{"conversationCode":"429-005","tapeNumber":429,"conversationNumber":5,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-429-005","startDateTime":"1973-04-19T18:45:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1973-04-19T18:46:00.000Z","startDate":"19-Apr-1973","startTime":"1:45 PM","endDate":"19-Apr-1973","endTime":"1:46 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Ziegler, Ronald L.;","description":"On April 19, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon and Ronald L. Ziegler met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building from 1:45 pm to 1:46 pm. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 429-005 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"EOB","recordingDevice":"Old Executive Office Building","latitudeEstimated":38.897567,"longitudeEstimated":-77.039147,"chronCode":"5.5","chronRelease":"Fifth Chronological Release: Part V","chronReleaseDate":"21-Aug-2013","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 429-005\n\nDate: April 19, 1973\nTime: 1:45 pm - 1:46 pm\nLocation: Executive Office Building\n\nThe President talked with Ronald L. Ziegler.\n\n[See Conversation No. 038-111]","filename":["429-005.mp3"],"tapeStart":"","tapeEnd":"","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Ziegler, Ronald L."],"prevCode":"429-004","nextCode":"429-006","transcript":[{"start":0.18,"end":19.19,"text":"I couldn't say even that this is true."},{"start":19.21,"end":20.07,"text":"I had the President direct it specifically."},{"start":20.09,"end":22.87,"text":"He was not to give a report from the Grand Jury."},{"start":22.89,"end":24.86,"text":"I don't mean to tell you to do this, Jack Anderson, but that may taint this Grand Jury."},{"start":24.88,"end":26.22,"text":"I don't mean to say that I have directed this, which is true."},{"start":26.24,"end":27.44,"text":"I've told you to don't tell me anything from the Grand Jury."},{"start":28.25,"end":43.07,"text":"That's the point."},{"start":43.09,"end":43.21,"text":"I did."},{"start":43.23,"end":43.63,"text":"He'll tell you that."},{"start":43.65,"end":45.45,"text":"I said, Andrew, don't you do anything with the director."},{"start":45.47,"end":45.89,"text":"I don't want to know."},{"start":45.91,"end":46.45,"text":"I don't want to mess it up."},{"start":46.47,"end":47.73,"text":"You see, in my direction, he only gives me other investigators."},{"start":47.76,"end":49.16,"text":"But my own personal investigation will go over the facts and so forth."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and Press Secretary Ronald Ziegler discuss the need to maintain a clear firewall between the White House and ongoing Grand Jury proceedings to avoid potential legal contamination. Nixon emphasizes that he explicitly instructed officials not to disclose any Grand Jury findings to him to preserve the integrity of both the official investigation and his own internal review. The discussion underscores the administration's strategic effort to distance the President from sensitive information during the escalating Watergate investigation.","topics":["Watergate scandal","Grand Jury","Obstruction of justice","Executive privilege","Internal investigation"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T19:37:04.976Z"},"topicSlugs":["watergate-scandal","grand-jury","obstruction-of-justice","executive-privilege","internal-investigation"],"audioDurationSec":55,"audioFiles":[{"file":"429-005.mp3","bytes":1777664,"durationSec":55.43,"bitrate":256578,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:20:04.104Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/429-005.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/429-005","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/429/conversation-429-005","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}