On June 6, 1973, White House operator, President Richard M. Nixon, and Alexander M. Haig, Jr. talked on the telephone from 3:48 pm to 3:59 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 039-112 of the White House Tapes.
Transcript (AI-Generated)This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.
General Haig, sir.
Hello, Mr. President?
What about the South Vietnamese?
Do you want me to over there at some time to see him, or what's the score on that?
South Vietnamese... Hello?
Hello, Mr. President.
Sorry.
Sorry.
What about the South Vietnamese ambassador?
Do you want me over there at some time to see him?
I'm still waiting for Henry's message, sir.
It just has not come through.
Oh, fine.
Okay.
I think we can do this...
first thing in the morning.
I'm not sure.
Anytime you like, and we can do it later.
Whatever you like.
All right, sir.
Now, we've got a couple of—we had a very funny call here from Joe Califano.
And he said that Vance and McBundy and everyone was all upset about this TAP information that was put out.
So I said, Joe, I think it would be well if I sent over to you.
the transcript of what Scott said, because it was based on a report from the Attorney General, based on a careful survey, which is proceeding.
Good.
In other words, you let him worry, huh?
You bet I did.
And they are worried.
They all claim it's untrue.
He said, Califano said it's untrue?
He said that Bundy says it never happened when he was in the White House, and that
McNamara's upset about it and he said it never happened under his watch.
What do you think did happen?
I think Bobby did it and maybe didn't tell them.
Yeah, that's very possible.
It's very possible.
Nevertheless, we know what happened, don't we Al?
I try to believe what they tell us.
Yeah, I try.
It's in the memo.
I try.
That's good.
I knew we'd get to them.
Even though we didn't get in the press, we got to them, huh?
That's right.
Well, there's a double take going on on this.
Is there really?
Yes.
Good.
Our time is quite concerned about it.
Well, you know, the other thing, too, is we just look these names over.
We may want to put something out.
Who knows?
We may not, but we'll see.
It's best to keep them on edge.
Keep them on edge.
Let them worry more than anything else if they think everything's out.
Right.
That's right.
Okay.
If there's another problem, sir...
There's no way we can change the bipartisan meeting because you have to leave it early.
We could either cancel it or go ahead with it.
I think we probably ought to go ahead with it.
Recognize we won't have it in this package.
Well, why don't we do this?
Why don't we just put it off until next Tuesday?
Yeah.
Tell them because of this we'll put it off Tuesday and then let, frankly, let Henry brief them on the darn thing afterwards.
See what I mean?
Okay, sir.
I really think we'd better.
It's too thin a grill.
It is awful thin.
So let's do it, Al.
All right, sir.
Now, this evening, you know Schlesinger's out of town, and Ash could give these spending figures on defense.
He's not our punchiest spokesman.
Oh, well, it's all right.
Okay.
All right, and then we'll have John Connolly lined up for the night.
He wants to go, does he?
Yes, sir.
I had a good long talk with him, and I feel much better about the economic thing now.
What's he come down with at the moment?
He thinks we ought to put a freeze on the gas at the pump because it's going to go way up here in the summer, and that's consumer-oriented.
He likes this— How about freeze on food?
There's no way we can do that.
They've come in with another view on it where they think instead of just a slap of an embargo type for you to let the current contracts run out,
to hold up on any additional ones without consultation and reporting and put licensing in.
So in other words, we'll have a positive control on it.
And he thinks that's better.
Right, right.
And then all the other things that we have, he thinks is a pretty damn good package.
Well, I mean, just to freeze on gas and something on food.
And on food, plus all the other things on steel.
I know.
What is the...
What do you think about the 60-day thing, Al?
He doesn't like it.
He doesn't?
No.
I'll be darned.
Still got the other fellow working on it.
Let's see what he comes up with.
They're working on it.
Dunlop said he's met with labor and industry leaders this morning, and they're uniformly opposed.
I'll be darned.
That shows you, though, it's good to have Dunlop checked, because when people talk like Pierre Renfray and others about this, heck, if we throw it on an industry and labor comes out and slaps it.
but we have a heck of a time ahead of us, don't we?
That's right.
He said labor is violently opposed, and almost the board opposed, but not as strongly.
Yeah, but they like to control labor.
That's right.
Mm-hmm.
So John now is, I mean, he's leveling what he is.
I mean, what I mean is, yes, I think he's leveled there.
He's probably thinking from both sheets.
He's incidentally very solid there.
Yeah, that talk yesterday was very helpful.
I hope so.
And I went over— Oh, did you—how does he feel about the format?
No, in other words, he likes it.
In other words, he comes in for those four meetings that we spoke about.
Right.
Or anything else.
Yeah, but he should go back.
But he should go to his firm, right?
That's right.
And just gradually, you know what I mean, he can do—have the best of both worlds that way.
Exactly right.
And make a lot of money, too.
That's right.
And I, you know, I pitched that you didn't want him wrapped around any particular program.
So he, I think, feels much better.
Yeah.
Well, he takes stroking.
Yes, all of us do, but he takes some.
Will he come to the cabinet tomorrow?
Absolutely.
Any other cabinet you ever want him to be?
Well, I'm going to have an all-cabinet meeting.
That's right.
He said he'd come.
Yeah, I think he should.
He's going to be there.
He's so valuable.
He's got the thing that he has, Al, that
many of our cabinet members don't have, he's got ideas, you know.
He pops in there with something.
Yes, sir.
Exactly.
All right.
On this boat thing tonight, I don't know when in the world we get through in time to sort of set up for 630.
I told him sort of about 630, yeah.
And I think Bruce was told 630.
Can you make it, too?
Yes, sir.
All right.
Quite interesting from California, though.
Really?
He called you, though?
Yeah.
What's he—what's he—is he questioning the figures?
Yeah, he thought that it was— Fake?
It was fake.
Oh, boy.
But, uh, and you did say, all right, I'll just send you the release, and that this was a thorough survey, file by file.
The files are all in the Bureau.
He knows that, doesn't he?
Yes.
We're not shooting an empty cannon on this one.
I also passed on some other things to him.
I'd like to keep them on edge.
I said, you ought to know that, uh, Jennifer Hoover, uh,
to each president when he'd come in and tell them what he can do in this area.
That's right.
You know, I said, don't kid yourself that there wasn't some political activity done in the past.
I said, I don't know the details, but I know it was done.
Right.
Right.
Just leave it there with them.
That's good.
That's good.
You said that you were saying something else.
Do you know that?
Do you know what you're starting to say?
Yeah.
I was going to say that these guys are really
they're uptight about this.
Like this fellow Monday had called Henry and said he thought he ought to resign again because of the taps.
And I told Henry, why don't you ask him about his taps?
And then Henry said, well, he told me they didn't do it.
I said, they sure did.
And Henry didn't believe me.
But now we've got the figures.
Sir, now we don't know whether they were NSC people.
No, we got the names.
But we do know they were government officials.
taking so long to get the names.
What do you think they're doing?
They're just— Well, he said there are 25,000 files to be— Yeah, but we only have two.
We don't want the names going back to Roosevelt.
I just want them for those three years.
Can't they just work those three years?
Sixty-one?
Sixty-two?
Sixty-three and sixty-four.
Yes, sir.
Heck, that's only for about a thousand names.
Give us the names.
That's all we need.
Okay, sir.
Have fun with them there.
That's right.
It's good to know you know what you're .
These are absolutely double standard.
Oh, boy.
They're trying to hang us with stuff that they did, too.
And it's not perfectly legitimate.
I don't criticize them for doing it.
Never did.
You know what I mean?
That's right.
But they're not going to get away with hitting us, Al, with something for the national security when they did something for the national security.
You know, it's like on the war.
When they were running the darn thing, I didn't bust them on it.
You know, not for getting us in and all that sort of thing.
I criticized the conduct, which was perfectly proper.
But here they, you know, we were in.
They turned around the Bundys and the rest and knocked our brains out.
You know, it was just unconscionable.
Well, that's just a double standard.
In other words, when we were in, it's our war.
When they were in, it was our war.
That's right, exactly.
Well, it's very interesting.
We got their attention on this, and I knew we would.
Right.
Right.
Well, you're probably right.
The story is more important from the standpoint of their attention than it is even of getting the attention of the mass of the people.
The mass people understand this sort of thing.
Exactly.
And they don't care much anyhow, but they're for it.
That's right.
And he also said another interesting thing.
That's what I was going to tell you.
Oh, yeah, yeah.
That's something.
the liberals in town are very, very pleased with the appointment of Laird and my resignation.
They think that for all the wrong reasons.
Isn't that nice?
For all the wrong reasons.
It means the liberals are in.
Is that what they think?
They think you're a liberal?
No, no, they don't think that.
They think that liberal sentiments forced me out of the Army.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
You see, that's the way these bastards are.
Really?
Sure.
Oh, in other words, you—
that you and I had a pang of conscience that we had to do this, civil liberties and what have you, meant that the Army couldn't be in a position like this.
So everybody thought it was an admirable thing.
Oh, my gosh.
Oh, my gosh.
They are so distorted and crooked in their own minds.
Unbelievable.
Well, anyway, the Laird announcement in a year's got to get a good play, don't you think?
Yes, sir.
It is.
It's getting a good play.
Right.
All right.
Thanks.