Conversation 402-001

On January 11, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, William T. Kendall, White House operator, Manolo Sanchez, Claude S. Brinegar, Harry S. Dent, George P. Shultz, and Ronald L. Ziegler met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at an unknown time between 4:35 pm and 5:30 pm. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 402-001 of the White House Tapes.

Conversation No. 401-31/402-1

Date: January 11, 1973
Time: Unknown between 4:35 pm and 5:30 pm.
Location: Executive Office Building

The President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman. An unknown portion of the conversation was
not recorded while the tape was changed.

      Henry A. Kissinger

      Ronald L. Ziegler

      Lyndon B. Johnson
           -George Christian
           -John N. Mitchell

      Vietnam settlement
           -Congressional hearings

      Johnson
           -John B. Connally
           -Christian
           -Connally

      1973 Inauguration
           -President's attitude
           -Compared to Super Bowl
           -Patrick J. Buchanan
                 -Memorandum

      Congressional relations
           -Democratic caucus
           -Hearings

      1973 Inauguration
           -Eugene Ormandy
                                              -2-

                      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. Feb-09)

                                                       Conversation No. 401-31/402-1 (cont’d)

                      -Sergei Rachmaninoff selections
                            -Philadelphia performance
                      -Ludwig van Beethoven's Fifth Symphony
                      -Chorale of American patriotic music
                      -Edvard Grieg concerto
                      -Performance order
                      -Los Angeles chorale
                      -President's preferences
                      -Aaron Copeland piece
             -Balls
                  -Location for dancing
                  -Presidential box
                  -Possible remarks by President
                        -Thelma C. (“Pat”) Nixon, Julie Nixon Eisenhower, Tricia Nixon
                         Cox
                  -Interest in dancing
                        -Compared to Tricia Nixon Cox's wedding
             -Church service

       President's conversation with Rose Mary Woods
             -Haldeman's conversation with Dwight L. Chapin

             -Health

The President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 4:35 pm and
5:02 pm.

[Conversation No. 401-31/402-1D]

[See Conversation No. 35-142]

[End of telephone conversation]

       President's calls to new Cabinet Officers
             -Peter J. Brennan
             -Frederick Dent, Claude S. Brinegar, Brennan
             -Roy L. Ash
                    -Resilience
                                             -3-

                    NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                      Tape Subject Log
                                        (rev. Feb-09)

                                                       Conversation No. 401-31/402-1 (cont’d)

The President talked with Brinegar between 5:02 pm and 5:03 pm.

[Conversation No. 401-31/402-1E]

[See Conversation No. 35-143]

[End of telephone conversation]

       President's calls
             -Dent

The President talked with the White House operator at 5:03 pm.

[Conversation No. 401-31/402-1F]

[See Conversation No. 35-144]

[End of telephone conversation]

       Press relations
             -Washington Post
             -President's reading
             -Attacks on administration
                    -Response to resumption of Vietnam negotiations

       Congressional relations
            -Republicans
            -Confirmations
            -Barry M. Goldwater
                  -Spiro T. Agnew
            -John G. Tower
            -Howard H. Baker, William E. Brock III, Robert J. Dole
            -New Senators
                  -Speaking abilities
                        -Pete V. Dominici
                        -John J. Sparkman
                        -Hugh Scott
                        -Jesse A. Helms
                        -James L. Buckley
                                                  -4-

                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                         (rev. Feb-09)

                                                        Conversation No. 401-31/402-1 (cont’d)

             -Gerald R. Ford
             -Clarence J. ("Bud") Brown, Jr.
             -Presidential leadership qualities

       Connally

       Agnew
           -Postponement

       George W. Romney [?]

       William F. (“Billy”) Graham
             -A statement on Vietnam War

Ziegler entered at 5:10 pm.

       1973 Inauguration
            -Clothing
                  -Women's Wear Daily

The President talked with Dent between 5:10 pm and 5:11 pm.

[Conversation No. 401-31/402-1G]

[See Conversation No. 35-145]

[End of telephone conversation]

The President talked with the White House operator at 5:11 pm.

[Conversation No. 401-31/402-1H]

[See Conversation No. 35-146]

[End of telephone conversation]

       1973 Inauguration
            -President's clothing
                  -Dwight D. Eisenhower's Inauguration
                  -Coat, pants, shirt
                                             -5-

                    NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                      Tape Subject Log
                                        (rev. Feb-09)

                                                     Conversation No. 401-31/402-1 (cont’d)

                    -Hat

The President talked with George P. Shultz between 5:12 pm and 5:13 pm.

[Conversation No. 401-31/402-1I]

[See Conversation No. 35-147]

[End of telephone conversation]

Ziegler left at 5:13 pm.

       Pierre Rinfret

       Second-term reorganization
            -Ziegler
            -Rogers C. B. Morton
                  -Possible future
                        -Charles McC. Mathias, Jr.
            -Haldeman's contact with Robert H. Finch and Donald H. Rumsfeld
                  -George H.W. Bush, Brock, and Brown
                  -Charles W. Colson


**********************************************************************
[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]

              1974 Election
                   -Candidates

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
**********************************************************************


       President's activities
             -State visits
                    -Soviet Union
                    -Japan
                    -Europe, Latin America
                                            -6-

                 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                      Tape Subject Log
                                        (rev. Feb-09)

                                                     Conversation No. 401-31/402-1 (cont’d)

                 -Mexican President
                 -Pierre E. Trudeau


************************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

      1974 election
           -President’s campaign activities
                  -1970 Election results
           -Congressional relations
                  -Democrats
                  -President’s supporters in Congress
           -Senate candidates
                  -House of Representatives candidates
                  -Colorado
                  -Nevada
           -President’s campaign activities
                  -Radio
                  -Pictures
                  -Speeches
                  -Effects
                        -Press coverage
                  -Fundraising
                        -Agnew
                        -Primary states
                  -Writers
                        -Raymond K. Price, Jr.
                        -Buchanan
                        -William L. Safire

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


      Issues of second term
            -Foreign policy
            -Crime and drugs
            -Environment
                                              -7-

                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                     Tape Subject Log
                                       (rev. Feb-09)

                                                     Conversation No. 401-31/402-1 (cont’d)

            -Taxes
            -Federal budget
            -Federal government
            -Education
            -Parks


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

            1974 Election
                 -Haldeman’s role

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Manolo Sanchez entered at an unknown time after 5:13 pm.

       The President’s schedule

Sanchez left at an unknown time before 5:30 pm.

       Second term reorganization
            -Ash
                  -Office of Management and Budget [OMB]
            -Cabinet
                  -Undersecretaries
                  -Connally
                        -Undersecretary
            -[Name unintelligible]
                  -Colson
                  -Harvard University
            -Frederic V. Malek's work
                  -Advance men from 1972 campaign
            -Possible appointment for unknown man
            -U.S. Information Agency [USIA]

The President and Haldeman left at 5:30 pm.
                                             -8-

                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                     Tape Subject Log
                                       (rev. Feb-09)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
You think that having George go down there, hey, that drops for that.
I'm sure I just actually thought I was wondering if it was sort out for that.
I try to leave.
We might, that's the final, we might flash off
and other directions to sort of solve the problem.
The other thing I'm worried about is right in this particular state where they want to get in.
I think, you know, I think really it's, I've always, it's always, the congressional hearings have just been happening for quite a long time.
That doesn't make sense because of the traffic.
I can't find how I was
Well, I certainly think it's worth it to ask for his advice about that.
His advice is very good.
That's what I think.
It's better than Christian.
But it's not better than execution.
Well, it's also easier because it's better than our time together.
As soon as I talk to Christian, he'll probably jump on me.
I think I was battered around with a good comment.
It was better.
My view on the inauguration was not to downgrade the spectacle every once in a while.
My own point is that when there's something big that people admire, there's about that little bit of change in that certain day.
In the pro game, my Super Bowl that day, it was about half the people, 46% of the players in the federation, 46 people watching that.
But the inaugural, it's a big show.
It was a big show.
But I think we haven't realized it.
I would build it back a little.
I don't know if anybody has heard that.
And as a supporter of Winston, I'm really thinking of him seriously.
I think the president never scratched his head.
You know, it was just God and not even God.
I couldn't believe my eyes.
I think it's important.
Russia, you know.
Okay.
Okay.
I wish I had one of those.
I don't have one of those.
I don't have one of those.
I don't have one of those.
I don't have one of those.
I don't have one of those.
I don't have one of those.
That's right.
Right.
Right.
Right.
Right.
I don't know about it, but it's kind of a little push for me to do that kind of thing.
I'm not going to hold on to that feeling.
I'm not that kind of friend.
I'm not that kind of brother or friend.
It's really good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
It's good.
He said,
I agree.
I don't remember being in charge of the city.
It's very, very up to the president.
He's very strong.
He said the problem with the fire is he's not going to be refreshed on a lot of times.
He's trying to get him to do the right amount of most of the preludes that he did in Philadelphia.
A different pianist did it that night in Philadelphia.
But he said he would like them so they were great and he wanted to do those.
But he said he couldn't get out of there tonight.
Don't think about it.
I've said to them, I watched the deliberation.
I said, no, no, the president just wanted to just make the program work itself.
He just wanted to do it on his own.
I think that was good.
That's the first act of what we're doing right now.
And then the second act, with this corral of American businesses, is the ability to figure out everything.
And I miss that.
I don't hear that in the act.
That's the opening of the second act.
And then we checked out of there, we charioteered the fight.
And then he was the piece in trouble, which is, you know, he's going to bring about a 40-man deal.
And the president likes that.
And they both said, we're going to have him come in.
And they won't be on the stage.
And just before we had the end of the tournament, we were taking the analog, right?
And the Ring Valley Forge was about to enter into a corral in the end of Los Angeles, right?
Right at the end of the corral, right?
Back at the stadium.
And they were already on the stage.
And we were also in the global stadium.
And it's curious that, he said, if the president wants to change it, he said, we've started rehearsing, we'll go change it.
And I was like, no, no, no, no.
It's such a nice guy.
He's a fighter.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
He's a pilot.
I think the needle is dancing on his feet.
What they want you to do instead of having to go to the presidential box, which is in the back, they want you to go to the orchestra, where the orchestra's on the front, which also gives you a chance to play.
Go to the bandstand, where there's, you know, where you can see it better, where they dance in the, where they dance right in front of that.
Go to the bandstand, it depends on which ball you're at, but you can, and then you can talk to the computer.
So it's a combination.
We'll have a majesty at the end of it.
You've got the church there that's not worked out.
I deliberately had that extended conversation with Rose for a reason.
I thought that I might as well try to get them back down here, try to get them, you know, less tension on the staff there.
And, uh, you know, I didn't say anything to her.
She didn't say anything to her.
I don't know.
I was, I thought, you know, I thought this was an issue.
This was an issue.
I expected her to work this week.
It was good, and it was good, and everybody else.
It was just fantastic.
She just looked good.
She didn't feel bad about it.
I think, frankly, it was just also that she had fun.
She had a lot of fun.
It was great.
And I always can't believe it.
She's a 1A technical guy.
She's a great guy.
She's all right.
She's all right.
All right.
All right.
The thing I like about it, Bob, is the way he takes his shit.
I'm so worried.
I don't know.
I think I can do so much.
I just wanted to tell you that I won't see you, of course, until the inauguration of the first cabinet meeting, but everybody told me that your feet went pretty well, and I hope you're getting settled around.
All right.
All right.
Oh, they won't follow you.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
All right.
All right.
All right.
Well, I hope you get the right kind of a house and everybody's at it.
Okay, bye.
You know, it's very interesting.
I was thinking of, I didn't read them all, but I did.
I read this one about the center.
But we see, we see that it's almost like a goddamn old play scene.
Over and over again.
You know how it's going to come out.
You know exactly what the reactions are.
You know who's going to say what.
You know that they're going to run down on the bias and give a statement.
That they're going to get some mouth and then say this.
Their attacks go on.
They squeal.
They think the world's coming to an end.
They're going to knock the shit out of the president.
Understand all these concerns.
Their actions, you would say, they were caught.
They were so caught by their balls that this truck started to come.
It took them about three or four days.
The gas started to go to the back of it.
The Congress got back to the Congress.
They were operating.
The Congress went off and got their lawyers back.
You know, it wasn't accepted, but when I said, you know, the guy didn't understand, I said, don't worry.
That's really not quite true.
It's like, it's just included.
It says things are a little more shiny.
Tell her.
Tell her, Sid.
Did I do too much?
What's up, Bill?
Baker.
Rob.
Rob's in Bakerland.
He'll just have to hold you.
Bill does.
Bill does.
I'll get him.
That's right.
Bill.
What else you got, Bill?
What else you got?
I mean, I've got a good speaker in the whole country to do this, and as far as speaking, yeah, for that issue.
But I just don't know what to do.
And then Scott, I mean, Scott, that congressional president, I mean, what he said was right.
Scott is a big stick in the hell of an arm.
But he's a dumb bastard.
Maybe he's not too dumb.
I'm going to say he's a hell of an owner.
A hell of an owner.
Where is he?
That's right.
That's right.
That's right.
That's right.
That's right.
That's right.
That's right.
That's right.
That's right.
That's right.
down in the middle of this big city, uh, such a big, uh, matter of, uh, what do you call it?
It's just, what if they were down here trying to make it to the city of New York?
What's the name of that city?
They'd run away from the bottle.
They'd reach out to the person in the city and, uh, rally.
What?
What?
What else?
What else?
What else?
I don't think it's the right thing to do.
I don't think it's the right thing to do.
I don't think it's the right thing to do.
Well, I think you should, so that you can just say it's crazy.
I just couldn't believe it.
And then I said, and I put it off.
I said, well, see, I'm down.
And I said, well, I'm down.
I said, well, I'm down.
I got to know him since his birthday.
There was also an effort being made to, we'll be in the same award or something like that, but I decided to wait.
Just not at all.
Oh, yeah, I saw that.
Yeah.
I don't know.
I just want to make sure everybody's safe.
It's a very good thing.
It's a very good thing.
Women's work is out in the story.
Women's work is out in the story.
I think they're wrong.
I think they're wrong.
I think they're wrong.
Well, I have nothing to do with it.
I was trying to accept that we're going to have a meeting at the inauguration after this is done.
But while you're getting through your confirmation, I just want to wish you well.
I hope you're having a good time up here.
I'm sure he was.
He's standing right up there.
He's very gentle.
He's gentle but firm.
Okay.
Yeah.
Good.
Great.
Well, I think you did a fine job.
Sorry, Sean.
Yeah.
What am I going to wear?
Well, they got it wrong.
They're right.
Well, they... What I'm saying is that what we... What I wasn't... We wore it.
Eisenhower was in line.
But we can't wear it.
That's what I'm saying.
This is club coats, striped pants.
That's what I'm saying.
Because they say color.
Because that's the wrong form of that.
No, no, no, no, no, no.
I thought it was a short coat.
It's a terror.
We always... Eisenhower started it because of the club coat.
Jazz back in the day did that.
to wear a club coat, striped pants, plus a regular white shirt.
No, no, no.
Just a regular shirt with a white hat.
With a white striped shirt.
Right.
And I will not wear a hat until I've worn that in all three in our district.
Okay?
Yes, sir.
Go on.
Oh good, well what did he think of the announcement?
Yeah.
I guess that would be his recommendation.
Would you be sure to tell him that I did read that his letter and Mark sent it over to you?
Right.
Right.
Good.
Very good.
Also, anything he's interested in, tell him at the International Monetary at a later time.
In the meantime, if you would pass off the letter.
My regards to him.
I think he makes a sweet saying.
He likes this.
Tell him.
Oh, he already did.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Good.
Tell him that.
Tell him that.
Tell him that.
Tell him a lot of people.
A lot of people.
Tell him that.
I said a lot of people.
Listen.
Listen.
He's been often so right when others have been wrong.
Okay?
All right.
I heard him say, well, I'm sitting here with Mr. Preston with your good chance to be over there.
We have a lot of old condition cars.
I think you know, when you stop the video, you really don't have except for Roger to pick it up and get it.
I don't consider Roger to be part of the big company.
Roger knows that you're serving.
He wants to go to the Senate.
I don't believe him.
I would be great if he did, but I don't believe him.
I thought I should be looking through one eye now, but the way I look at it, it's nice and red.
Usually when the crime happens, it's a fine moment.
The prize is putting them there, whining and whining.
How do you plan coffee?
You've got to try to do this through the... Let's really use...
So I just basically...
I think you've got to use the three.
Push it from the bottom.
The three feet from the bottom.
And from time to time, Colson should come in.
You know?
Then you can have a lot of coffee.
Coffee and coffee.
Oh, yes, yes.
I think you know, though, I mean, in a broader sense, I'm starting a candidate search now.
So, I think, for example, that I've been learning every day about my type of food.
I've read you, I mentioned it earlier, and realized we only have one other state because it was with the Russians.
And I think, except for people that just got food,
uh, in Washington, and in Japan, I'm in the middle of it.
Now, I might go to Europe, but I don't, they don't have to put on, I don't have to say, we have to do a lot in America, we have to do a lot in America.
We don't have to do anything.
And let me tell you, the message that was beyond the table, that's not going to be on the page.
You know, we had enough kids.
Great.
Had it promised.
Had it for a private dinner.
Had it for a public dinner.
I made an asshole of myself the second time.
But we have to consider and make another, I think, a very important consideration about what my own campaign activity should be like before.
because we must not have any impression of deception, activity, or faith.
I mean, there are other reasons for it, but, you know, if you want to think about it, if the right statement of the candidate is something that they're going to do right, it might be that they're going to go out and stir up the truth about their own business.
But I don't believe that's the way to do it.
Congress is against us already.
See, that's why.
That's why we want to take on the 93rd country.
See, that gives me, for the last few hours, the chance to finish the work that we started.
That's right.
And then they told us, and then they, the Democrats came in and said, you know what, that wasn't good.
So what do they want?
They want to just get along and beat your bills, which is not good.
But you have a chance.
You know what I'm talking about.
All right.
Here's what we did.
And then go out and go all out with the candidates we get that are good.
Everyone has to skimp the dollars.
You have to skimp the dollars.
And then I think I was going to mention the district and the state for each other, but also the intelligence for each other.
Oh yeah, it's a different, uh, look at Tom.
Yeah, and the officer.
Yeah, I'm not saying, I heard you over the phone or something, but when I'm on a good talk, they're really talking about the actual problems, you know.
We could spend an awful lot of time with that kind of development.
We've got to take care of the candidates for the Senate.
Whether or not you can present your House candidate, they're a question for us.
We're a candidate for one of them.
Maybe the House guys could make you a radio show.
You do a radio clip for all pictures.
You do a radio clip for the picture.
But let's not, in this instance, rule out the possibility of going out with that person.
You know, this president's coming in there, ordering me to drop that person 10 minutes a week.
He's putting my arm around him.
He's hitting me.
And after a little bit, I just, I'm talking about the experts.
Yeah.
going with a standard stunt speech, right?
On that, so that you don't try to make national footage, but solely for the purpose of getting a good event done, and the right speech done, and you need this man in the center and all that.
Correct.
And that's all.
Do not try to make a good speech out of it, ever.
The less national coverage you get on it, the better.
All right, all of us, please.
Before I came, I took a break from the public.
I just want to present the record.
The record was actually great.
And I think that's why I brought it in place.
I thought it was a better way to use it.
What do you think, sir?
I sure do.
But I ain't going to do it.
I'm not going to do it.
I'm not going to do it.
I'm not going to do it.
I'm not going to do it.
I'm not going to do it.
I'm not going to do it.
When do you think the three of you are going to sit down and get this gold and go ahead and roll it over?
Who's going to work on that?
Maybe that's something Price will work on, too, with Buchanan.
Don't get too many.
Price and Buchanan are both going to work well.
where we get some sharp pictures of what the hell we want to look at.
This is one where I think maybe we take a stab at the audience.
You know, I think maybe it's one where we've got a version, you know, with a lot of letters, letters, you know, and sapphires and stuff.
Yeah.
With the writers and things like that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Make sure there's something out on this coast.
I put down, like I have, I have crime and, you know, drugs and fire.
And no tax increase.
We're cutting the cost of government.
We're cutting the cost of government.
We're cutting the cost of education.
I would put about a minute, but I'd also put a minute.
Wait a minute.
Wait a minute.
It's going to be a lot of leadership here.
Nice girl.
I don't know.
I think maybe it will work a little bit earlier.
I'm very anxious to get some of the, get the passport money and get an issue.
You know, I just don't know if that office is going to lose it.
I did not try to try, but I just don't think it's going to happen.
That lost 90%.
What's your view of potential?
Yeah, it's not going to happen.
I'm sure it's going to happen.
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, hey, National, you're damn right.
And also, I think, I agree, you're going to have a lot of help with that.
You're going to do that again.
You're going to do the practice.
That's a good second thing for you to do.
I don't know if he promised that he would find something after that one.
I don't think he does.
Well, it's hard to think of how he's acting.
I don't think he's acting.
I don't think he's acting.
I don't think he's acting.
I don't think he's acting.
I don't think he's acting.
I don't think he's acting.
You know, this trip will be well recorded.
It's a balanced operation.
We'll walk down the road.
We're going to be better than we've been.
We'll see who's right and who's wrong.
But the levels that you never see here, rarely see this, right?
But then it does, it's really fun, right?
Always.
The longer advancement, you can't make longer cuts.
But we're better people when we can do that with more than one person.
It is, it is.
The letter is the best you can do.
Don't you feel that, uh, my, is that understand, that it's probably, yeah, I don't know what it is, but it's about that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that.
No.
It's a credit.
But I think the way that the president is going to show here is that the USIA is pushing us to put it back in that thing.
And I don't want that.
We've got merit in that area.
That's better.
Here, I'm not really controlling it.
I'm recommending it.
I believe we can do it.
It's like that.
I don't know how to do it.
Thank you.