Conversation 424-026

TapeTape 424StartThursday, March 29, 1973 at 10:50 AMEndThursday, March 29, 1973 at 10:50 AMParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President);  Ziegler, Ronald L.;  Kissinger, Henry A.Recording deviceOld Executive Office Building

On March 29, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon, Ronald L. Ziegler, and Henry A. Kissinger met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building at 10:50 am. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 424-026 of the White House Tapes.

Conversation No. 424-26

Date: March 29, 1973
Time: 10:50 am
Location: Executive Office Building

The President met with Ronald L. Ziegler and Henry A. Kissinger.

       President’s address
             -Announcement
                   -Release of prisoners of war [POWs]
                   -Foreign policy and domestic issues
                   -Briefing of press by George P. Shultz
                   -Press reaction
             -Ziegler's comments

Ronald Ziegler left at 10:55 am.

       House Foreign Affairs Committee
            -Meeting with Kissinger


*****************************************************************

             -Cambodia bombing
                 -Questions for Kissinger
                       -Donald M. Fraser [?]
                             -War powers
                                     -23-

            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                               Tape Subject Log
                                (rev. Aug.-2010)
                                                   Conversation No. 424-26 (cont’d)


                  -Kissinger’s answers
            -Authority
                  -Peace agreement
                        -Article 20
       -North Vietnam
            -Aid
                  -H. Ross Perot’s position
       -Cambodia
            -Questions
                  -President’s opponents
                        -Charles C. Diggs
                        -Fraser
                        -Jonathan B. Bingham

President’s address
      -Text of speech
            -US troop withdrawal
            -Peace agreement
                  -Missing in action [MIA]
                  -Laos, Cambodia
                       -Infiltration
                  -Compliance
                       -North Vietnam

Laos
       -Bombing

President’s address
      -Support for President

Watergate
     -Impact on administration
     -John N. Mitchell
           -Loyalty
           -Martha (Bealle) Mitchell [?]
           -Involvement with break-in [?]
                 -Culpability
                       -Incarceration
     -President’s speech
           -Public acceptance
                                    -24-

          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                             Tape Subject Log
                              (rev. Aug.-2010)
                                                     Conversation No. 424-26 (cont’d)


    -President’s response
          -Morality [?]
                -Comparison with divorces
                      -Divorce lawyers
          -Kissinger’s recommendation
                -Removal of John W. Dean, III [?]
    -Dean
          -Involvement with break-in
          -Role in defense of burglars
          -Role as lawyer
          -White House Counsel
                -Access to Federal Bureau of Investigation [FBI] reports
                      -Inappropriateness [?]
    -Bugging
    -Daniel Ellsburg break-in [?]
          -National security justification
    -Public reactions
          -President’s speech
          -President’s stature
    -Lyndon B. Johnson scandals
          -Robert D. (“Bobby”) Baker
          -Walter Jenkins
          -1964 election
                -Margin of victory
    -Press exaggeration
          -Comparison with Truman and Johnson cases
    - Committee to Re-elect the President [CRP]
          -Lack of control
                -President’s responsibilities
                      -May 8, 1972 decision
                      -1972 Moscow summit
                      -Lack of contact with Mitchell
    -Break-in
          -Intentions
          -Results
          -Dean’s involvement
                -Handling of investigation [?]

Vietnam settlement
     -Cambodia bombing
                                     -25-

           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                              Tape Subject Log
                               (rev. Aug.-2010)
                                                      Conversation No. 424-26 (cont’d)


           -Congressional reaction
                 -President’s powers
                 -Cut off of funding
           -Survival of Cambodia
                 -Blaming Congress
                 -Unlikelihood
                 -Negotiations
                 -Trip by Alexander M. Haig, Jr.
     -President’s opponents
           -Bureaucracy
                 -India-Pakistan War of 1971
           -US withdrawal
           -Peace with honor
           -Bugging out
           -George S. McGovern
     -Duration
           -1974 election

Soviet Union
     -Supplies to North Vietnam
            -Leonid I. Brezhnev’s veracity
     -Future summit
            -Timms
            -Agreement on the Prevention of Nuclear War
                   -New version
     -Kissinger’s talk with President
     -Infiltration from North Vietnam
            -Cessation

People’s Republic of China [PRC]
     -Visit by Kissinger
     -Visit by Chou En-Lai
           -Arrangements
     -Visit by President

France
     -Meeting with President
          -Montenegro
                -President’s knowledge of geography
          -Martinique
                                               -26-

                    NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                       Tape Subject Log
                                        (rev. Aug.-2010)
                                                                Conversation No. 424-26 (cont’d)


                          -Caribbean Sea

       Joint statement with Great Britain
              -State visit by [Elizabeth, Queen of England] Elizabeth II
                    -Discussion with Edward M. Heath
                    -1976 Bicentennial
                    -Protocol
                           -Ceremony

       President’s schedule
             -Meetings with Great Britain, France
                   -International economic policy
                         -Charter
                         -Atlantic countries
                         -Japan
                         -Possible progress

       Cambodia
           -Support for President
                -House Foreign Affairs Committee
           -Compared with Vietnam negotiations

Kissinger left at 11:10 am.

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

What I hope to say, now that the call to appeal has taken place, I'm sure that the court will take the pressure off the rest of the nation.
yeah that's right that's
We have to assemble them.
We have to know that they should be there.
Okay.
What else?
Oh, sure.
If you did, it would be a week.
If you're not, it would be 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 51, 52, 53, 52, 53, 52, 53, 52, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53, 53
Yeah, I think I've been waiting for that.
I've been waiting.
Yeah, as soon as they get to their network base, they're going to be able to read it.
It doesn't make it much easier when they're on top of it.
It's kind of easy.
They'll hide below it.
Okay, now I'll .
I'm not going to do it.
I just don't say anything.
Right, right, right.
I meant to get us going to the city, but we've been sitting here a long time.
I thought he was going away.
Now I've never heard it from anybody.
That's the way it is.
Well, I think we would have helped, but that wasn't central to the retreat.
Well, I think we would have helped, but that wasn't central to the retreat.
Well, I think we would have helped, but that wasn't central to the retreat.
Well, I think we would have helped, but that wasn't central to the retreat.
Well, I think we would have helped, but that wasn't central to the retreat.
So we had talked about it once and we had talked about it a second time.
You can say that where I can't see it.
I said technically it may be true that if this president would be in school, he would be so confident that he would be as positive as we could.
And he's not one in any group to say no.
We are not talking about a no vote.
and in which whatever the president is doing is the outgrowth of whatever got a chance at that vote and in other words we don't intend to part further to keep it on the agreement is that what we do?
that's what we do we have a full technology for 20 of those seats and I want you to generally consider what position you have in the first thing and then the other three on that issue
I said, what was it?
What are we going to do?
We don't have any other choice.
We don't give an advantage to the United States.
How can we do that for our country?
Well, about five guys got out of it, pulled away on it.
Gross, on eight, so to speak, got pulled away on it, on this position.
What about the Cambodian?
On the Cambodian thing, you see, of course, I can't judge.
It turned out, I was really irritated.
I would have hard sessions like all of them, each single one.
So I'd block you for a second and they'd all give me a different situation.
I would remember the business that you guys did for us.
And I'd be careful about it.
If it wasn't very easy, if it wasn't amazing for you, then I'd be surprised if I haven't met you.
That's right.
That's coming along.
The rest of the people are still there.
The rest of the people are only there.
To Taiwan, it should take us at least an hour to go there and try to take the train to China.
Again, I would be very grateful if I had this little drive with me for that.
The plane is on the third-hand side of your corner, and on the right-hand side of the train.
I don't know exactly what I said there.
It's a pay grade that's required.
The leaders of R.V.I.
have no doubt that there are consequences if they do not comply with the rules.
No, no, no, no.
No, that's not true.
No, that's not true.
Mr. President, I don't have anything to add to your point.
I can do this.
I want to do it.
I understand.
I understand.
We better do it.
After the speech.
The speech isn't going to be one three minutes.
When he started to say we're a country, not a country, I'm saying we're a country.
I know there are lots of good people out there, but I think the subject is this.
When we meet, you know, Dr. Boyd, he's an honest man.
I like to ask you, Dave, that this is a one-way street.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know.
Well, it's a horrible story.
John was all kind of a filthy asshole.
You know, I say this for the jail.
That's why I don't go to jail.
That's why I don't go to jail.
That's why I don't go to jail.
I don't know why it's a little different there.
You know what I'm going to do?
After the divorce, I'm going to tell you.
I'm going to tell you.
I'm going to tell you.
I'm going to tell you.
I'm going to tell you.
I'm going to tell you.
I'm going to tell you.
I'm going to tell you.
I'm going to tell you.
I'm going to tell you.
And it's my, my own idea.
I think that one of his methods would have, would have been more than any of those proposals.
I can't imagine his government would have, he shouldn't be accepting much out of his prime.
He laughed at this.
I mean, so he did.
No, no, no, he didn't.
Actually, he had nothing to do with it.
What did he say?
No, I'm just worried that he might have it.
It's a simple thing that people can say.
He masterminded it exactly.
The first was supposed to be a lawyer.
Why is the drug so expensive to get an FBI report?
I think you know what they're talking about in terms of the.
So they're talking about.
But that was national security.
It was independent, I think.
It's been hard for me, or I've been trying for it, to write this goddamn speech.
I have the impression, because I deal with the masses of people, I get 100% of the people, because I choose to not forget.
But I think it's really important that I always talk
It doesn't do it, however, to come and take Johnson.
Johnson, after Bobby Baker, he's supposed to run for the town.
Everybody thinks that Johnson is going to come with Matthew, and I think he's going to run for the town.
I don't think he's going to come.
I don't think he's going to come.
I don't think he's going to come.
I don't think he's going to come.
I don't think he's going to come.
But after that, I was still elected.
Now, true, this is the new party that I'm in.
I should pay for this case.
I heard that what I had for you is that I have to hear it.
That's what I had in mind.
That's what I wrote to you about.
That's my opinion.
And, and it's kind of the same, uh, uh, that Gary's going to look for.
What if you're going to cover just a day?
I don't know, probably about a week, about a week, about a week.
And so, and so, to that feeling, you know, later on, you heard, uh, some, I don't know, a couple other things.
You probably haven't heard any of the statements you've said.
The press did a lot of it on this case.
I didn't have a slightest idea.
I didn't mean to break your connection.
I thought you got to respond to God.
You see, I work with Charger and Charger, and I'm a great builder.
That's my point.
I mean, everybody works without that, sure.
Actually, I mean, it's because we've been operating in that situation.
And we will continue to do that.
We know that it's possible to make a disclosure of something in that situation.
But it's not that way.
But I don't, I'm sure.
But these are the things, I think.
Well, they're all, they're all, yeah.
Well, let me ask you this one.
If you can't vote, you've got to get to the bottom of that.
Like I said, when the Congress takes away the power, what is the deal there?
How so that they put all of our money?
I know, I know, we can blame that for the whole thing, but it's a different situation.
It's a different situation.
It's true.
It's different.
It's different.
It's different.
It's different.
It's different.
Well, I think we should, well, we can't make a deal if we could, but I would recommend it strongly.
I think we all just have to pay for some of the other things next week, the things we're looking at.
We could be, we could be a big... Well, I, I, I would fix it this, this, this, right now.
Right now.
We've got to, we've got to, we've got to, we've got to do it.
The bureaucracy of Vietnam is now as bad as it was in India about this time.
They just want to get out.
Yeah, but they don't understand that our whole political system is now a party.
By November, your opponents can say, all this talk about peace with Vietnam was just this way of running out, and the government will make one such decision after I'm gone.
If we can get through the 74th election, and we throw peace with Vietnam in the 75th of September,
Under six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, three, four, five, six, seven
I wonder if they, I want to show the tree.
I want to get your name.
No, no.
I can do it.
I'm cool with it.
That's really cool.
That's really cool.
That's really cool.
Let's have a drink.
I'm right.
Please build it up.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
All right.
you know, the green, the better, the smaller, the bigger, that's true.
So what's your practice?
I know what your practice is.
I know what your practice is.
You know, if there's a gobbledygook around, you screw it on the wood, you're gonna have everything.
Everything.
Everything.
Uh, uh, and you know they expect me to count it as something that's good, but I think that they'll have it because I can't ask them to put it in a boat.
I kind of know what they're talking about with this boat.
Sure.
Okay, but I'll let you know.
I usually love to walk up to the president and tell him, okay, we're going to switch the stage, raise standards with our allies and so forth, but we're doing this so that's a great program, that's a great protocol.
I've had to have things on the code, that's here, and it's been so great to set us up.
I don't like that, but that's what I'm trying to do.
That's what I'm trying to do.
My idea with the Chinese is that I go there and out of that go to the United States, which O.D.
is.
I don't think you can go back next year.
I don't think you can go back next year.
And it's okay if you go to the United States.
This year, if you go to the United States, it's better for me.
We should come here this October.
I want that conversation later.
I thought I'd stop talking about that.
Talk to the trash that's bothering the idea.
On the neighborhood.
Where?
I don't know where my neighborhood is.
Marketing.
What I'd like to do with the bridge station is, I'd like to make the bridge station
And I want to please state that this is such a sick year.
I told the cop that I was waiting on that day, and he was being more and more.
You see, I think, I was intending to have the queen here, but we got smashed.
I think that's good.
They want you to stay out of this.
If you would stay, but if others do anything wrong, they have a better chance to throw themselves on the floor in the tree for days.
Yeah.
You have good eyes and all that kind of stupid thing.
Of course.
That's a great thing to do.
Okay, we can find that in August.
I mean, next year we can have that.
But I have the impression now I've talked to the British and to the French.
I think we could wind up this year.
They've got involved with the Charter for the Atlantic World, including Japan, which could be a real flash for both economic defense and foreign policy.
And that's what we're hoping to do for all of us.
You want me to mention the fact that these people, these people, they can't find me.
It's essential.
It's essential to have approval.
You don't think that's not...
I don't know whether or not I regret it if the Foreign Affairs Committee is the president, but I have to...
I've been in some of the sessions.
I don't think it's not a terrible decision.