{"conversationCode":"385-010","tapeNumber":385,"conversationNumber":10,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-385-010","startDateTime":"1972-12-11T21:59:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1972-12-11T22:01:00.000Z","startDate":"11-Dec-1972","startTime":"4:59 PM","endDate":"11-Dec-1972","endTime":"5:01 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Ziegler, Ronald L.;","description":"On December 11, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and Ronald L. Ziegler met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building from 4:59 pm to 5:01 pm. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 385-010 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"EOB","recordingDevice":"Old Executive Office Building","latitudeEstimated":38.897567,"longitudeEstimated":-77.039147,"chronCode":"5.2","chronRelease":"Fifth Chronological Release: Part II","chronReleaseDate":"2-Dec-2008","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 385-10\n\nDate: December 11, 1972\nTime: 4:59 pm - 5:01 pm\nLocation: Executive Office Building\n\nThe President talked with Ronald L. Ziegler.\n\n[See Conversation No. 34-42]\n\f                                             -14-\n\n                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM","filename":["385-010.mp3"],"tapeStart":"","tapeEnd":"","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Ziegler, Ronald L."],"prevCode":"385-009","nextCode":"385-011","transcript":[{"start":0.39,"end":13.79,"text":"You got anything new in your briefs today?"},{"start":13.81,"end":13.91,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":13.93,"end":14.31,"text":"The Michelle thing."},{"start":89.99,"end":91.48,"text":"I'm not gonna tell you."},{"start":161.78,"end":173.7,"text":"Okay, I'm gonna stop."},{"start":173.72,"end":173.82,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":173.84,"end":174.2,"text":"Just say I got it."},{"start":196.64,"end":219.9,"text":"Don't put that out because we don't know how it's going to work out."},{"start":219.91,"end":220.03,"text":"Right."},{"start":220.06,"end":220.42,"text":"Yeah, that's that."},{"start":220.44,"end":221.3,"text":"Yeah, we don't know what's going to happen."},{"start":221.32,"end":223.16,"text":"I could look back off as well and say that I don't know whether it really worked out or not."},{"start":223.18,"end":223.28,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":223.3,"end":224.74,"text":"You get somebody to open the cover, cover that it locks properly or not."},{"start":230.53,"end":244.81,"text":"I told you now that I want you to get to the top, so that it's never erased."},{"start":244.83,"end":245.51,"text":"I don't want you to know about it."},{"start":245.53,"end":247.35,"text":"Nobody from the Washington Post is ever going to be in that house when I get to the center."},{"start":247.37,"end":249.62,"text":"I just work out the rules, the rules, and the rules, and the rules, and the rules, and the rules, and the rules."},{"start":287.29,"end":313.59,"text":"Thank you."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and Press Secretary Ronald L. Ziegler held a brief meeting to discuss the handling of sensitive, undisclosed information referred to as the \"Michelle thing.\" Nixon explicitly instructed Ziegler to maintain confidentiality and ensure the matter remained unpublicized until the outcome was certain. Additionally, Nixon emphasized the need for strict security regarding the documentation of these proceedings, insisting that the records be preserved and kept out of the reach of the press.","topics":["White House communications","Press relations","Information security","Confidentiality","Record keeping"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T17:46:22.946Z"},"topicSlugs":["white-house-communications","press-relations","information-security","confidentiality","record-keeping"],"audioDurationSec":318,"audioFiles":[{"file":"385-010.mp3","bytes":7642356,"durationSec":318.29,"bitrate":192083,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:45.438Z","findingAidSource":"nixonlibrary.gov subject log (2024-05), reslice-v2","findingAidUpdatedAt":"2026-09-18T08:43:31.032Z","transcriptGapSeconds":50,"transcriptGapShare":0.16,"transcriptQuality":"incomplete","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/385-010.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/385-010","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/385/conversation-385-010","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}