{"conversationCode":"413-017","tapeNumber":413,"conversationNumber":17,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-413-017","startDateTime":"1973-02-23T20:35:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1973-02-23T21:40:00.000Z","startDate":"23-Feb-1973","startTime":"3:35 PM","endDate":"23-Feb-1973","endTime":"4:40 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\"); Ford, Gerald R.; White House operator; Mills, Wilbur D.; Bull, Stephen B.; Kissinger, Henry A.; [Unknown person(s)];","description":"On February 23, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. (\"Bob\") Haldeman, Gerald R. Ford, White House operator, Wilbur D. Mills, Stephen B. Bull, Henry A. Kissinger, and unknown person(s) met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building from 3:35 pm to 4:40 pm. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 413-017 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"EOB","recordingDevice":"Old Executive Office Building","latitudeEstimated":38.897567,"longitudeEstimated":-77.039147,"chronCode":"5.4","chronRelease":"Fifth Chronological Release: Part IV","chronReleaseDate":"8-Dec-2010","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 413-17\n\nDate: February 23, 1973\nTime: 3:35 pm-4:40 pm\nLocation: Executive Office Building\n\nThe President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman.\n\n       Haldeman's talk with Patricia R. Hitt\n             -Hitt’s knowledge\n                     -Appointment to ACTION\n                     -Easing out\n             -Rogers C. B. Morton [?]\n             -Peter M. Flanigan [?]\n             -Peace Corps\n             -VISTA\n             -Hitt’s reaction\n                     -Robert H. Finch\n                     -Political opponents\n\nThe President talked with Gerald R. Ford between 3:38 pm and 3:44 pm.\n\n[Conversation No. 413-17A]\n\n[See Conversation No. 43-194]\n\n[End of telephone conversation]\n\n       Wilbur D. Mills\n              -Press conference and press release\n                      -Timing\n              -Surcharge\n                      -Selected imports\n              -Trade legislation\n                      -Staff recommendation [?]\n                              -President’s phone call to Mills\n                      -President's conversation with George P. Shultz and John D. Ehrlichman\n\f                                            -11-\n\n                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                               Conversation No. 413-39 (cont’d)\n\nThe President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 3:44 pm and\n3:47 pm.\n\n[Conversation No. 413-17B]\n\n[See Conversation No. 43-195]\n\n[End of telephone conversation]\n\n       President's schedule\n\n       Donald C. Alexander [?]\n             -Ohio\n             -Qualifications\n                    -Harvard law, Yale undergraduate\n\n       Charles W. Colson’s role\n\n       President’s knowledge [?]\n\n       Ehrlichman’s role\n\n       Herbert G. Klein\n              -Talk with Haldeman\n              -Trip to California\n                      -Meeting\n              -Possibilities\n                      -Newspaper division\n\nThe President talked with Mills between 3:47 pm and 3:53 pm.\n\n[Conversation No. 413-17C]\n\n[See Conversation No. 43-196]\n\n[End of telephone conversation]\n\n       Surcharge\n\f                                     -12-\n\n           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                      Conversation No. 413-39 (cont’d)\n\n       -John B. Connally\n       -Political motivation\n\nAlexander's appointment to Internal Revenue Service [IRS] position\n      -Federal Bureau of Investigation [FBI] background check\n      -Support from Shultz, Ehrlichman, Colson\n      -Compared to George H. W. Bush\n      -Ehrlichman\n              -Administration’s expectations\n      -Background\n              -Newspaper\n              -Editor, Harvard Law Review\n              -Yale University\n                      -Academic honors\n              -World War II service\n                      -European theater\n              -Academic honors\n              -Comparison to Elliot L. Richardson\n              -Tax background\n                      -Criticism\n                      -Head of IRS\n      -Support for IRS appointment\n\nExecutive appointments\n       -Diversity\n\nAdvisor to President\n      -Part-time\n      -Guidance for staff\n\nStaff changes\n\nAnne L. Armstrong\n      -Spanish-speaking related work\n      -Ehrlichman [?]\n      -Office staff\n             -Diversity\n             -Male staff members\n\f                                     -13-\n\n           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                     Conversation No. 413-39 (cont’d)\n\n                      -Duties\n       -Haldeman’s relationship with Armstrong\n              -Compared with Finch\n       -Additional staff\n       -Competence of staff members\n              -Pamela Powell\n              -Ongoing projects\n                      -Youth business [?]\n                      -New Majority activity\n                      -Bicentennial\n                              -Organizing public activities\n                      -Entertainment\n                      -Youth night\n                              -Work with Julie Nixon Eisenhower\n       -Management style\n              -Productivity\n\nJohn A. Volpe [?]\n\nWhite House staff\n      -Management\n      -Costs\n      -High level\n      -Political appointments [?]\n\nSub-Cabinet officers [?]\n      -Meetings with President\n      -Stephen B. Bull\n      -Charls E. Walker\n              -Camp David\n      -Undersecretaries\n              -Work ethic\n      -James F. Oates\n              -Veterans\n\nPrisoners of war [POWs] function\n       -Scheduling\n       -Public relations\n\f                                        -14-\n\n              NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                         Conversation No. 413-39 (cont’d)\n\nLetters\n          -Preparation\n          -Endorsement of resolution\n          -Subsidies [?]\n          -Batch prepared for March, April\n          -Statement on Union of Soviet Socialist Republics [USSR] visit\n\nOffice of Economic Opportunity [OEO]\n       -Job Corps\n       -Public relations\n              -Reaction\n              -Speech\n                       -Caspar W. (“Cap”) Weinberger\n              -Announcement on OEO\n                       -Timing\n\nHarris poll on issues\n        -Results\n        -OEO [?]\n        -Phase III wage-price action\n                -Public support\n                -Lack of confidence\n        -Prices\n                -Gold\n        -Budget issue\n        -Economic issues\n                -Haldeman’s agreement with Shultz’s view\n                -Consumer Price Index [CPI]\n                       -Food prices\n                               -Importance\n\nPrice controls\n        -Action\n               -Delayed results\n\nWilliam J. Baroody, Jr.\n       -Citizens committee\n\f                                     -15-\n\n           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                      Conversation No. 413-39 (cont’d)\n\n              -Taxes\n              -Prices\n       -Actions\n              -Control\n              -Offensive stance\n              -Opposition\n                      -Congressional, press relations\n                      -Academic community\n                      -Effects\n              -Need for villains, civility\n                      -Vance Hartke, Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy\n                      -Press\n                              -New York Times\n\nCampaign financing [?]\n      -Contributors [?]\n      -George H. W. Bush\n\nPress relations\n        -Economic issues\n                -Poor\n                        -Inflation\n                        -Greed [?]\n                -Prices\n                        -Supermarket\n                        -Public interest in President’s economic program\n        -Trip to the People’s Republic of China [PRC], February 1972\n                -Cultural exchanges\n                        -Ping pong team\n                        -Acrobats\n        -Opening of trade office\n                -Michael J. (“Mike”) Mansfield\n        -Announcement of PRC trip\n                -Effective results\n        -Vietnam War settlement\n                -Effective results\n                        -POWs return\n        -Strategic Arms Limitation Talks [SALT] agreement, Leonid I. Brezhnev’s visit\n\f                                               -16-\n\n                    NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                            Conversation No. 413-39 (cont’d)\n\n                       -Public relations value\n                -Charles H. Percy’s media profile\n                       -Responses\n\n       Phase III wage-price actions\n              -Bureaucracy\n                      -Expansion\n              -Inflation\n                      -Prices and wages\n\n       Israel\n                -Libyan airline shoot down\n                -Public apology\n                       -1972 Olympics incident\n                       -Moshe Dayan\n                               -Explanation\n                -George H. W. Bush [?]\n\n       William L. Safire\n              -Preparation of draft\n              -Death of Shelley A. (Scarney) Buchanan’s father\n                     -Patrick J. Buchanan\n\nStephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 3:53 pm.\n\n       Meeting with Shultz, John D. Ehrlichman, Charles J. DiBona, and Henry A. Kissinger\n\nBull left at an unknown time before 4:40 pm.\n\nKissinger entered at an unknown time after 3:53 pm.\n\n       Telephone call from McGeorge Bundy\n\nAn unknown man entered at an unknown time after 3:53 pm.\n\n       Refreshments\n\nThe unknown man left at an unknown time before 4:40 pm.\n\f                                              -17-\n\n                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                              Conversation No. 413-39 (cont’d)\n\n       Bundy\n               -George W. Ball\n               -Organizing\n               -Initiative\n               -Principles\n\n       PRC\n               -Kissinger’s message from President\n                      -Visit\n                      -Chou En-lai\n                      -Dr. David K. E. Bruce\n                      -Ambassador\n               -Chiang Kai-shek\n                      -John H. Holdridge\n\n       Bundy\n               -Telephone call\n\n       Economic affairs\n             -Diplomatic exchange with PRC\n                     -Bush\n                     -Ball\n                     -Bruce\n                     -Bipartisan support\n                     -Leo Cherne\n\n       North Vietnam troops in Laos and Cambodia\n              -Laotian government\n                     -US bombings\n                            -Targets\n\n       William H. Sullivan\n\n       William J. Casey, William J. Porter [?], William P. Rogers [?]\n              -Skills\n\nKissinger left at an unknown time before 4:40 pm.\n\f                                               -18-\n\n                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM\n\n                                                               Conversation No. 413-39 (cont’d)\n\n       Shultz and Ehrlichman\n              -Talks with Haldeman\n              -Polls on public perception of economic issues\n                      -August 1971 New Economic Program\n                             -Problems\n\nHaldeman left at 4:40 pm.","filename":["413-017.mp3"],"tapeStart":"","tapeEnd":"","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\")","Ford, Gerald R.","White House operator","Mills, Wilbur D.","Bull, Stephen B.","Kissinger, Henry A.","[Unknown person(s)]"],"prevCode":"413-016","nextCode":"413-018","transcript":[{"start":7.84,"end":30.62,"text":"It's clear to her now that she's not making any action tonight."},{"start":30.64,"end":31.34,"text":"She sees easier help on that basis."},{"start":31.36,"end":32.27,"text":"The heat seems to be working out pretty well."},{"start":33.24,"end":60.55,"text":"What's the use of telling you that you must not do, you know, peace out, peace for, just because there's such important programs or something, to be sure you don't, she can't, her conscience won't let her stand by and let you make this mistake without her."},{"start":60.57,"end":61.05,"text":"She's dealing with that."},{"start":61.07,"end":62.65,"text":"She apparently does, at least that of the day, does not let people say goodbye."},{"start":62.67,"end":63.13,"text":"Why would they do that?"},{"start":63.89,"end":89.06,"text":"But I think we've solved that."},{"start":89.08,"end":90.2,"text":"She's probably responding to a certain political answer."},{"start":90.22,"end":91.18,"text":"There's political backing of those things, yeah."},{"start":91.2,"end":92.2,"text":"People who are upset or people who are against it."},{"start":96.62,"end":123.17,"text":"problem there."},{"start":129.31,"end":153.46,"text":"a lot of they want it all there's a bunch of great money guys oh"},{"start":158.23,"end":173.9,"text":"But as I said, in my opening time, very clear, I had to go down to the church and also send all of them out to be invited to the church for a week or a week."},{"start":173.92,"end":174.36,"text":"They're all out there."},{"start":174.38,"end":174.82,"text":"They're all out there."},{"start":176.22,"end":200.22,"text":"They won't be very interested in this."},{"start":210.58,"end":223.52,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":223.54,"end":223.64,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":223.66,"end":223.76,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":223.78,"end":223.88,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":223.9,"end":224,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":231.72,"end":259.33,"text":"."},{"start":259.35,"end":259.37,"text":"."},{"start":259.39,"end":259.41,"text":"."},{"start":259.43,"end":259.45,"text":"."},{"start":259.47,"end":259.49,"text":"."},{"start":259.51,"end":259.53,"text":"."},{"start":259.55,"end":259.57,"text":"."},{"start":265.34,"end":268.57,"text":"All right."},{"start":270.55,"end":295.41,"text":"All right."},{"start":298.75,"end":318.59,"text":"They just brought out a local bill that says Arkansas has placed a follow-up review on the U.S. Department of Defense."},{"start":318.61,"end":319.77,"text":"The U.S. Department of Defense is putting a press release."},{"start":319.79,"end":320.69,"text":"He's putting out today a 15% search argument."},{"start":320.71,"end":322.6,"text":"So I think it's important to make sure that the U.S. Department of Defense is doing their job."},{"start":322.62,"end":324.44,"text":"I think it's important to make sure that the U.S. Department of Defense is doing their job."},{"start":324.76,"end":343.61,"text":"No."},{"start":343.63,"end":343.69,"text":"No."},{"start":345.87,"end":371.32,"text":"But he said"},{"start":371.74,"end":399.34,"text":"No, no, John's working it out."},{"start":399.36,"end":399.6,"text":"He said yes."},{"start":400.9,"end":416.81,"text":"He's very down."},{"start":416.82,"end":417.93,"text":"He's like, fuck, okay, we're going to have to call her."},{"start":417.95,"end":418.29,"text":"Just talk to her."},{"start":418.31,"end":419.05,"text":"He's leaving for California tomorrow."},{"start":419.07,"end":419.51,"text":"He's going to be here."},{"start":419.53,"end":420.09,"text":"He'll probably be on Sunday."},{"start":420.11,"end":420.75,"text":"I think it's going to be doable."},{"start":420.77,"end":421.77,"text":"I'm sure he's going to check all those things out."},{"start":422.29,"end":446.06,"text":"He's got several other, he's got a number of possibilities now."},{"start":446.08,"end":446.67,"text":"He's trying to sort them out."},{"start":446.69,"end":448.05,"text":"He's got a, I don't know if he wants to set up a newspaper division."},{"start":448.07,"end":448.97,"text":"He's got to get the word out and activate it."},{"start":448.99,"end":450.45,"text":"It's starting to, he's got to get the pictures put together in the water."},{"start":450.47,"end":450.61,"text":"At all?"},{"start":450.63,"end":450.77,"text":"At all?"},{"start":450.79,"end":451.27,"text":"How are you in Arkansas?"},{"start":452.77,"end":470.51,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":470.54,"end":470.75,"text":"Yeah, yeah."},{"start":470.77,"end":471.07,"text":"Ha, ha, ha, ha."},{"start":471.1,"end":471.32,"text":"Yeah, yeah."},{"start":471.34,"end":471.68,"text":"Here's their job."},{"start":471.7,"end":472.2,"text":"That's the life you know."},{"start":477.98,"end":505.32,"text":"... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ..."},{"start":508.46,"end":529.96,"text":"Well, let me say, I appreciate your, your, your being on board with me about it."},{"start":529.98,"end":533.41,"text":"And, uh, I want to, I want to, you know, I want to have a chance to talk to you, George, or, uh, I don't know what you're doing, but any of that stuff is important to you."},{"start":533.43,"end":534.49,"text":"It's, uh, you can't do it without helping each other."},{"start":534.51,"end":534.61,"text":"Okay."},{"start":534.63,"end":535.37,"text":"But, I can't help you with that fact."},{"start":535.39,"end":536.29,"text":"I've got, I've got to put it off to you, man."},{"start":536.31,"end":536.71,"text":"But you won't do it."},{"start":544.06,"end":558.63,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":558.65,"end":558.75,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":566.54,"end":593.4,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":593.42,"end":593.62,"text":"All right."},{"start":593.64,"end":593.8,"text":"No, yes."},{"start":593.82,"end":593.92,"text":"Okay."},{"start":593.94,"end":594.04,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":594.07,"end":594.16,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":594.18,"end":594.28,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":594.3,"end":594.4,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":595.92,"end":620.61,"text":"Yeah, when you get back, we can get back to you."},{"start":620.63,"end":620.75,"text":"Right."},{"start":620.77,"end":621.23,"text":"I know, I know, I know."},{"start":621.25,"end":621.59,"text":"That's a problem."},{"start":621.61,"end":621.99,"text":"You know it's true."},{"start":622.01,"end":623.13,"text":"But if you know it's true, a Democrat, that's a problem."},{"start":623.15,"end":623.27,"text":"A job."},{"start":623.29,"end":623.41,"text":"A job."},{"start":623.43,"end":623.53,"text":"Okay."},{"start":623.55,"end":623.95,"text":"You take care of it."},{"start":637.21,"end":660.94,"text":"No, I was just saying since we're sure we can move on, I was saying I was going to call in and tell them we were doing that because it's this guy."},{"start":660.96,"end":661.94,"text":"And I do remember one day a caller spoke on that."},{"start":661.96,"end":662.42,"text":"Well, okay, check this."},{"start":662.44,"end":662.66,"text":"We have it."},{"start":662.68,"end":662.88,"text":"All right."},{"start":662.9,"end":663.54,"text":"Okay, we'll take care of it all."},{"start":663.56,"end":665.16,"text":"Because that shows everybody thinks he's great and he's came out of the holster."},{"start":667.07,"end":683.29,"text":"Colson just needed one."},{"start":683.31,"end":685.03,"text":"Colson described the 17 during the Webster, and Schultz said the same thing as Martin."},{"start":685.05,"end":685.77,"text":"He was doing Webster without Martin."},{"start":685.79,"end":687.32,"text":"And I wrote and went through the name radio with him, and it has to be done."},{"start":687.34,"end":687.58,"text":"That's easy."},{"start":687.6,"end":688.02,"text":"That's a good change."},{"start":688.04,"end":688.54,"text":"That's a lot to be about."},{"start":688.56,"end":689.06,"text":"That's a lot to be about."},{"start":689.08,"end":689.58,"text":"That's a lot to be about."},{"start":690.13,"end":709.16,"text":"You're not doing the honors you can."},{"start":709.18,"end":710.78,"text":"Listen, captains of the Army and the Army of the United States are not the same."},{"start":710.8,"end":713.14,"text":"The honors and the skills are not the same for anybody that's the head of the Corps or the Army of the United States."},{"start":713.16,"end":713.99,"text":"There's no way, you know what I'm saying?"},{"start":714,"end":714.59,"text":"That's the top of this class."},{"start":714.61,"end":715.47,"text":"All right, so let's go tell your preachers."},{"start":715.49,"end":716.11,"text":"This is also my prayer for you."},{"start":717.03,"end":737.8,"text":"And he's got good, a lot of good tax credentials."},{"start":737.83,"end":738.43,"text":"He's very critical of the IRS."},{"start":738.45,"end":739.49,"text":"He understands exactly what they want to do and why."},{"start":739.51,"end":739.99,"text":"Good, that's a good one."},{"start":740.01,"end":741.51,"text":"So they will push, or not that they need to do that, I call it, by the way."},{"start":741.53,"end":742.17,"text":"I think he's in very good shape."},{"start":742.19,"end":742.75,"text":"We're bringing him in a lot."},{"start":743.56,"end":761.62,"text":"Really?"},{"start":761.64,"end":761.97,"text":"He's a nice guy."},{"start":761.99,"end":762.35,"text":"I really love him."},{"start":763.1,"end":782.83,"text":"Two or three points I want to make."},{"start":782.85,"end":786.96,"text":"One, if you're going to listen on the web, you're going to find a lot of people that are going to ask, but there's one area where we're going to find a lot of people that are going to find a lot of people."},{"start":786.98,"end":788.94,"text":"That is, on the so-called press release, and by your hard time, you've got to ask them in the web."},{"start":789.29,"end":805.4,"text":"in the future, I don't know if I'm a one on the board or a two on the board."},{"start":805.42,"end":808.26,"text":"Just for instance, if you're regular on your work, basically, you have to close the guidance board, close the session, and perhaps you're not."},{"start":812.82,"end":834.62,"text":"We're not getting very many."},{"start":834.64,"end":835.36,"text":"We're shifting some, moving some up."},{"start":835.38,"end":837.2,"text":"Our Australian Armstrong is getting into Spanish, but what about an Armstrong from Heather?"},{"start":842.03,"end":857.66,"text":"She's got a man running her office."},{"start":857.68,"end":859.11,"text":"She wants one man, one other man in her office so she doesn't have a..."},{"start":859.09,"end":873.19,"text":"An all girl band."},{"start":873.21,"end":873.55,"text":"That makes sense."},{"start":873.58,"end":874.42,"text":"She's got a young guy that's proud of her."},{"start":874.44,"end":874.78,"text":"He's a black guy."},{"start":874.8,"end":875,"text":"He's good."},{"start":875.02,"end":875.44,"text":"Apparently very good."},{"start":875.46,"end":875.64,"text":"Hard guy."},{"start":875.66,"end":876.08,"text":"That's what she puts."},{"start":876.1,"end":876.42,"text":"That's for sure."},{"start":876.44,"end":876.96,"text":"She's got the exact level."},{"start":876.98,"end":878.34,"text":"And this guy's going to handle that and work on a lot of that stuff."},{"start":879.29,"end":895.88,"text":"She's a, she's a real, I'll tell you, I don't, isn't she hard to?"},{"start":895.9,"end":896.21,"text":"Oh, Jesus, yes."},{"start":896.23,"end":896.42,"text":"Or is she?"},{"start":896.45,"end":901.31,"text":"Oh, in the, and I don't feel, I'll tell you, it bothered me when Mitch came forward and said, of course, he did it without anybody knowing because he was more knowledgeable in the ways of the question and not strong in the way of the question."},{"start":901.83,"end":916.48,"text":"That really, by adding the film staff people to her, I'm not so sure it's all bad, because I think she'll get the work out of it, first of all, and that, and it'll be useful."},{"start":916.5,"end":918.74,"text":"It'll just be a one-stop go for her to run around and just get her to go around and see a lot of the film staff."},{"start":923.82,"end":938.02,"text":"She's got good charger type people like Anna Fowler."},{"start":938.04,"end":938.45,"text":"That was a good one."},{"start":938.47,"end":939.13,"text":"Oh yeah, she's working full time."},{"start":939.15,"end":939.67,"text":"What are you trying to do?"},{"start":939.69,"end":940.63,"text":"She's working with Mark Strong on the business."},{"start":941.37,"end":961.38,"text":"I'm trying to develop that, working on, she wants to do some majority type activity, work out in the country and talk."},{"start":961.4,"end":963.5,"text":"And then of course the bicentennial, she's going to work on the public activity side of the bicentennial."},{"start":963.52,"end":964.66,"text":"I'm trying a little pizazz in that, but I'm not going to."},{"start":965.7,"end":988.08,"text":"And she's handling phone calls, you know, people doing the talk to people stuff."},{"start":988.1,"end":989.74,"text":"She's working on this whole entertainment business she's using at the White House."},{"start":989.76,"end":991.7,"text":"In that area, she's got a lot of ideas on how to make sure she's good and makes a lot of the job."},{"start":991.72,"end":992.6,"text":"She's working with Julie on the youth night."},{"start":992.62,"end":992.92,"text":"She's involved."},{"start":992.94,"end":993.77,"text":"She's the type of language that can work."},{"start":993.79,"end":994.65,"text":"And I think she'll get something out of it."},{"start":998.09,"end":1026.52,"text":"She decided she was going to do something, and she... What about the... What about the... What about the... What about the... What about the..."},{"start":1027.33,"end":1049.72,"text":"I don't know."},{"start":1049.74,"end":1050.9,"text":"On the other hand, I don't mind if you have to call 6-2-1."},{"start":1050.92,"end":1051.02,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":1051.04,"end":1051.26,"text":"I'll start."},{"start":1051.28,"end":1051.5,"text":"I'll start."},{"start":1052.85,"end":1082.35,"text":"they don't have the build up to a degree if there were no White House staff at all they'd still build it up you've got to have somebody running for their hand being on top of it getting a very accurate cost run on it which is the key thing that they spent the $50,000 this looks like they spent a little high"},{"start":1083.46,"end":1101.17,"text":"I want to be sure we've got the whole thing right."},{"start":1101.19,"end":1101.72,"text":"I'll get you to put it on."},{"start":1101.74,"end":1102.48,"text":"Well, let's see if we can get enough."},{"start":1102.5,"end":1102.84,"text":"We'll get enough."},{"start":1102.86,"end":1103.12,"text":"We'll get it."},{"start":1103.14,"end":1103.44,"text":"We'll cover it."},{"start":1104.58,"end":1130.26,"text":"Yeah, with the suggestion that they had answered my mind."},{"start":1130.28,"end":1131.18,"text":"Because I think that's the easy way to do it."},{"start":1131.2,"end":1131.62,"text":"It's very high level."},{"start":1131.64,"end":1132.06,"text":"It's very high level."},{"start":1135.97,"end":1151.58,"text":"Thank you."},{"start":1155.85,"end":1183.44,"text":"I really believe in God."},{"start":1183.46,"end":1183.8,"text":"I believe in God."},{"start":1183.82,"end":1184.16,"text":"I believe in God."},{"start":1184.18,"end":1184.52,"text":"I believe in God."},{"start":1187.56,"end":1207.61,"text":"What he's got are all okay for you to do."},{"start":1207.63,"end":1208.75,"text":"Again, like Charlie Walker, I don't know if you saw him."},{"start":1208.77,"end":1209.17,"text":"I can't talk to him."},{"start":1209.19,"end":1209.83,"text":"I don't know if you can see him."},{"start":1209.85,"end":1210.02,"text":"I can't."},{"start":1210.04,"end":1210.19,"text":"I can't."},{"start":1210.21,"end":1210.38,"text":"I can't."},{"start":1210.39,"end":1210.56,"text":"I can't."},{"start":1210.58,"end":1210.74,"text":"I can't."},{"start":1210.76,"end":1210.92,"text":"I can't."},{"start":1210.94,"end":1211.1,"text":"I can't."},{"start":1211.12,"end":1211.28,"text":"I can't."},{"start":1211.3,"end":1211.46,"text":"I can't."},{"start":1215.47,"end":1238.47,"text":"... ... ... ..."},{"start":1249.98,"end":1269.42,"text":"Yeah, it's a similar thing."},{"start":1269.44,"end":1270.14,"text":"I think they were talking about it."},{"start":1270.16,"end":1270.42,"text":"It's so late."},{"start":1278.75,"end":1296.76,"text":"The first week in April, which is the week after the completion of the... A lot of that, I think, something goes wrong with that."},{"start":1300.4,"end":1316.33,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":1316.35,"end":1316.45,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":1319.84,"end":1331.86,"text":"resolution"},{"start":1333.76,"end":1353.22,"text":"In the list and the letter, some of them have already gotten some letters earlier."},{"start":1353.24,"end":1353.55,"text":"So that's good."},{"start":1353.57,"end":1353.97,"text":"But maybe it's done."},{"start":1353.99,"end":1354.29,"text":"Maybe it's not."},{"start":1355.89,"end":1378.15,"text":"That's what they were working on."},{"start":1378.17,"end":1379.59,"text":"They went through that list and when they got a grade of 17, that's it."},{"start":1379.61,"end":1381.65,"text":"That's on the, that was of the batch that you can feel like they get, you know, they might shake over."},{"start":1381.67,"end":1383.54,"text":"Back to look at it now, you know, right away, I don't know if it's on here now, I don't know."},{"start":1383.56,"end":1383.82,"text":"I don't know."},{"start":1383.84,"end":1385,"text":"It's pretty open for the second half of the year, I guess."},{"start":1386.01,"end":1414.97,"text":"State this is Russia, you've got to be on the night."},{"start":1414.99,"end":1415.39,"text":"Russia, this is Jim."},{"start":1415.41,"end":1415.61,"text":"All right."},{"start":1415.63,"end":1415.83,"text":"All right."},{"start":1418.26,"end":1438.61,"text":"The speech in Samaritan, and one of the first books in, to be understanding that we're providing the speech, or we're listening, and he knows that you may create it."},{"start":1438.63,"end":1438.73,"text":"Amen."},{"start":1445.44,"end":1458.48,"text":"And the plan then would be to wait until the last minute to do it."},{"start":1458.5,"end":1459.18,"text":"And we can get a reading that way."},{"start":1459.62,"end":1489.35,"text":"uh..."},{"start":1490.75,"end":1514.31,"text":"I'm an adult, and I know it's a solely issue of art, but what about, I don't know if you asked, but I had asked him, and he, he, uh, this is, he required it to, you know, take an art which didn't, didn't have, didn't have full public confidence."},{"start":1514.33,"end":1516.35,"text":"And then phase three, he'll start, you know, the thing, the public don't think that he's got nothing."},{"start":1516.77,"end":1530.31,"text":"And they therefore are not confident that prices can't be held."},{"start":1530.33,"end":1531.13,"text":"It is not so much the rules of business."},{"start":1531.15,"end":1531.65,"text":"All of that bothers them."},{"start":1531.68,"end":1532.22,"text":"It's the control of prices."},{"start":1534.85,"end":1550.76,"text":"Which is, of course, different from a budget issue, but it's all part of the same."},{"start":1550.78,"end":1552.69,"text":"But the economic issue is that... Well, you know, I think we probably are in pretty good shape."},{"start":1552.71,"end":1553.27,"text":"I agree with George on that."},{"start":1553.29,"end":1553.85,"text":"The economic issue is not..."},{"start":1554.2,"end":1569.98,"text":"that's the price people care about that's the one thing"},{"start":1572.63,"end":1584.33,"text":"Well, I think one of the things you do is you do what you can substantively with that method."},{"start":1585.98,"end":1608.63,"text":"Then you have to wait for the results, and the results make time, which you won't wait for."},{"start":1608.65,"end":1611.6,"text":"But I think this thing that Brody's cranking up with this citizens' committee and all that, where you look like you're fighting to keep taxes down."},{"start":1611.62,"end":1613.74,"text":"It is fighting to keep prices down, sure, but it comes out as that you're trying to keep it under control."},{"start":1613.76,"end":1614.6,"text":"In other words, if we're on the offensive,"},{"start":1618.53,"end":1642,"text":"to approach a new minority as the enemy."},{"start":1642.02,"end":1645.77,"text":"It's a concern that we slip into, and we've talked about that, and we have, and we do, just in the course of events, slip into the thing of getting into institutionalizing our opposition."},{"start":1645.79,"end":1646.67,"text":"So it becomes us versus the Congress, right?"},{"start":1646.69,"end":1647.15,"text":"Or us versus the press."},{"start":1647.13,"end":1668.08,"text":"for us versus the academic community, whatever the enemy might be."},{"start":1668.1,"end":1671.42,"text":"He argues, likely, that we make a mistake that way because then we unite them and give the guy in Congress who wants to be with us a reason he ought to be against us."},{"start":1671.44,"end":1672.7,"text":"Or if he's shaky, he has a reason to rationalize his shakiness."},{"start":1672.72,"end":1674.64,"text":"I have to vote this way because I'm a member of Congress, so I have to be against the president."},{"start":1674.66,"end":1674.84,"text":"Whatever."},{"start":1675.38,"end":1687.11,"text":"We need to villainize individuals or segments and identify them and maintain them as a villain."},{"start":1688.31,"end":1706.82,"text":"key chairman on the Yale Kennedy and Hartke and so on, and there's key media types that we know who they are, that wrote these things."},{"start":1706.84,"end":1707.74,"text":"Media types, that's one argument we all have."},{"start":1707.76,"end":1709.66,"text":"Now they tend to find the kind of candidates that are likely to do well in a conservative time."},{"start":1709.68,"end":1710.12,"text":"Yeah, you're specific."},{"start":1710.14,"end":1710.92,"text":"In the mayoral time, they all schooled."},{"start":1718.62,"end":1745.47,"text":"I think the economic issue, this is what I was talking about before, there isn't a whole lot less crisis going on out there than in Jackson."},{"start":1746.54,"end":1768.82,"text":"three, the substance misuse, and that if you go down to a supermarket and say, I'm awfully worried about these hamburgers, the prices are not good, and you get people very excited about what you're doing, but it makes it worse."},{"start":1768.84,"end":1770.3,"text":"It just proves to them that they're going to have this kind of mentality."},{"start":1770.32,"end":1771.64,"text":"But we can't, there will be, we need to talk to a lawyer about it."},{"start":1774.81,"end":1789.75,"text":"and then they change."},{"start":1789.77,"end":1790.35,"text":"No, you know, don't go there."},{"start":1790.37,"end":1790.87,"text":"It's kind of fascinating."},{"start":1790.89,"end":1791.53,"text":"I think that's a good discovery."},{"start":1791.55,"end":1792.01,"text":"It's a damn good story."},{"start":1792.03,"end":1792.71,"text":"I can't find anything interesting."},{"start":1792.73,"end":1793.26,"text":"I don't think people care."},{"start":1793.91,"end":1808.49,"text":"So now you can open a trade-off."},{"start":1816.03,"end":1833.15,"text":"It's good for us to get positive that it's strong, there's no question about that, but it is important."},{"start":1833.17,"end":1834.05,"text":"Like the China announcement wasn't on there."},{"start":1834.07,"end":1834.99,"text":"The trip was, the trip was, they actually did."},{"start":1835.01,"end":1837.32,"text":"The end of the war didn't have the same effect as the POWs getting off the airplane, that's what actually happened."},{"start":1837.3,"end":1852.74,"text":"Thank you."},{"start":1853.9,"end":1878.77,"text":"It will have an effect because of the event factor tied to it, not because we get another song playing or all of a sudden everything is on the other hand."},{"start":1878.8,"end":1879.66,"text":"Those are good for the history of the tale."},{"start":1879.68,"end":1880.7,"text":"The fresh out of the hangar or something like that."},{"start":1880.72,"end":1881.48,"text":"You can never put an end to it anyway."},{"start":1883.82,"end":1902.54,"text":"In the event that you want to try to keep everybody happy or you want to make something out of the people that you're hanging out with, that's the point those guys need to be on."},{"start":1902.56,"end":1904.24,"text":"That's the first thing you want to do always is find a way to get yourself on there."},{"start":1904.26,"end":1904.9,"text":"That's what I'm trying to learn."},{"start":1904.92,"end":1905.74,"text":"I pray you can have a little bit of that."},{"start":1915.73,"end":1935.51,"text":"That is it."},{"start":1944.54,"end":1961.6,"text":"It came out pretty well."},{"start":1961.62,"end":1962.46,"text":"People said, well, wouldn't you want that?"},{"start":1962.48,"end":1963.79,"text":"Well, you've got to set up a control, a bureaucracy to police it."},{"start":1963.81,"end":1964.71,"text":"That's what the president doesn't want to do."},{"start":1964.73,"end":1965.93,"text":"He doesn't want to have a big bureaucracy running the thing."},{"start":1965.95,"end":1966.75,"text":"But I don't know how else you can do it."},{"start":1966.77,"end":1967.27,"text":"So even there, we keep..."},{"start":1968.52,"end":1991.24,"text":"In a sense, my argument for the opposite point made our point of one of the reasons that he's not the dealer."},{"start":1991.26,"end":1992.12,"text":"I don't know if I have this in front of me."},{"start":1992.14,"end":1992.68,"text":"There's a big gear on this."},{"start":1992.7,"end":1993.42,"text":"I don't know how else you can do it."},{"start":1993.44,"end":1994.31,"text":"I don't know if I have this in front of me."},{"start":1994.33,"end":1995.05,"text":"I don't know how else you can do it."},{"start":2000.88,"end":2017.8,"text":"Well, I wouldn't even tell her nothing, you know."},{"start":2017.82,"end":2018.28,"text":"Oh, I frankly wouldn't."},{"start":2018.3,"end":2018.4,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":2018.42,"end":2019.16,"text":"I wasn't thinking about the puncture."},{"start":2019.18,"end":2020.07,"text":"I was trying to adjust it to my full motion."},{"start":2020.09,"end":2022.47,"text":"I saw some of that going on, maybe because the curtains were closed on it, and it pulled back from the screen too late."},{"start":2022.49,"end":2023.31,"text":"I wasn't in the best of air, like I said."},{"start":2023.33,"end":2024.61,"text":"There was some bomb doors on it, and there was some depth in it."},{"start":2030.04,"end":2058.32,"text":"They won't say they shot him."},{"start":2058.34,"end":2058.82,"text":"They forced him to land."},{"start":2058.84,"end":2059.97,"text":"They forced him to land, but it wasn't even the landing."},{"start":2060.74,"end":2086.15,"text":"And that horse came with gunfire."},{"start":2086.17,"end":2087.67,"text":"Like my kids say, they didn't kick me when I kicked, they ran into my foot."},{"start":2087.69,"end":2089.39,"text":"That sapphire's gonna have to do the book, because Shelly's father got a fence plate."},{"start":2096.8,"end":2120.81,"text":"Whenever you're ready."},{"start":2120.83,"end":2120.91,"text":"Bye."},{"start":2120.93,"end":2121.2,"text":"I'll be back."},{"start":2121.22,"end":2121.3,"text":"Bye."},{"start":2121.32,"end":2121.74,"text":"What happened to you?"},{"start":2121.76,"end":2122.38,"text":"I wanted to tell you one thing."},{"start":2122.4,"end":2122.96,"text":"I just met a friend of mine."},{"start":2122.98,"end":2123.1,"text":"Right."},{"start":2123.12,"end":2123.6,"text":"I'm really close to him."},{"start":2123.62,"end":2124.08,"text":"I'm doing a buddy call."},{"start":2124.1,"end":2124.64,"text":"I've been friends with him."},{"start":2124.66,"end":2124.78,"text":"I see."},{"start":2124.8,"end":2124.92,"text":"Right."},{"start":2124.94,"end":2125.12,"text":"Yes, sir."},{"start":2125.14,"end":2126.08,"text":"He and Jordan Paul, I've been friends with him."},{"start":2133.86,"end":2163.75,"text":"I think it's a great thing, and I think most will believe that."},{"start":2164.84,"end":2188.21,"text":"I thought I was going to send a message, but I don't know if it's a Chinese one, but I thought I was going to send a message tonight, and to show from you that you've written a message, Sam."},{"start":2188.23,"end":2189.41,"text":"You're sending us a letter that's not an official document."},{"start":2189.43,"end":2190.84,"text":"You'd be willing to accept none of the words that you've written, Sam."},{"start":2190.86,"end":2192.18,"text":"Our next day will be through, and you're going to be on top of it."},{"start":2192.2,"end":2192.8,"text":"I'm going to stay by you, Sam."},{"start":2192.82,"end":2193.04,"text":"I love you."},{"start":2193.06,"end":2193.38,"text":"I love you, Sam."},{"start":2193.88,"end":2214.6,"text":"They would want that, because it's right here."},{"start":2214.62,"end":2215.8,"text":"Well, can you go over this, how people have seen it before?"},{"start":2215.82,"end":2217,"text":"We've been checking this, and I've read it was in the book."},{"start":2217.02,"end":2217.94,"text":"So, I'm just going to go ahead and check that."},{"start":2217.96,"end":2218.54,"text":"I was like, it's in the book."},{"start":2218.56,"end":2219.26,"text":"It's in the book, it's in the book."},{"start":2219.78,"end":2242.6,"text":"He's a good man."},{"start":2242.62,"end":2243.64,"text":"But I consider that McJoy's funding very important."},{"start":2243.66,"end":2244.56,"text":"I think it's a very good economic investment."},{"start":2246.06,"end":2264.35,"text":"Well, I thought it was starting to get amazing."},{"start":2264.37,"end":2264.95,"text":"Now, I'm getting ready to go."},{"start":2264.97,"end":2265.37,"text":"I'm going to see it."},{"start":2265.39,"end":2266.11,"text":"I'm going to push it all the way up."},{"start":2266.13,"end":2266.43,"text":"All the way up."},{"start":2266.45,"end":2266.75,"text":"All the way up."},{"start":2266.77,"end":2267.07,"text":"All the way up."},{"start":2267.09,"end":2267.39,"text":"All the way up."},{"start":2267.41,"end":2267.71,"text":"All the way up."},{"start":2267.73,"end":2268.03,"text":"All the way up."},{"start":2271.41,"end":2291.33,"text":"Right and the left."},{"start":2291.35,"end":2292.19,"text":"I'm going to leave it to people like that."},{"start":2292.21,"end":2294.39,"text":"COVID has to be really the, because we need the underneath support, the right to do that as well as the left."},{"start":2294.41,"end":2296.99,"text":"I had a talk with Dr. Adachi, you know, I had a talk yesterday with a professional through that, he said that we could, you know,"},{"start":2300.14,"end":2324.7,"text":"No, probably will."},{"start":2324.72,"end":2327.06,"text":"No, I said what if they get their troops out of Laos and capital and they get their troops out of Britain, of course."},{"start":2327.08,"end":2327.5,"text":"Oh, now, it went off."},{"start":2327.52,"end":2327.98,"text":"Well, it is what it is."},{"start":2328,"end":2328.34,"text":"It is what it is."},{"start":2328.36,"end":2328.7,"text":"It is what it is."},{"start":2329.37,"end":2353.02,"text":"Polish government has now threatened in the last United States to resume bombing."},{"start":2353.04,"end":2353.38,"text":"Oh, there you go."},{"start":2353.4,"end":2355.88,"text":"I was just thinking, the bomb is already gone, and that's why they're going to put a real wall up in it and stuff like that."},{"start":2355.9,"end":2356.16,"text":"Do they mind?"},{"start":2356.18,"end":2356.47,"text":"Good question."},{"start":2356.49,"end":2357.73,"text":"They're going to threaten whenever you insist on hitting them."},{"start":2357.75,"end":2358.41,"text":"I think they're going to be fine."},{"start":2358.43,"end":2358.87,"text":"I'd like to know that."},{"start":2358.89,"end":2359.11,"text":"Yeah, yeah."},{"start":2361.23,"end":2382.44,"text":"Oh, yeah."},{"start":2382.46,"end":2382.74,"text":"Casey is good."},{"start":2382.76,"end":2382.9,"text":"No, no."},{"start":2382.92,"end":2383.22,"text":"Porter is good."},{"start":2383.24,"end":2383.5,"text":"Rush is good."},{"start":2383.52,"end":2384.3,"text":"Casey, Porter, and Sullivan were there."},{"start":2384.32,"end":2384.86,"text":"They're playing a game now."},{"start":2384.88,"end":2386.44,"text":"Some of them, some of the reasons, but nevertheless, we've made them out well."},{"start":2386.46,"end":2387.32,"text":"We've been losing on the elbows over there."},{"start":2395.62,"end":2397.62,"text":"I have no answer."},{"start":2398.47,"end":2426.48,"text":"I want to look at this post and see if I can figure out what her problem is, if we have a problem with it."},{"start":2426.5,"end":2427.32,"text":"I get back to what happened after August."},{"start":2427.92,"end":2452.22,"text":"That's why I messaged you to try and rush out of the effort, you know, to try and make it look good because then it's all the worse and you build up."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and his advisors, including H. R. Haldeman and Henry Kissinger, held a wide-ranging meeting to discuss executive appointments, staff management, and domestic economic strategy. They specifically vetted candidates for the IRS, reviewed the organizational structure and personnel assignments for figures like Anne Armstrong, and strategized on maintaining public confidence in the face of inflation and price controls. Furthermore, Kissinger provided updates on diplomatic initiatives with the People's Republic of China, and the group analyzed the political impact of ongoing military developments in Laos and Cambodia.","topics":["Executive Appointments","Economic Policy","Inflation","White House Staff Management","Foreign Policy","People's Republic of China"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T18:47:32.122Z"},"topicSlugs":["executive-appointments","economic-policy","inflation","white-house-staff-management","foreign-policy","peoples-republic-of-china"],"audioDurationSec":2456,"audioFiles":[{"file":"413-017.mp3","bytes":15335424,"durationSec":2456.27,"bitrate":49947,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:46.738Z","findingAidSource":"nixonlibrary.gov subject log (2024-05), reslice-v2","findingAidUpdatedAt":"2026-09-18T08:43:36.020Z","transcriptGapSeconds":1469,"transcriptGapShare":0.6,"transcriptQuality":"incomplete","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/413-017.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/413-017","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/413/conversation-413-017","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). 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