodia, they were very respectful.
They were solemn.
Extremely respectful, didn't you think?
I thought so.
I thought so.
And I kicked his old gates around a little bit, but in a nice way.
I said the bouquets were looking at him.
They climbed it.
They didn't climb it, but they gave him those internals.
And he used it, and they had the responsibility for that, sir.
And I spoke eloquently about what all the things we wanted to do was reported on to the state.
I said it was your finest hour.
I can't believe it.
I love you.
But you wouldn't have brought it up.
That's the last reason you can do even single-duty.
It's because we have a summit coming up in the Soviet, and we have a summit behind us in the Chinese.
We'll say ceasefire, POW, and we'll get out in four months.
Now, what in the name of Christ more can you offer?
That's what I said.
What makes you think they'll accept it?
I said, if we only do things they'll accept, we're not saying it's acceptable, we're saying it's just and fair.
Listen, I just have to ride harder on this thing.
Of course, tomorrow, Danville is supporting my upgrade, and I'm going to all succeed quietly.
But they're wrong.
They're wrong.
And Danville, my support, can't even keep a missile in crisis right now.
It's a big loss to California.
I should thank God.
The main thing is we're going to keep this on until it works.
and that's one of the most important battlefields we've got today.
Maybe the attacks are building very heavily around the country, and more heavily, the fighting's the other way.
They lost the fire base that they had a number of attacks.
You know what's happening in the state of those threats?
Oh, yeah.
or who, hey, I don't think is there yet in the full scale of attack on.
And we've got a cable.
Are our guys fighting now, or are they out there?
They're doing spoiling attacks.
And some of the agents yesterday were spoiling attacks, which we did very well.
I think also this is going to get this out.
He's a great shot in the arm.
Bunker, I spoke with you this morning, so we now have to say that he's moving on.
Uh, the first airport, two brigades of the first airport division.
They'll be out there by Monday, if it's good, to that cable.
And the regiment of the second division is in there now, so that we may have a way for them to get quite strong.
The guys are fighting, I think.
Khantoum, I think, they'll lose.
But on the other hand, it's about May 9th.
If it takes them two weeks,
From there, it will take us three weeks to get down to Claypool.
By that time, it's been eight weeks.
And come Tuesday, that's all we do.
It's before.
One thing, Al, I'm sort of a mother.
Why don't you have one of those little boys over there to prepare a note of apology or a message of thanking you for the speech you made?
I don't know.
I heard you made a nice speech.
Anybody who supports us on this issue, give them a little message of your career on that.
I'd rather see it not passed.
I'd rather not see it defeated.
Because then they feel they've lost everything.
But the best solution would be one in which they eat out all of their passengers' dreams.
On the other side, I want you to get out of the room.
I want you to share it with them now.
I'm not thinking about specific actions so much as the fact that we'll get another hit now.
that public support glitches would be a horror.
And they did quite a job putting those mines in their crypt in all kinds of ways.
Well, they had this box.
They had two hours prep before they put the mines in, and they worked over the whole field and all kinds of times on here.
Well, you know, to get that BOL down, if they had four months supply, they'll be down in two days.
That is true, because we've taken out much of the annoying BOL we have currently.
We did it not again yesterday or two days ago with smoke 10,000 feet high.
We did a small BOL storage yesterday, and they can't.
There's a noise streaming.
There's a noise streaming.
No, I didn't hear that from Obama.
Oh, I just think this is an old, unreasonable shift.
I was pleading all over the press about unreasonableness.
They said I was going to negotiate.
I said there's competition.
We'll never be broken on our side.
We said we could pursue it.
I'm glad I put it out of the sentence.
We will continue to pursue it.
He said we could ask more of the president, more of the president.
I said, no president, no president of the United States will accept him.
And I think I made months ago, they can't last.
They can't last in the South unless they win.
If they don't win in the next month, Mr. President, they are going to crack in the South.
They can't.
Don't listen to them.
Be all right.
Don't you think?
Now, in the ninth year of the war,
They thought they had us on their arms.
Now they get the newest bomb to smithereens.
They get their fourth block.
Just run too quickly over it.
Sort of take it over from average people.
Mr. President, I demand that you bring this off as I think now as well.
Do you have a chance to political structure the country?
knowing that Shakespeare read the press in France, which said that the Soviet Union cannot underestimate the American leadership.
This is the most decisive president of the United States at the same time.
And the dangers of their misreading of the determination would not be underestimated.
Mr. President, if you had not, if you had gone to Moscow... No way.
...having done nothing, now you can go if they still have you.
Yes, yes.
Don't kill me.
Stay there.
Sorry.
Either way.
If you go now, it's almost easy.
If this trip still comes along...
When you're there, that's that.
That's that.
Well, you can correct those to the length of your time.
Dr. Rockefeller told me he tried to call last night, and the good boy was absolutely mad.
That's the formal request from Harvard to resign here on Earth.
Oh, I understand.
Right.
You were still awake.
I hope you were.
I hope I was.
You know, I don't have to tell you.
That's what they do.
That's what they do.
That's what they do.
That's what they do.
That's what they do.
That's what they do.
But there are two problems, Mr. Rogers, Mr. President.
One is what he says, the content of what he says, which is usually cowardly.
But secondly, the way he says it is so offensive that no one feels.
Well, he looks scared.
That's the thing I thought.
What did you think, Al?
Well, I got desperate.
Thank God Mr. Ware jumped in.
He just told me, and I discussed it.
And he took hope right on.
You can say some things to yourself if you act them.
Well, that's what I do.
That's what you do.
We have to talk to the daughter.
I was talking to Gino.
And also, there was no question we would talk.
And I think we delivered the speech.
But what's best of all the speech is just that
Well, they were both rather different.
The picture was a little better.
They told me my wife was better.
The picture was actually a little better.
It was a little better.
The picture was actually a little better.
This one.
He really had a great deal on his shoulders.
He's proud of you.
That's the best decision he's ever seen.
He's raving all over the place.
Were you able to get any of that in your comments about your colleagues, the boots, and all the other assets that would make Dre a bully?
Hardly.
Disinterested.
No one had more stake in all these things than the president.
I went to the law firm.
He put two and a half years in only the greatest consideration.
He put everything up to the best of the country.
Oh, I...
The fact that he was drawing half a million
and everything to the law for peace, privacy, and comfort, that we have not asked for wrong, and that they answer your justification, and demand, and all demand, and affect, and surrender, or else, what else can we do?
By God, we just turn, and we turn now, and what we are going to do, we're going to do.
Oh, but he calls last night.
He said, already last night, he said, he's proud of you.
You've got to see his speech.
He never did it.
And this morning, you thought what it is.
He grabbed my hand and he said, congratulations.
He said, the president has done well.
Oh.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
Well, basically, let me say this.
I was reflecting last night.
You know, it's really lost here.
It's an old-fashioned word.
It's the honor of another person.
And it's the future of the free world.
It's all wrong.
We don't, if we don't hold this on, let's face it,
How can they screw this around?
That's right.
The power plants are psychological.
I think it ought to be done sometime this week.
I just want to black the place out.
Then, you know, that will, if you agree, have a psychological impact.
But otherwise, don't go after the secondary part of it.
It's PORL and the rail line and downtown.
And if it doesn't cut through, or at least downtown takes over, that's...
That's how these air wars have usually been lost.
If the Germans had kept after one target system in 1940, they would have won it against Britain.
But they had the southern airfields nearly knocked out, but they switched to London.
I left one thing out in this thing that I think is terribly important.
I put it in my mind.
The airfields have got to be taken out.
That's on the list.
That's on the list.
Now, the civilian airfields... You don't want to take that out?
Not yet, because they've got red-throated flashes.
All right.
Well, other airfields also, just like Scottham, if you're serious, if you want to use that force, can we knock out those dead airfields?
I mean, I know of only for a few days, but that isn't a problem.
Well, here they are.
They're very controlled.
Loads of airfields.
Well, I just wanted to tell you that now we depend on you to see that we don't blow this one.
And now, and particularly zero-end, zero-end, don't blow these secondary targets.
We've done it with the rail lines, we've done it with the POL, and the secondary place, of course, the power plants and the airfields.
but there's no lack of excuse now because you have what the military has claimed has never happened before.
You've got the authority to do it.
I got a call last night.
Well, thank you, and just stand up if you do any good with this dentist.
Here, we'll get some of that.
See, we need the Swedish dentist.
All right, now.
Carry on.
We've got the word now that the fight isn't due now.
You, you need more of the public.
I mean, of course, you watch these things, but you know what I mean?
We're going to have to re-wear you the bones, because I just haven't got confidence in anybody else.
To the extent you can, you knock the birds out.
And I don't know what the reason is.
Well, I don't know what I mean.
Let's see.
I just...
I just...
I know you want to get involved and so forth.
What in the hell would you do?
I don't know how to get involved.
He's doing what some captains deserve to know.
That is...
Yeah, he'll talk to her if we're not going to do it.
Now, this is not about the, uh, the opposite of, uh, my disarm, but we can also disarm it.
Uh, not quite.
This isn't true, is it?
No, it's not.
Well, it's true or not, but we're all going to get rid of it.
This will propose death.
Uh, but, uh, well, anyway, that's what it did to the sub-captain.
It can't, I mean, that's going to be precept and harm.
Well, to me, it's, they can't go back and do these, uh, stuff like this.
I'm thinking of people like the Dick Wilsons and the Bill Wrights and the naturally
and you can never get over it with all that jewelry on it.
I said, yes, I did.
I wrote it.
He said, you'll get a number of good colors out of it.
Kind of a wearing week for me.
See what you did.
I thought you fused it.
the guys because you answered all the questions before and you had a chance.
Let her go on there.
I was going to say that I agree with you on what you did.
I'm not going to give you time, but I'd like to go on a version of whatever happened when you drove.
They canceled the summit before then.
That's all right.
It's a good reason to go out there with my wife.
If they don't cancel the summit, I'll go there.
That gives a sense.
That gives a sense.
I mean, because I'll have to be ready to go to bat in the next couple weeks myself, you know.
And I just, you know, you need to, because this takes to be a little more out of me than almost anybody except for you.
Well, then I don't have, you have to go through the actual concentration of getting out for air.
And you've got these media instruments out for air.
You've got to play all of these characters.
I think you should go because you have some time weeks ahead.
And the best resource is to reach you by telephone in 30 minutes.
So you probably have to react in a day or two.
And my gentleman there doesn't cancel the summit in 30 minutes.
That was last week.
They canceled, like they say.
They really don't care.
They do everything.
You know, I mean, .
They may just do it in Moscow or something.
And I may not say so, but I'm not going to go on and do the same thing about the fact that I think you should.
I mean, that's very good.
You should just probably cut a statement that it may be good for us to just leave it.
That's better.
That's better.
You shouldn't.
So what does the statement say?
That the State Assembly is going to do what the problem is, and we're prepared to do it.
They had me kicked.
They're right.
They're right.
I think it's a good thing that they postponed it in temperate terms and did nothing about the court.
I think in a way, it would be terribly upsetting.
See, the one advantage of doing it before the summit is that they cannot punish us by casting the summit.
They do nothing else.
I agree with Connie.
If you win this Congress, we're going to know it.
The summit doesn't make any difference.
And then you'll get the summit anyway.
Well, there ain't no reason for them.
The other thing is that if we win the contest, and I pardon the song that he lost, we can save this damn country from a hell of an abacus.
One other thing I think we have to consider, if there is a collapse of the South, which may not now occur, but if there is, don't we have to consider the land of the North?
I would advise the Marines to have them maneuver off the coast of North Vietnam.
That's what I would do, because the North Vietnamese don't believe a word you say anymore anyhow.
So if you have them run around there, they will think you're landing in Vietnam.
Particularly after what we've done now.
They just figured you can't go to the sea there.
And I offload them on ships, run them around the ship, do exercises.
But they're now planning a different commando operation in where it actually may do some more good things.
They're trying a helicopter operation behind the North.
We can fly in a couple of days.
The other way, which would be if they bring it on the other thing.
But also, if we last the next month, I think, I would not be surprised if we saw it the last of some people.
We can be sure of that.
Well, they can't just keep it up, can they?
No, they can't.
Akron's had 45 B-52s, but his military is the least of them.
He's now doing what you asked him to do.
It's really boring, isn't it?
I think he's shooting at his technical aircraft.
He's shooting at his tactical aircraft.
Stay shut.
I just don't see how they can take that attention.
Do you?
Well, it's like the great artillery compartments of World War I and II.
He's going to drive men out of their minds.
Three years ago, he was just able to see.
We had to give him a target two days before.
Now he's the bird in the light.
30 hours more.
Is he?
He's got 32.
He's who you feel better about.
So I think, you know, I was a detractor of a...
Now, since the last week, it seems to me, by the way, I've caught on to a bunch of these other ones about the command structure.
Is that working out now?
Just afternoon.
Mac is going.
Mac is there.
I'm about to look it up.
It should have been done this afternoon.
All right.
It's working.
Should it be time to go?
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
No, because he said he asked me to run the issue over for him.
Do you have a car with you over here?
Oh, we showed a very nice rally.